JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
#1051
Honda-Tech Member
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
X2 go with the healthier engine. Difference between PDE 00-01 and Non is PDE has 45 degree valve seat instead of a 60 normal h22. It also has slightly smoother casting in the intake runner. As well as the intake manifold gasket port nose are is a little bit more open and gasket matched. Due to has similar bottom intake/gasket as PDE Euro R.
#1052
Premium Member
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
Aradin, good insights..
I think i still use the IABs for the low speed corners where i may fall out of vtec but dont want to downshift. And dont want to lose any lowend torque. But it would be nice to have a simpler set up and less parts to wear out or break, I always think about that IAB vacuum box and how i would ever replace it. My H23A came with the ports busted, i was hoping to have a back up. I may look into a Euro-R manifold, seems to be good middle ground. But the spacer like you said may be the easiest and fastest solution, i remember blacktrax selling these parts. Thanks reminding me! :-)
I think i still use the IABs for the low speed corners where i may fall out of vtec but dont want to downshift. And dont want to lose any lowend torque. But it would be nice to have a simpler set up and less parts to wear out or break, I always think about that IAB vacuum box and how i would ever replace it. My H23A came with the ports busted, i was hoping to have a back up. I may look into a Euro-R manifold, seems to be good middle ground. But the spacer like you said may be the easiest and fastest solution, i remember blacktrax selling these parts. Thanks reminding me! :-)
That's a good question. I think that's the general consensus but it makes me wonder, what about the F20B? The PCB heads they come with seem to be based on the older P13 castings. As we know, the manual versions come with Type-S cams yet they didn't suffer from that issue.
#1053
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
In H23 VTEC oil squirters are not necessary. There are grooves in bigger rod end that work like oil squirters and spray oil on the bottom of the pistons.
I wanted to install oil squirters in my H23A but it was impossible to bend them that they clear the pistons and crank.
I wanted to install oil squirters in my H23A but it was impossible to bend them that they clear the pistons and crank.
#1054
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
PCB F20B has there own heads... Could be 60 degrees as well.... I think the rocker wear was more of an issue with those trying to use stock P13 valve springs with TypeS/EuroR cams... Valves not being percisely in sync needing a stiffer spring with higher lift cam. But yes I think it was more common on the OBD1 motors with non behive LMAs
#1055
Former Moderator
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
Tried looking through some pages of this thread, but figured someone could tell me more quickly. Are the H23A blue tops using the FRM lined cylinder walls like the 00-spec H22A found in USDM Preludes? Google searches yielded different results.
#1056
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
#1057
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Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
Only F series motors have iron sleeves(minus the F20c - S2000 motor which does not apply here anyways)
#1059
Honda-Tech Member
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
All 97- H's use the same piston rings. I think.
H22A4-H22A8 and Type S/R have the same piston ring part number
H22A4-H22A8 and Type S/R have the same piston ring part number
#1061
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Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
If someone wouldn't mind answering this question
H22 IACV will work on H23A Intake Manifold with Rosko IACV adapter?
H22 IACV will work on H23A Intake Manifold with Rosko IACV adapter?
#1062
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
Your better off getting the IACV relocation kit if firewall is close and or not a lot of room up front
#1064
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Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
Could someone with a EK H2B swap running stock IM measure the clearance between that and firewall please.
Thank you
Thank you
#1065
#1066
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
Those that are Straight H going to need one of these for the Lower K series intake manifolds. OEM Rear T Bracket wont work. It is also Slimmer, Stronger and Easier install. Installs only on driver side. This is not a for sale post do not ask how much.. PM with any question. Pictured is a K2H Excessive Intake manifold
#1067
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
Those that are Straight H going to need one of these for the Lower K series intake manifolds. OEM Rear T Bracket wont work. It is also Slimmer, Stronger and Easier install. Installs only on driver side. This is not a for sale post do not ask how much.. PM with any question. Pictured is a K2H Excessive Intake manifold
Can you post pictures of the clearance issues with the stock rear mount and the K manifolds, I assume RBC is the one you are referencing?
I don't see how this affects the H23 any more than any other Vtec H-series engine, but keep it tech enough and I will be ok with it.
#1068
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
John,
Can you post pictures of the clearance issues with the stock rear mount and the K manifolds, I assume RBC is the one you are referencing?
I don't see how this affects the H23 any more than any other Vtec H-series engine, but keep it tech enough and I will be ok with it.
Can you post pictures of the clearance issues with the stock rear mount and the K manifolds, I assume RBC is the one you are referencing?
I don't see how this affects the H23 any more than any other Vtec H-series engine, but keep it tech enough and I will be ok with it.
#1069
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
Hey everyone. First post on honda-tech.
Forgive me for not rifling through this whole thread. I'll do a bit of that after I put this post up. I've got a 98/P13 H23A I'm building. It's for a daily'd 5th gen Prelude.
I'm looking to run Type S pistons for a slight bump in CR, so in terms of the bottom end, I can just get the rotating assembly balanced, use the Kaizenspeed Balance Shaft Delete, hone the bores, put in all new rings/bearings, and go.
I've been seeing some sources saying Type S pistons will come up out of the cylinder and kiss the valves on an H23A? And that the rods need to be modified to run Type S floating pins?
Any truth to this? Also, what about clearance issues any may have come across when putting a Stage 1 cam in there?
