Yellow Dragon

Hey guys. It's been awhile since I've posted in this forum, but I really feel the need to get MORE out of my hybrid. For those who don't know, I own a '92 CX B18C1 hybrid. I have the following mods done to it:

- DC 4-2-1
- AEM CAI
- Thermal cat-back (test pipe)
- Del SLO seats
- Tokico Blues
- H&R Race Springs
- FI CF hood

I've been really wanting to get this think faster. I ran a 14.6 on street tires (only tried a few times since the track was so busy). Anyway, I rode in a turbo Integra LS last night and that thing MOVED! I was very impressed. I really want to stay NA, but I don't know what route to take (ITR head, manifold??).

From the experiences you've all had, what do you suggest? Keep in mind this is my daily driver (my ITR is my track/garage queen). Should I go FI (turbo, sc) or would you suggest I stay NA? If so, what setup? Keep in mind I really don't want to throw anymore than $2-$3k into whatever I choose.

-Todd

B16CRX

I would stay NA, but thats just what I prefer.
You wouldn't really need an ITR head, since a B16A head with a little headwork done is the same thing. I would suggest going with a cam upgrade. You could get ITR cams, springs, and retainers, or go with some Toda B or JUN. You could also up the compression a little with new pistons. It really all depends on how much you want to spend.

Yellow Dragon

Stock GSR compression is 10:1 right? Well, what would it be with a B16A/ITR head?

egghead

Its about 9.7:1 I know, thats what I have. If I were you I'd probably get some pr3, p30 or p73 pistons. Then Go with some ctr cams and itr springs, valves etc. And throw on an ITR or skunk intake mani. Thats more than enough extra ponies to cure your power hunger for now. Or you could just ditch the 1.8 and get a b20 block and build that. I dont know if those suggestions exceed your budget, but they're just a thought. -gl




[Modified by egghead, 12:35 AM 1/20/2002]

hydroflip

turbo

1 2 NV

id say turbo but ur not goin to get a very good setup with only 2-3k. plus those r pretty basic kits with extreme performance just around the corner. u will need to buy other stuff. for 2-3k id say JRSC even though i dont think they r that great. to stay all motor u will need more money than ur willing to spend. but for ur budget definitely JRSC.

CRX_VTEC

2-3K is more then enough to go fast N/A if you do the work yourself. Since you already have a b18C1.. the best mods for you (IMO) would be to go with P30 or P73 for higher compression and a set of ITR cams and cam gears to adjust them. You can add later a Skunk manifold and a overbored TB to maximize flow.

1 2 NV

a JRSC will yield way more HP than new pistons, small cams (ie ITR) IM, and cam gears. dollar for dollar, the JRSC would b the best investment.

Yellow Dragon

Hey guys, I have some friends and I think I could get into a nice turbo setup for <$3k.

The only thing I'm really concerned about is if the turbo setup will be reliable. I daily drive my hybrid and I need to count on it.

The one thing that I really like about NA is the respect it gets though...but I feel that bang for the buck I can get a nice turbo kit running 8 Psi.

I guess my REAL question is...what are my advantages of having the B18C1? As far as the next level?

Thanks again,
Todd

1 2 NV

most kits r set at around 6psi. as far as ur last ? the potential of a B18C1 is endless. strong motor from the start. endless aftermarket support. lower CR than other DOHC VTEC motors for better boostin capabilities. hope this helps.

CRX_VTEC

I think those mods I suggested are the best for him since he wants to stay as close to a daily drivers ride and stay N/A cuz thats what he said he wanted to do.
If he wanted F/I then a SC is what i would have suggested as well. I use to have a JRSC and although it made "okay" power... it needed tuning ever so often. Its nowhere near as fast as a turbo... but at least it had great acceleration.
If you go F/I ..that would be damn quick..
A VX with B18C1 superchagered... and get a lightened flywheel. <--- Bat outta hell!!!


