tr4il

I was told that if i drop a b18c1 into my 98 coupe that it would run no better than a regular SI....i almost began to cry...i dont know what to do...ive been looking for hatches but itll be a pain trying to sell my coupe and insurance n ....i dont know what to do....<u>im going nuts</u>

how much does 98 dx coupe weigh over a 98 hatch? big enough difference to make the coupe SUCK?


[Modified by tr4il, 3:10 PM 1/16/2002]

tr4il

ttt

sgT

dx coupe + gsr motor will be slightly faster than a 99 si coupe.

Hanson

go to nadaguides.com and look up your car. it will tell you the weight numbers that you need. don't be fooled. a gsr in a coupe will run stronger than an si, if for nothing else other than the extra torque. keep the coupe and go b18c. definitely more orginal than a hatch.

grippgoat

According to carpoint.com, the coupe has a curb weight of 2342 while the hatch has a curb weight of 2339. So basically 3 pounds, I guess. Both DX, btw.

Of course, curb weight on a 93 DX hatch is 2178.

And to put things in perspective, my NSX weighs about 3050 and puts 268 to the rear wheels (on a cold day 200 ft above sea level). To match that power to weight ratio on 2300 lbs, you'd need 203hp to the wheels. Then if you take aerodynamics into account, you'd need even more. And to achieve that without forced induction would be quite expensive, and none-too-driveable on the street. Which is why I was looking at what turbo options there might be for the 1993 DX hatch I'm going to be aquiring shortly. Seems like for the price of a B18C1 swap, you should be able to find a used turbo kit, and build the SOHC motor enough to take it reliably. But take that with a grain of salt, because I haven't done too much research in that direction. Then on top of just power considerations, with a turbo SOHC motor, you'd save some weight, and all the weight you'd be adding would be down low (turbo, intercooler, etc), which sounds kind of attractive compared to a (relatively-speaking) top-heavy DOHC VTEC b-series.

-Mike

tr4il

im gonna leave the b18c1 for a while....get exhaust n stuff then see how things r going and decide on drag3 or not

iceburgslim

Let's put it this way, if you get a a B18C swap done on your car,it should be just as fast as the D16 with a Drag turbo kit, and plus you will have an endless amount of options as far as customizing in the future goes. I would hate to see you buy bolt-ons for your car (a waste of $ IMO for the little power you gain) only to decide you want to do a swap later. This is just my opinion and by no means does anyone have to agree with me. Later!

grippgoat

Just how much power does the drag turbo kit *really* put out? They claim 203hp at the wheels.... Which is a good 30% higher than you'd get with the B18C1 swap... Of course, I still wouldn't pay $3100 (or whatever importparts.com wants) for the drag kit. If I could find a used one for under $2k it would be more attractive. But then I'd still have concerns about engine reliability.

It's just that I know if I were going to do a swap, I'd feel like I was wasting my time if I couldn't make it at least as fast as my NSX... Which would REQUIRE forced induction, so it seems like it might be cheaper/lighter to just build the stock motor. *shrug*

But like I said.... Grains of salt.... Big grains of salt...

-Mike

fowler!

but the 203hp that the Drag kit puts out will be different than what the GSR motor puts out. They have completely different power bands. Drag will have nothing down low, only at top end will it start to pull. GSR on the other hand will do nicely the whole way through. I don't know that a GSR will beat a turbo ex, but it will do fine I think.

grippgoat

Hrm.... GSR's do pull well. But in FWD, actually, lots of power down low just makes it harder to launch, doesn't it? Of course, spooling turbos giving you a torque surge can't make 1st gear any easier. Once you hit second gear, though, it's all about top end. The following page has a dyno plot from an F-Max turbo kit:
http://www.f-max.com/D16A%20VTEC%20DYNO.htm

It shows good torque from 4k to 7k. Way more torque than you'd get from a GS-R motor. And I'd like to see what it would look like with a custom exhaust (less torque drop above 6500 I'm guessing). Granted, the GS-R is working from like 5k to 8k, but still, the gearing difference won't make up for almost 100% torque difference.

Now, I don't know what lag or reliability would be like running 12psi on a D16 with stock internals. Whereas a GS-R would be nice and smooth and bullet-proof.

Hrm. And looking at http://www.hybrid.honda-perf.org/tech/engine.html, it appears I'm a little confused about 92-95 civic motors. I guess only the EX and Si have D16s, and the others have D15s, which are probably hopeless in terms of making power even with a turbo.

So I guess the next question is, would swapping for a D16z6 (into a non-Si hatchback) and turboing it still give more hp per dollar than a GS-R swap.

-Mike