vectorsolid

rear down tube x-braces.


I'm to old for this....


rear pads and main hoop. I'd like to figure out a clever way to gusset this more and tie in the sill plates.

vectorsolid

I'd have liked to run a a tube between the shock towers in the rear, but they consider that a performance improvement and it adds value.


seat mounts, done for now. Way stronger than what was in the car.

Tim2179

iTrader: (2)

I wouldn't rule it out, although I'm not that familiar w/the amount of power you can get out of a D. I've seen lots of LS B's making power in CC and Lemons. I bring it up b/c the majority of the D-powered Hondas I've raced with get smoked out on track. Then again, I'm running a turbo'd DSM.

Nice looking build so far. Good luck.

vectorsolid

Putting the Halo bar further forward makes welding the A-pillar bars a LOT easier. Give it some consideration when you design.


plate welded to floor.


Brought the A-pillar floor pads and mount closer to the sill and plated the sill. Could be better, I'm gonna work on this.


We were thinking it would be awesome if we made a cockpit style cover in the interior. Never gonna happen, but it was a fun idea. Look for the red writing on the cardboard...

vectorsolid

I "REALLY" want to put this plate with the speed holes on the car. But it's considered a point of attachment for the cage, as it's longer than 6". And it's only 20 gauge, it's largely cosmetic. We probably won't get to run them, but MAN, do they increase the Baller value of the car.


To decrease punch through of the floor pads, the sill bar that connects the main hoop with the A-pillar is actually resting on the sill. It will get welded to sill. now for the pads to push through the floor, you have to push the sill with it. Much stronger.


Trying to figure out how to make the pads and pillar bars more structural rather than just the floor as others have mentioned. Came up with this idea to tie them in. this is better. Not perfect, but better.



I just noticed I forgot a weld. I'll get that tonight.

vectorsolid

working on the Nascar bars. Couldn't figure out where the first one should be (height wise from the ground). I decided that there is probably some universal industry standard for bumper heights. So I measured to the center of the front crash bar, right at 21" so that's where I put the first bar, 21". I figure the car is prolly 3-4" to high right now, so by the time we lower it down, be right even with everybody else that's lowered down. an Impact should hit mostly on the center of the 3 bars. That's my theory. next one (the top bar), likely in the 7-8" range above this one. just about under the door latch.



from the top, looking down.

-RedneckDave-

Looking good bro. Should turn out pretty awesome and I am sure the event will be great.

Billy Elliot

I need to get pictures of my cage feet on my rally civic. It's a bit unique and the bars are actually welded into the sill. Works in rally cage building but not sure on the legality for a road race cage.

How much value does it add? It's only a new $$ in tube costs?

I would consider it if they allowed halo bars for rally. Again, we have additional cage requirements. We need to have continuous a-pillar bars on the car. A rally car cage can meet road race/drag requirements but not all road/drag cages can meet rally requirements.

vectorsolid

It's not the value of the tube I'm worried about. In the CHUMP series, they consider things like that to add "Competition Value" to your car. If you cross the a certain dollar level, they deduct laps as penalty. If it turned out it was a 10 lap penalty, it might not be worth it. Gotta weigh those options.

and I know the shock tower tie in is a hit on the Competition Value. Based on this design and the triangulation, I think it's as good as it can be, given that it's all the bars they allow us back there (4 bars).

Billy Elliot

Didn't we have this discussion in another thread that the best solution was one bar to tie the shock towers, one diagonal between the two rear stays? I would email them and ask what the value of the bar is if you add it. I seriously don't get why they're all bent out over something like this. Yes, it adds performance, but not as much as the guy who can CNC machine his head for free under the rules because labor is free...

Or, just pre-cut a bar to size, go through tech and then weld it in before the start of the race? I have seen so much B.S. that goes on after cars go through LeMons tech. Dudes with a "spare" suspensions that are nice and fresh looking, spare motor/trans just chilling on a crate. One guy had a complete daily driver that he brought as a parts car that they were pulling parts off of during the race.

Gets even worse when you have an event under rain and someone can tarp off their whole tent while they are working on the car and pretty much do anything to the car without spying eyes.

miamirice

I find it hilarious the lengths people go to.

vectorsolid

True.

Good news is, it's our first event with the CHUMPS. I have no preconceived thoughts on winning. that takes a LOT of pressure off. I just want our guys to have a good time, drive in heavy traffic and have a good time. The NEXT RACE though... then we try.

Billy Elliot

Yeah we went out both times with a "let's finish" attitude. We pretty much went with minimal spares, came in on a tow dolly and had one pop up tent.

Then when you see the guys with fully enclosed trailers pulled by the F-350 dually that have 10k watt generators to power their dual HD flatscreens that are watching two feeds of sat TV and inside the trailer you see a whole wall of spare parts and/or spare car.

We had a 1990 protege and bent an LCA when a guy hit us. We went to the team who had an escort (same chassis as the protege) and asked if they had a spare LCA we could borrow/buy. I could see one on their wall of spares earlier when we walked by in their 50' trailer with "FORD RACING" all on the side and they just responded, "No, we don't have a spare for it."

I can understand a "we have a spare, but only one so we'd rather not give it out." But to lie about it with a bad poker face is just rude...

It's sad but true in a "budget" racing like this that is so hard to police. All the policing at a LeMons event is done by the competitors and you're, more or less, basing it off of your performance comparison to your own car.

