what's so bad about laying a bike down, and questions about starter bikes
12-24-2005, 04:05 PM
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what's so bad about laying a bike down, and questions about starter bikes
Hey guys,
For the last few months I've been thinking about getting a sportbike. The last time I rode a bike was about 10 years ago, but that was actually a 10 speed, hehehe. I have never riden any type of motorcycle before in my life. I've been checking out a lot of the beginners threads on here, getting with some of my ocal bikers abouthte MSF courses and looking at getting some leathers but I just had some questions.
The first one is about "laying the bike down". Aside from damaging the fairings (that's the plastic coverings right?) what other kind of damage can result from laying the bike down? I'm only talking light drops like say at a stop and coming to a stop. Is there engine damage that can result from this?
Also I was looking on Kawasaki.com and I see the new Ninja 250R's are around $3000, which I think is a good deal. I know a brand new bike is a probably a bad idea because it will end up getting layed down a bit. But the good thing is with a brand new bike I dont have to worry about any kind of maintenance problems. I think a 250cc might be a good starter for me, but I was wondering what other 250-500cc bikes are there out there (make/model). I dont think going with a 600cc is a good idea for me, so I think I'll stick with a sub 500-600cc bike. I'll probably ride the 250R for about a year or so then sell it and get a 600cc.
For the last few months I've been thinking about getting a sportbike. The last time I rode a bike was about 10 years ago, but that was actually a 10 speed, hehehe. I have never riden any type of motorcycle before in my life. I've been checking out a lot of the beginners threads on here, getting with some of my ocal bikers abouthte MSF courses and looking at getting some leathers but I just had some questions.
The first one is about "laying the bike down". Aside from damaging the fairings (that's the plastic coverings right?) what other kind of damage can result from laying the bike down? I'm only talking light drops like say at a stop and coming to a stop. Is there engine damage that can result from this?
Also I was looking on Kawasaki.com and I see the new Ninja 250R's are around $3000, which I think is a good deal. I know a brand new bike is a probably a bad idea because it will end up getting layed down a bit. But the good thing is with a brand new bike I dont have to worry about any kind of maintenance problems. I think a 250cc might be a good starter for me, but I was wondering what other 250-500cc bikes are there out there (make/model). I dont think going with a 600cc is a good idea for me, so I think I'll stick with a sub 500-600cc bike. I'll probably ride the 250R for about a year or so then sell it and get a 600cc.
12-24-2005, 04:40 PM
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Re: what's so bad about laying a bike down, and questions about starter bikes (BlueShadow)
imo i'd rather buy a bike that hasn't been laid down for the peace of mind. another bad thing is fairings arne't cheap to replace and when a bike gets laid, damage gets done to other parts that keep the bike together that you don't exactly see.
12-24-2005, 04:59 PM
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Re: what's so bad about laying a bike down, and questions about starter bikes (AzntaggeR)
I read that bikes like the 250R are lighter then the 600cc bikes. I also read that bikes are pretty unbalanced especially with a rider, but does a lighter bike mean it's less likely to tip? or easier to keep upright?? (however you wanna look at it). I also hear that lighter bikes are a little "scarier" to ride when it's really windy or if you're on the freeway. But I dont use the freeway a lot anyways.
TIA
TIA
12-24-2005, 05:36 PM
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Re: what's so bad about laying a bike down, and questions about starter bikes (BlueShadow)
if you can keep the bike upright its not a problem. the problem is when the bike starts to tip over and as it becomes more leaned over at an angle the weight of the bike gets extremely heavy. which is how most people drop bikes in the first place.
12-24-2005, 05:39 PM
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Re: what's so bad about laying a bike down, and questions about starter bikes (BlueShadow)
Wow. One of the most intelligent threads I've ever seen from someone with no bike experience.
Bikes are heavy....but depending on your balance, size and strength - I don't know that a 250 vs a 500 would make much of a difference when it comes to keeping the bike upright. That is unless you're incredibly weak? I've had my 600 try and fall over on me while I was putting it on bike stands and I was able to hold its weight and stand back upright on my own....I'm far from the strongest of guys too. I wouldn't let any small weight difference between a 250 and a 500 sway your decision either way.
I agree that the piece of mind that would come with a new bike would be worth it. At $3000 I don't know that you could really go wrong anyway....plus, you can probably sell it for $2500 in a year (if not more) as long as you keep it in good shape.
Bikes are heavy....but depending on your balance, size and strength - I don't know that a 250 vs a 500 would make much of a difference when it comes to keeping the bike upright. That is unless you're incredibly weak? I've had my 600 try and fall over on me while I was putting it on bike stands and I was able to hold its weight and stand back upright on my own....I'm far from the strongest of guys too. I wouldn't let any small weight difference between a 250 and a 500 sway your decision either way.
I agree that the piece of mind that would come with a new bike would be worth it. At $3000 I don't know that you could really go wrong anyway....plus, you can probably sell it for $2500 in a year (if not more) as long as you keep it in good shape.
