b16a2 vs. b18c1 which has a better head....
10-09-2006, 08:28 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Lowell, Ma, usa
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
b16a2 vs. b18c1 which has a better head....
i have a b18c1 block but i have a b16a2 and a p72(b18c1) head....
which is better for me....i'm staying away from boost right now and just trying to get a better idea....i heard b16 is better which will make the famous poor mans type-r but let me see what u guys have to say....
thankx
which is better for me....i'm staying away from boost right now and just trying to get a better idea....i heard b16 is better which will make the famous poor mans type-r but let me see what u guys have to say....
thankx
10-12-2006, 04:35 AM
#3
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Columbia, SC, USA
Posts: 1,327
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
He is right but you will loose like 0.2 compression with that head.
Your best bet would be to put the b16a head on the b18c1 block with Type-r pistons. Then you would have a poor mans type-r. You could put what ever pistons you want though.......typically people go for higher compression pistons.
Your best bet would be to put the b16a head on the b18c1 block with Type-r pistons. Then you would have a poor mans type-r. You could put what ever pistons you want though.......typically people go for higher compression pistons.
10-12-2006, 05:07 AM
#4
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: 40.201N, 77.189W, PA
Posts: 4,738
Likes: 0
Received 7 Likes
on
4 Posts
Re: (Varmit)
They're are both so close that it doesn't really matter on such a mild street setup for you right now. The P72 head will give you about .2 extra points of compression and the PR3 head flows a TAD bit more, but nothing you'll feel in the seat of your pants. If you want the poor man's ITR, bump the compression with a new set of pistons and get cams. Good to go. 
10-12-2006, 05:22 AM
#5
Junior Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Palm Harlem, Florida, Pinellas
Posts: 65
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Ok i see a lot of the same questions over and over again so maybe i can clear up one.
Which is "better a GSR or a B16 head for my build?".
lets take a look at both heads in perspective.
B16 (pr3 Stamp Code) Cylinder Head:
-The B16 head and Type-R head are of identical casts.
Both of these cylinder heads are stamped with the code PR-3.
-An ITR head is a ported B16A head from the factory. Both are coded as PR3 heads. So they are the same head but the ITR one (PR3-2) has had better intake valves, stiffer springs, bigger cams, bigger LMD's, bigger ports, steeper valve angles, some bowl blending work done from the factory.(IN simpler' terms, FLOWS BETTER, HOLDS HIGH REVS BETTER!)
-The B16 head flows SLIGHTLY better then the GSR head.
-B16 uses a single stage IM with different flange mounting holes than the GSR. You are able to find more IM to the fit on the b16 for this reason.
-B16 heads are easily obtainable and can be had for pretty cheap versus the ITR.
-The intake port approach into the combustion chamber is less vertical and directs the mixture motion into the chamber differently than the GSR.
-Ways To Identify:
* the green paint by the distributor
* thinner ITR intake valvestem (12% lighter vs GSR/Si)
* minor port work by the valve seat in the ports
* dual valve springs on both sides, notice yellow paint on intake side, blue on exhaust side
* lost motion assembly has a blue dot
Part Numbers for:
CYLINDER HEAD:
-b16 head:12100-P30-020
-Type-R:12100-P73-J00
-GSR:12100-P72-000
-JDM civic Type R:12100-P73-J00
GSR (P72)Cylinder head:
-The GSR head's ports are said to be "straight shot" or more vertical or steeper).
-lower head volume in the GSR head works well with dished pistons in FI applications whereas the ITR head's larger head volume works well in N/A high hp motors using domed pistons that fill in the volume.
-The head volume for the GSR head is at 41.6 cc.
-From EDYN:The GSR head has a larger ID to the intake seat than the B16 head which is intended to feed a 1.8 liter engine...We don't see the differences that some seem to believe exist, with the B16 head being more swirl oriented and the GSR leaning more toward tumble. On the all-out killer heads, our best head based on a B16 casing will outflow an equivalently prepared GSR by perhaps 5 cfm at .500 lift and that's not enough to cause one to out perform the other in the real world. The inside diameter of the seat (of an 00-01 ITR head) is also larger than that of a stock B16 head, allowing higher flow rates necessary to feed a 1.8 liter combination.
-The GSR is also has a DUAL STAGE intake manifold.
-the intake port is a larger with a steeper throat cut valve angle. It has less aerodynamic drag from having less internal surface area than the GSR head and GSR 2 stage IM.
