crower

good day, just want to ask your opinions and experiences. I am planning on installing a 1.5way kaaz lsd on my b series eg which I will be running on autocross events. My previous setup was type r helical lsd and I am planning on switching to a 1.5way. Is it advisable considering that it locks up on turns?thanks guys

Pompiuses

https://honda-tech.com/forums/showpo...9&postcount=26

10cjennings

iTrader: (1)

No experience with a 1.5 way here, but wouldn't that just result in the car pushing more off power vs a 1 way? Why would that be preferable to a 1 way in an FF car?

Black R

1.5 way ATS metal here.

I haven't found anything better - or noisier!

Aquafina

iTrader: (3)

1.0 way. A 1.5 will make it understeer with no other changes to the car.

Todd00

Not in my experience. I went from a 1way OEM ITR to a 1.5way ATS and the difference was absolutely astonishing. If anything it made the car oversteer more as it pulled me through the corner that much better.

Basically, it completely got rid of any corner push that I had.

10cjennings

iTrader: (1)

I'm thinking he was referring to a 1.0 LSD with all things equal, ie your ATS 1.5 vs an ATS 1.0.

The ".5" in 1.5 shouldn't really act differently then the comparable 1.0 on power, but in off power turn in (when that ".5" comes into play).

One can make the 1.5 work, and people do, but I don't know why.

Aquafina

iTrader: (3)

There is a big difference between a helical (1.0 way) and a clutch type 1.0 way. There is also a difference between a clutch type 1.0 and 1.5 way. In a FWD, an LSD will not make the car oversteer.

Archeryfreak

Hit it on the head. Front wheel drive does not benefit from a 1.5way. Decel creates oversteer very well in our cars. The 1 way will keep your traction planted when you are accelerating but allow some slip to enhance traction of the front wheels while decelerating.

10cjennings

iTrader: (1)

So there is 0 reason to go with a 1.5 way and tune around the extra push? I find that hard to believe as I've read about some well sorted cars running a 1.5. I'd be interested in knowing what they were looking to accomplish by specifically not going with the go to 1-way.

Todd00

Not directly as obviously its still a FWD car, but it will indirectly when it gets you around and through the corner better. I had to get used to applying power early in a corner where before I'd have to let off or brake.

And in a typical autocross situation, you're either on the gas or on the brake in a FWD car (or doing both).

While I wouldn't want a 2-way, the 1.5 does allow stability in heavy braking and isn't 100% "on" upon decel. Frankly, I think too many people make a big deal about the 1 vs 1.5 way clutch types on an autox course. I could see it being a slight difference on a road course though due to the nature of the driving.

On a side note, my braking precision was much improved with the new 1.5 and the rear end didn't get nearly as squirrely in heavy braking zones. I certainly didn't notice any less rotation though. As I said, it was just better everywhere.

10cjennings

iTrader: (1)

I'd think the opposite. The extra push would be more of a negative in an autocross situation where the extra stability under braking isn't really beneficial, and the cars are generally set-up to be looser off-throttle as you need rotation at low speeds, and stability isn't as much of a concern.

So is it just stability under braking that would lead a team with the funding to test various options to go with a 1.5 over a 1.0? That's all I can think of but I have 0 experience with it, and it seems that stability could be achievable via other means.

edit: I've completely deviated from the OP's question and am not referring to your average enthusiast who should probably go with the default option.

Todd00

You want controllable oversteer, not random oversteer in heavy braking zones. A properly setup FWD autox car is on the very edge of losing the rear almost everywhere. I've driven courses that require 65mph zones to 15 mph almost 180 degree turns. That style of braking will upset the car as there is nothing gradual about it.

I was able to brake hard and flick the wheel and the car would go where I wanted it to, then power through the turn and the rear followed. With the exact same setup before, I'd have to get the back end "corrected" and then sometimes I'd miss where I was aiming it (usually a cone hit would happen).

10cjennings

iTrader: (1)

The question is, How much of that is OEM Helical vs ATS Clutch, and how much of that is 1.0 vs 1.5 way?

I was basically saying that because an autox setup will focus on rotation and lessened concern on stable high speed braking (ex: I dunno anyone running 1/4''+ rear toe out in their RR car), the only benefits of the 1.5 I know of/have been presented to me (high speed braking stability), wouldn't be worth it given the known downsides (more off throttle push). Where as, in another setting (RR, or maybe loose surface rally), the potential benefits of a 1.5 seem like they it might be more plausible.

Black R

I'm pretty sure chris Travis posted about the 1.5 way on his sm civic.
I believe his sn is Rodney.
It should come up in a search.

Xian

I've run 1 and 2 way diff's... but never ran the 2 way extensively for autoX. The advantage that I can imagine happening with a 1.5 or 2 way in an autox is that you could set the car up to be super-loose mid corner but help to keep it from killing you in the braking zone and/or off throttle.

crower

thanks guys, been wondering since the 1.5way kaaz clutch type has a clunking noise when turning, isn't it bad or i any way could brake the differential when turning fast especially in autocross where turning occurs more often.thanks

rice_classic

This!

1.5 way can be very good in a short wheelbase FWD car because it reduces the affect of lift-oversteer and so the car can be setup very loose. But then again I'm thinking road race application. I would imagine this would be even more advantageous in auto-x where you could setup the car to be very rotationally friendly but not bite when you when trailing into a turn heavily.

Black R

This is entirely normal.

That's the plates locking and unlocking.

My ATS LSD is so loud and clunky, it sounds and feels like two broken axles until you give it enough torque via the gas pedal - then locks and pulls!