[Modified by CRX_VTEC, 12:16 PM 1/20/2002]

1 2 NV

shoot, my bad, i obviously cant read. CRX_VTEC is right. NA, NA, NA for the money hes right on track. i guess it all depends on how much money the labor will cost. with what he suggested that should b within the budget. damn eyes, haha

CRX_VTEC

Going turbo doesnt mean its not going to be unreliable.. it all depends on how you tune and how often you tune your car. Even though you get a turbo kit for 3K.. you still need to stregthen your block if you ever plan on boosting as well as larger injectors and ECU tuning too.
My little brothers old civic was set at 18lbs on stock internals. It was crazy ...whether going to the corner store or to do laundry.. you can hear the BOV 3 blocks away... it was like a bus.
I loved that turbo.. more so then my old SC. But N/A is what I have now and to me... I would stick to N/A if I could start all over again. I cant complain though.. it was fun while it lasted.


[Modified by CRX_VTEC, 12:34 PM 1/20/2002]

Yellow Dragon

Okay, so if I decide to stay NA, please give me a list of what you think I should do, and how much for each mod...also give me an idea of how much hp I would gain by doing so.

I really need to figure out why my B18C1 is a better choice than the B16A2. I went through this before I bought the swap, and I chose the B18C1 because of the torque. I'm a little confused now because everyone seems to talk about how much better the B16A2 head flows.

Would you guys say the B18C1 is a better candidate for FI or NA?

Thanks again.

Darin D.

you have a lot of room for improvement on your current setup..my advice would be to get rid of that header and get the jdm 4-1 or the DC copy, get a skunk2 ecu program. Then I would upgrade to type r valvetrain and cams. get type r pistons to bump the compression up and then tune cam gears and fuel pressure on the dyno. Doing all this will get you 12s pretty easily in a hatchback, and it will be as reliable as a stock motor.

1 2 NV

the C1 is excellent for both NA or FI. it doesnt matter which u chose, its a strong motor. torque moves cars, we all know this. u made the right choice in choosing the C1 over a B16. just go drive a car with a C1 vs a B16, u will immediately know u made the right choice. B16 heads dont necessarily flow better, in fact JG choses C1 heads and ports them. from what i know, the C1 and 16A heads flow about the same. the C1 head has a smaller combustion chamber and the reason JG usually choses C1 heads is because the entry angle and exit angle r better for flow, however this does not mean it flows better. also on a side note: the C1 has more "oval" combustion chambers which equals better combustion. its just got good potential.

as far as mods, this is my list. cams (600+) most likely due to ur budget skunk2 or crower (approx 15hp), JDM header (400) or DC JDM (approx 5hp) but will see more gains with cams, ECU upgraded for specified cams (P28 100+ chipping 250=350), JE 11:1 or USITR 10.6 stock in GSR approx 10.9:1 pistons (400+)(approx HP unknown) each motor is different, skunk 2 IM (300)(approx 10hp). theres some other stuff also but labor will take up the majority of the rest of the money if done properly.

CRX_VTEC

I think everyone would take a B18C1 over a B16A2 anyday of the week. Dont get me wrong.. a B16A2 is a great motor with lots of potential. But it takes a lot more to get a B16 to push as much HP/Torque as a B18 would.

For me.. a good B18C setup for daily driving is as follows.Its what i would use if I had a GSR.
P73 pistons or P30.. probably around $300 for higher compression.
ITR cams $550-600 These cams are more agressive then stock GSR. Wont make crazy power like Jun 3 or Toda cuz they cost twice as much.. and ITR have good midrange where as TODA and JUN make most power at high RPM.
Cam gears to tune your cams $300-400
reprogrammed ECU..150-250
Overboard TB around $2-300
Skunk IM around $350
Ti retainers to lighten up the valvetrain ...$250
It all adds up to about $2,000 or so. And this set up is fairly mild.. nothing crazy like CTR pistons or "wild" "crazy" cams. And you also using some really great quality parts ...OEM pistons, cams. Dont know about the skunk though...
Cam gears.. Spoon or Toda... their bad ***.. and they use OEM sprokets too!
Stick to the 4-2-1 header ... better for low end. Its still your daily ride rite?
No need for upgrade valvesprings if you dont plan on going past 8K RPM. Save the money..ITR cams dont make much power up their anyway.


[Modified by CRX_VTEC, 2:38 PM 1/20/2002]

DR. ON POINT

Id get the supercharger

fowler!

This is what I'd do...almost did it...but my friggin tranny (a whole nother story)

B18C1 Block
ITR head
CTR pistons
CTR intake, ITR exhaust cam
ITR tranny

That would be a nice reliable setup. Very quick. Prolly around 175-185 wheel hp.

Check this: probably a freak motor though. https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=104633