I have a bad feeling when I get to race, because I'm legitimately building a B16 gears with a 4.9 final drive for my LeMons/Chump car and I would really hate if we end up getting the people's curse because people will be mad that I'm changing three gears as I pass them on the straight while they're still in 3rd.

vectorsolid

Crowd thinking a YZ125 was in the race. Maxed out at 85mph in 120 feet. ...lol...

miamirice

Good luck

I have done 7 weekends and have nothing but great experience with it. It's certainly a creative mechanics paradise. The know how of so many people blows me away. At 24 hours of PBIR there was a crown Vic with a truck body mounted on backwards. His chrome tail pipes were the brake duct intakes. After 7 hours seat time I was losing my mind driving up behind him and seeing that thing going backwards.

vectorsolid

lol

We might be in big trouble, I'm an average mechanic...

7 weekends? DAAAMMMN, got Richard Petty up in here!

I can't imagine what we'll know by the time we get that much race time under our belts. We'll probably be all jaded and bitter by then. HA!

vectorsolid

Radio stuff is starting to arrive. Gonna try the inexpensive Puxing radios. Our man Troy Hogan got us the hookup. I'm trusting his judgement and knowledge (which is pretty extensive). to go all Motorola was $1200-$1800. We got this all put together for $600. 3 radios, 2 crew headsets, 4 helmet kits, external antenna for the car, push to talk button for the steering wheel, and 12 volt adapters so we can wire them in and not have the batterys go dead.

Waiting on helmet kits, and car antenna.

drove around with one in my truck, through average neighborhood terrain. the fewer hills the better, was fairly decent reception at about 1.2 miles. That's all the further we went, would go further. Hills mess with it. UHF is line of site. they ain't kidding.

(radio static)...Red fox leader this is bomber one requesting clearance to pick up a 64 ounce soda and a doughnut... (static) Roger that, Bomber one, you are clear on the doughnut, over...(static)...

Great fun, felt like a kid.

Billy Elliot

That's not bad for $600 for 3 radios, 2 crew headsets, 4 helmet kits, external antenna for the car, push to talk button. My rally car intercom has an input/output for a handheld. In rally we use HAM to run events and some competitors get the licenses to broadcast from the car and/or listen in on the radio. But it's around a $200 intercom, $100 each headset to retrofit into a helmet (you really only need 2 but ALWAYS bring spares), then you'd still need the radios/antenna for the car. So your deal worked out pretty good.

We used short wave hand-held radios at our first LeMons event (1/2 mile oval) and obvioulsy no issues with range. We just zip tied the radio to the center of the steering wheel. Worked fine for me since I had an open face helmet (they allowed them at the time) so they could actually hear me and I could hear them. However, the next year they banned open face helmets and hand-held radios. We showed up and found out they didn't seem to care about the radios as a bunch of teams were running the zip-tie to the wheel method so after tech we just put ours on as well. The hand held radios were nice, but it's a good thing you got the helmet radio setup. Being able to actually hear the crew and driver is awesome. Can definitly help with the race to give updates to the driver.

Oh, an off comment about LeMons/Chump, make fuel/driver changes on full course cautions so you lose the least ammount of time. It seems common sense, but we didn't realize that in the heat of the moment at our first race until we wondered how guys were jumping us in the race order when we were faster/passing them all the time on track.

The stuff that takes the longest time will be your driver changes and fuel stops. You can really catch up to guys by making fast pit stops, so practice the hell out of them with the team. I know LeMons limits you to 5 gallon jugs because race teams like Pratt and Miller were bringing full rigs they use for their ALMS/LeMans Corvette to fuel on pit stops. But you can modify the 5 gallon jugs to fill quicker by putting larger vent holes.

greenmadness

That thing was awsome, we travled down for the new years race at PBIR and that was there.

we were there for the wedding and to shake down an STU civic which everyone kept trying to vote peoples curse.


To clarify for Bill,

Lemons does (or at least did) free labor, cost of materials only...

CHUMP does not... they asses the actual added value to the car, regardless of how it was acheived. so it would not be cost of tubing, rather the "added value" of a welded rear shock tower brace which they may think is $100

Billy Elliot

Did LeMons take out the free labor part?

I know Chump is a lot better at giving actual asessments of cars and their rules. Their brake rules for example are open but not 100% free. In LeMons you could show up with some 6 piston AP brake setup and still be legal under the rules.

greenmadness

I dont know if they did or not,

my team entered 1 car in lemons and crewed at PBIR, after that we went chump and have been happily since. although we entered the lamest day of nelson for lemons which was over 100 cars on a 2mi track.. so what i saw from lemons may not be an accurate depiction on tech procedures.

Tim2179

iTrader: (2)

It really depends on week to week kind of thing. It's not always consistent. Last year, Lemons was questioning if our turbo was stock and if the Fluidyne radiator was OEM (it was on the car when we bought it). This race I was at last weekend, Phil didn't even pop the hood. Must have caught him on a good day.

Billy Elliot

I was at the same Lamest Day at Nelson Ledges. It was 120 cars haha. That was a giant mess. It seemed like we spent half the race under yellow flags...

I honestly think LeMons is just out for profit while Chump is actually looking to provide good racing.

vectorsolid

Drivers door is done. Started on the passenger sill bar. Wanted to get that lined up on the money. Now I can weld it to the sill. Less risk of cage punch through now. WHOOHOO. now I can finally measure the opening and order a net! All the extra tubing, only added about 5 pounds. I'm happy with that.

interior on the squares is about 7x7.







Mig.

vectorsolid

passenger sill bar, so now chassis will be 2013 Chump car compliant. Gonna run some beads on it, front and back side. Touching the pinch weld it's full length, and resting on the sill.