Forgive me for not rifling through this whole thread. I'll do a bit of that after I put this post up. I've got a 98/P13 H23A I'm building. It's for a daily'd 5th gen Prelude.
I'm looking to run Type S pistons for a slight bump in CR, so in terms of the bottom end, I can just get the rotating assembly balanced, use the Kaizenspeed Balance Shaft Delete, hone the bores, put in all new rings/bearings, and go.
I've been seeing some sources saying Type S pistons will come up out of the cylinder and kiss the valves on an H23A? And that the rods need to be modified to run Type S floating pins?
Any truth to this? Also, what about clearance issues any may have come across when putting a Stage 1 cam in there?
#1070
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
Ill see if I can answer this quickly... yes there has been some issues with say pro 1 and h23v bluetop... being close to the valve reliefs. A typical h22 piston will be in the hole 6k. The h23v BlueTop seems to be deck level 0 so already 6k in disadvantage... I would compensate with a 40k thick cometic headgasket. Yes this will lower your compression a tad... obd2 should all be floating pins. So should be a drop in with Type S.
#1071
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
Ill see if I can answer this quickly... yes there has been some issues with say pro 1 and h23v bluetop... being close to the valve reliefs. A typical h22 piston will be in the hole 6k. The h23v BlueTop seems to be deck level 0 so already 6k in disadvantage... I would compensate with a 40k thick cometic headgasket. Yes this will lower your compression a tad... obd2 should all be floating pins. So should be a drop in with Type S.
If this is on the Type S I might be okay with that, since this would put me in the neighbourhood of 11.6:1 CR (without taking into account valve pockets) courtesy of the good ol' zealautowerks compression calculator.
Gah...the gears are turning in my brain to do an 89mm bore/Wiseco piston/Darton MID sleeve. Hmm...
#1072
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
I would give your self a 40k gap... no matter how you figure it... Do I guarantee anything no... math seems right....
H23V with Stock rods 141mm Type S pistons 40k headgasket math tells me 11.1-1
H23V with Eagle H23A1 rods 141.5mm Type S pistons 60k headgasket math tells me piston will be out of hole 20K. Add 40K ontop you get 60k thick headgasket brings it down to 11.0-1
H23V with Stock rods 141mm Type S pistons 40k headgasket math tells me 11.1-1
H23V with Eagle H23A1 rods 141.5mm Type S pistons 60k headgasket math tells me piston will be out of hole 20K. Add 40K ontop you get 60k thick headgasket brings it down to 11.0-1
#1073
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
H23V rods are 141mm? Not 141.5mm?
I'd kinda be down with a setup like that, given ICB has Type S pistons for a good price, and I'd just hone/balance/rebuild and go. Just under 11:1 CR once the loss from valve pockets is accounted for.
But gahh...I can't get this 89mm piston thing out of my head.
I'd kinda be down with a setup like that, given ICB has Type S pistons for a good price, and I'd just hone/balance/rebuild and go. Just under 11:1 CR once the loss from valve pockets is accounted for.
But gahh...I can't get this 89mm piston thing out of my head.
#1074
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
H23V Blue Top rods are 141mm they are roughly 20k shorter than the H23A1 rods which are 141.5mm. This is what allows a h22 compression height piston to be used and be deck level rather then 20K out of of hole with an aftermarket or h23a1 oem rod. This is how I run my turbo builds H23A1 rods.... H22 pistons... pistons out of hole and a 60k thick cometic headgasket to compensate.
However back in the day few years ago Custom Pistons were a lot more spendy. Now most companies can make them for about $100 or so additional then a shelf piston but are about 4 weeks out. So at that point could use H23A1 aftermarket rods just move the H22 wrist pin further down 20-25k....
However back in the day few years ago Custom Pistons were a lot more spendy. Now most companies can make them for about $100 or so additional then a shelf piston but are about 4 weeks out. So at that point could use H23A1 aftermarket rods just move the H22 wrist pin further down 20-25k....
#1075
Re: JDM H23A Vtec Blue Top Mystery Motor, True Facts, Questions?
Ahh makes sense! And yes, the pistons aren't too badly priced...only a bit more than the Traction Bar I'm thinkin about grabbing from you soon
I'm pretty much locked into the idea of 89 mm pistons/bores now, particularly because from what I can see, that's as big as is recommended to go, and I don't see myself having a billet crank made by Brian Crower. So the way I see it, a rebuilt, fully balanced bottom end, H23A crank, with deleted balance shafts and an 89 mm piston/Darton MID sleeve is pretty much as far as I'll ever go, with Stage 1 or Stage 2 cams and schtuff up top.
Do you have any opinions on who makes the best high comp piston for H's? Something just seems so plain about rocking the H23A pistons, or even Type S's
I'm pretty much locked into the idea of 89 mm pistons/bores now, particularly because from what I can see, that's as big as is recommended to go, and I don't see myself having a billet crank made by Brian Crower. So the way I see it, a rebuilt, fully balanced bottom end, H23A crank, with deleted balance shafts and an 89 mm piston/Darton MID sleeve is pretty much as far as I'll ever go, with Stage 1 or Stage 2 cams and schtuff up top.
Do you have any opinions on who makes the best high comp piston for H's? Something just seems so plain about rocking the H23A pistons, or even Type S's