HEAD FLOW COMPARISON CHART B16(STOCK) VS. GSR(STOCK):</u>[/b]
Notice that the unported b16a (PR3) head is the same in terms of flow volume compared to the unported b18c1 (P72) head...and it's not as dramatically better as people make it out to be. However the ITR head (a ported b16a head with "intake port bowl-blending" and modified valve angles) compared to a ported GSR head shows it's advantage at the upper rpms.
Some useful links as well:
Piston/head/block combo for compression: http://www.lightningmotorsports.com/techpiston.htm
Sources/KUDOS: team-integra.net Head TECH, GOOGLE, Lighting motorsports tech, Honda USA, EDYN, and others..
__________________
Which is "better a GSR or a B16 head for my build?".
lets take a look at both heads in perspective.
B16 (pr3 Stamp Code) Cylinder Head:
-The B16 head and Type-R head are of identical casts.
Both of these cylinder heads are stamped with the code PR-3.
-An ITR head is a ported B16A head from the factory. Both are coded as PR3 heads. So they are the same head but the ITR one (PR3-2) has had better intake valves, stiffer springs, bigger cams, bigger LMD's, bigger ports, steeper valve angles, some bowl blending work done from the factory.(IN simpler' terms, FLOWS BETTER, HOLDS HIGH REVS BETTER!)
-The B16 head flows SLIGHTLY better then the GSR head.
-B16 uses a single stage IM with different flange mounting holes than the GSR. You are able to find more IM to the fit on the b16 for this reason.
-B16 heads are easily obtainable and can be had for pretty cheap versus the ITR.
-The intake port approach into the combustion chamber is less vertical and directs the mixture motion into the chamber differently than the GSR.
-Ways To Identify:
* the green paint by the distributor
* thinner ITR intake valvestem (12% lighter vs GSR/Si)
* minor port work by the valve seat in the ports
* dual valve springs on both sides, notice yellow paint on intake side, blue on exhaust side
* lost motion assembly has a blue dot
Part Numbers for:
CYLINDER HEAD:
-b16 head:12100-P30-020
-Type-R:12100-P73-J00
-GSR:12100-P72-000
-JDM civic Type R:12100-P73-J00
GSR (P72)Cylinder head:
-The GSR head's ports are said to be "straight shot" or more vertical or steeper).
-lower head volume in the GSR head works well with dished pistons in FI applications whereas the ITR head's larger head volume works well in N/A high hp motors using domed pistons that fill in the volume.
-The head volume for the GSR head is at 41.6 cc.
-From EDYN:The GSR head has a larger ID to the intake seat than the B16 head which is intended to feed a 1.8 liter engine...We don't see the differences that some seem to believe exist, with the B16 head being more swirl oriented and the GSR leaning more toward tumble. On the all-out killer heads, our best head based on a B16 casing will outflow an equivalently prepared GSR by perhaps 5 cfm at .500 lift and that's not enough to cause one to out perform the other in the real world. The inside diameter of the seat (of an 00-01 ITR head) is also larger than that of a stock B16 head, allowing higher flow rates necessary to feed a 1.8 liter combination.
-The GSR is also has a DUAL STAGE intake manifold.
-the intake port is a larger with a steeper throat cut valve angle. It has less aerodynamic drag from having less internal surface area than the GSR head and GSR 2 stage IM.
HEAD FLOW COMPARISON CHART B16(STOCK) VS. GSR(STOCK):</u>[/b]
Notice that the unported b16a (PR3) head is the same in terms of flow volume compared to the unported b18c1 (P72) head...and it's not as dramatically better as people make it out to be. However the ITR head (a ported b16a head with "intake port bowl-blending" and modified valve angles) compared to a ported GSR head shows it's advantage at the upper rpms.
Some useful links as well:
Piston/head/block combo for compression: http://www.lightningmotorsports.com/techpiston.htm
Sources/KUDOS: team-integra.net Head TECH, GOOGLE, Lighting motorsports tech, Honda USA, EDYN, and others..
__________________
10-12-2006, 05:24 AM
#6
Junior Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Palm Harlem, Florida, Pinellas
Posts: 65
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: (pubes2942)
Sorry, i dont know how to work the post. THeres a chart that should have appeared.Woops. MY BAD. ANyways the heads are very simliar so it really not worth just putting the b16a head on there stock. cuz you'll pretty much get the same out of the both heads with type r cams.
Trending Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
btlancaster
All Motor / Naturally Aspirated
23
08-28-2008 04:43 PM
