How many people have welded an external wastegate flange onto an hf mani?
12-18-2004, 11:50 PM
#1
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How many people have welded an external wastegate flange onto an hf mani?
I just got mine done today by a very reputable welder around my area and so far it is working out great. I got sick of my damn internal wastegate always creeping and not working right at all. The welder said he had to braise it...I guess this is different than normal welding and needs to be done when welding steel to cast iron.
12-19-2004, 04:56 PM
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Re: How many people have welded an external wastegate flange onto an hf mani? (SOHC_MShue)
Brazing means he didn't weld the two metals together, but "glued" one to the other using a metal with a lower melting point.
You CAN weld steel to cast iron, but you need to use a filler with a high content of Nickel, and you need to pre-heat / post-heat the cast iron.
You CAN weld steel to cast iron, but you need to use a filler with a high content of Nickel, and you need to pre-heat / post-heat the cast iron.
12-19-2004, 05:19 PM
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Re: How many people have welded an external wastegate flange onto an hf mani? (Agtronic)
I have welded 2 wastegate flanges to 2 dsm manifolds (cast iron) and a fews egt bungs with my mig welder. I haven't had any problems with them. I will post a pic of it when it stops snowing outside.
12-19-2004, 11:07 PM
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Re: How many people have welded an external wastegate flange onto an hf mani? (brryder)
nice i'd like to see some pics. I will post some pics as soon as i get my digi cam...which will be on xmas 
12-20-2004, 05:07 AM
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Re: How many people have welded an external wastegate flange onto an hf mani? (SOHC_MShue)
I'd like to see this also. I have an HF mani and would like to run an external wastegate.
12-20-2004, 12:12 PM
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ive welded mild steel turbo flanges onto cut D series 4-1 manifolds. all scale has to be ground down to shiny metal, cleaned with acetone inside and out. must be evenly preheated in an oven, i went to 350ish. then tacked often. metal cools pretty fast so i keep going back in the oven. used nyrod 99 which has high nickel content as mentioned above. i put ontop the woodstove for cooling and just let the fire go out. welded inside and out btw.
try not to let the arc soak too long or to stitch alot. several straight passes if you hafta fill gap, but preparing with the smallest gap would be best. i believe you want minimal admixture but am forgetting what ive read. ask engloid.
try not to let the arc soak too long or to stitch alot. several straight passes if you hafta fill gap, but preparing with the smallest gap would be best. i believe you want minimal admixture but am forgetting what ive read. ask engloid.
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12-20-2004, 12:14 PM
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btw.. hf manifold cant hold a candle to a sedan/SI manifold as far as design. hf is very restrictive. runner 1 and 4 directly oppose each other. the sedan manifold has larger, straighter runners, a much better merge and a decent area to place external gate.
12-25-2004, 05:13 PM
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Re: (mike_belben@yahoo.com)
Here is the pic of mine. I just cleaned it and welded it with my mig wellder. I have welded a few egt bungs and another w/g flange
I will take better pics tomorow
I will take better pics tomorow
12-25-2004, 05:43 PM
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Re:
The word "must" is used in a few places in this thread that it shouldn't. For example, when talking about preheat and postheat.
Cast is one word, but can be nearly anything. Some cast is good strong metal, and others are junk. I weld cast aluminum on a regular basis, without preheat or postheat. I have personally only encountered one piece of cast steel that I couldn't weld without preheat and postheat...and even it couldn't be welded with preheat and postheat. It was a rear stump housing for a Ford pickup truck. The metal was like a sponge, more holes and pores than metal. It would crack in several places, when I was welding in another. Every other piece of cast I've encountered, I welded successfully without preheat or postheat.
I like NI99 tig wire.
Also, I'd reccomend cleaning with alcohol instead of acetone. Acetone actually leaves a residue. Also consider that any cleaning agent put on cast will usually soak into the metal.
Oh, and it is BRAZE, not braise. I really don't think anybody would want to braise a manifold.
<U>braise: </U> tr.v. braised, brais·ing, brais·es
To cook (meat or vegetables) by browning in fat, then simmering in a small quantity of liquid in a covered container.
The analogy of glueing rather than welding is correct. It's basically the same concept as sweating or soldering copper pipe for plumbing.
Cast is one word, but can be nearly anything. Some cast is good strong metal, and others are junk. I weld cast aluminum on a regular basis, without preheat or postheat. I have personally only encountered one piece of cast steel that I couldn't weld without preheat and postheat...and even it couldn't be welded with preheat and postheat. It was a rear stump housing for a Ford pickup truck. The metal was like a sponge, more holes and pores than metal. It would crack in several places, when I was welding in another. Every other piece of cast I've encountered, I welded successfully without preheat or postheat.
I like NI99 tig wire.
Also, I'd reccomend cleaning with alcohol instead of acetone. Acetone actually leaves a residue. Also consider that any cleaning agent put on cast will usually soak into the metal.
Oh, and it is BRAZE, not braise. I really don't think anybody would want to braise a manifold.
<U>braise: </U> tr.v. braised, brais·ing, brais·es
To cook (meat or vegetables) by browning in fat, then simmering in a small quantity of liquid in a covered container.
The analogy of glueing rather than welding is correct. It's basically the same concept as sweating or soldering copper pipe for plumbing.
12-26-2004, 08:06 AM
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Re: Re: (Engloid)
I'm going to mig weld a wastegate flange onto my manifold. I've read that I should use stainless wire, is this correct? Any other advice? I've welded steel pipe to my cast turbo outlet using mild steel wire and no pre/post heat with no issues for 5k miles. Want to do it right on the manifold though.
01-03-2005, 05:22 PM
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Re: Re: (@irborne)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by @irborne »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i have mig weld adapters for wastegate and turbo adapter onto cast manifolds several times, and it held up nicely without preheat or postheat</TD></TR></TABLE>
you guys really need to stop mig welding cast iron. It doesn't hold up. Either stick weld it with the right rod with pre/post heat, braze it, or tig it with your choice of a high nickel rod. Mig will crack cast in almost all situations, i have seen very few hold up, they cause spider cracks most of the time.
you guys really need to stop mig welding cast iron. It doesn't hold up. Either stick weld it with the right rod with pre/post heat, braze it, or tig it with your choice of a high nickel rod. Mig will crack cast in almost all situations, i have seen very few hold up, they cause spider cracks most of the time.
01-03-2005, 05:55 PM
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Re: (.nate)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .nate »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Can you get a pic from the side? All I see is a big TiAL wastegate 
</TD></TR></TABLE>
i'll try to snap a few pics from the side tonight.
</TD></TR></TABLE>i'll try to snap a few pics from the side tonight.
01-03-2005, 06:55 PM
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Re: (SOHC_MShue)
I've tig welded about 20 to 30 waste gates to dsm manifolds and never had any fall off, some have been on the road for years now. i don't weld for a living(but it is part of my job description) and in my opinion that tial is going to fall off sooner or later.like Agtronic said it is just basically glued on.
01-03-2005, 08:22 PM
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Re: (SOHC_MShue)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SOHC_MShue »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
i'll try to snap a few pics from the side tonight. </TD></TR></TABLE>
i want to see this, hey sohc_mshue check your PM
i'll try to snap a few pics from the side tonight.
</TD></TR></TABLE>i want to see this, hey sohc_mshue check your PM
01-05-2005, 08:28 PM
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Re: (shortyz)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by shortyz »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">will that braze hold up to the temps?</TD></TR></TABLE>
not likely
not likely