12-24-2005, 06:28 PM
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Re: what's so bad about laying a bike down, and questions about starter bikes (hybridcrx)
Your ego is damaged. That and you realize that your are vulnerable on a bike and in the real world, kind of a reality check to how serious the whole sport is. Ive never dropped or dumped my bike but ive came close and it puts you in check real quick.
12-24-2005, 06:57 PM
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Re: what's so bad about laying a bike down, and questions about starter bikes (BlueShadow)
I was in your situation a couple months ago.
1) go to several dealerships and sit on the bikes.
2) take the MSF class. I started the class on a 250 rebel, cause i had been considering one at the time...but I ended up trading it out during the class because my knees hit the handlebars.
The only real way to figure out what size of bike will be comfortable for you is to go sit on a bunch. Only way to figure out if a smaller bike is for you is to ride one, and you get a chance to do that at the MSF course. And its a great place to learn the fundamentals.
Good Luck!
1) go to several dealerships and sit on the bikes.
2) take the MSF class. I started the class on a 250 rebel, cause i had been considering one at the time...but I ended up trading it out during the class because my knees hit the handlebars.
The only real way to figure out what size of bike will be comfortable for you is to go sit on a bunch. Only way to figure out if a smaller bike is for you is to ride one, and you get a chance to do that at the MSF course. And its a great place to learn the fundamentals.
Good Luck!
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12-25-2005, 06:12 AM
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Re: what's so bad about laying a bike down, and questions about starter bikes (PECO)
thanks for the replies guys
I'm 6'2" and 220lbs, about average build. I would say I'm about average strength. But I wasn't sure how hard it was to tip a bike for an average sized person. There's a Kawasaki dealership closeby and I'm gonna swing by in a few days to take a look at the 250R's and also see if I can sit on one.
I'm 6'2" and 220lbs, about average build. I would say I'm about average strength. But I wasn't sure how hard it was to tip a bike for an average sized person. There's a Kawasaki dealership closeby and I'm gonna swing by in a few days to take a look at the 250R's and also see if I can sit on one.
12-25-2005, 10:00 AM
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Re: what's so bad about laying a bike down, and questions about starter bikes (BlueShadow)
normally i would say a 250 for you but you're bigger then most people. Maybe look into a ex500 or gs500?
12-25-2005, 11:19 AM
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I highly doubt you'll fit on a 250. It's all about discipline. I've got a 600 and it's my first bike and I've dumped it once due to the kickstand kicking back up on me but I got it back up no problem and I've lowsided once due to road conditions. It's about how you handle yourself and how disciplined you are. You'd probably be fine on a 500 but take the MSF and go test ride/sit on bikes. That's the only way you'll know what you fit on.
12-25-2005, 11:36 AM
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Re: (Muffler Bearing)
rule of thumb: Find the bike your most comfortable with then cc/2. For instance, Most people think they should start out on a 600 cc. Rule of thumb is 600 cc/ 2 = 300cc> so Honda Rebel 250 for you. 
I also have a 01 Rebel for sale.
On a serious note, If you complete an msf course, and decide to ride a smaller bike, if you drop it, bikes aren't for you. I can say from experience, smaller bikes are very easy to ride and are also very forgiving. For example, I once rode over leaves (always try to avoid), and the bike went into a lean without my control. I then kicked down my leg and closed the throttle and regained control. If that had been a larger bike, I'm sure I would have went down.
I also have a 01 Rebel for sale.
On a serious note, If you complete an msf course, and decide to ride a smaller bike, if you drop it, bikes aren't for you. I can say from experience, smaller bikes are very easy to ride and are also very forgiving. For example, I once rode over leaves (always try to avoid), and the bike went into a lean without my control. I then kicked down my leg and closed the throttle and regained control. If that had been a larger bike, I'm sure I would have went down.
12-25-2005, 11:47 AM
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Re: (Stewie)
I'm 6'3'' 230 or so, and I tried the rebel in the MSF course. I had to switch out because the handlebars were hitting my legs. Not to mention, it was unbelievably comfortable to sit there with my feet down because the pegs were right where my feet wanted to land, so my hips were killing me from the wide stance.
The problem I found while shopping for bikes is that there isn't much middle ground. There is a ton of sport race bikes for sale (GSXRs) and tons of 250's, but not much in between. I was shopping in the 500-750 range, but not considering anything too fast (sport/track/race/supersport).
The problem I found while shopping for bikes is that there isn't much middle ground. There is a ton of sport race bikes for sale (GSXRs) and tons of 250's, but not much in between. I was shopping in the 500-750 range, but not considering anything too fast (sport/track/race/supersport).
12-25-2005, 02:58 PM
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Re: (PECO)
I did look at the 500's that Suzuki Kawaski had, but I was unsure if I wanted to go with a bigger bike. I thought it would be better if I got underpowered bike on purpose. That way I can concentrate on the basics like turning, braking, shifting, etc without worrying about getting overwhelmed by the power. I am definately not going to be breaking any speed records, but I'm worried about giving it too much throttle and having the bike come out from under me. When I go to the Kawaski dealership I think I'll check out the 500R too.
12-25-2005, 04:29 PM
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Re: (BlueShadow)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BlueShadow »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm worried about giving it too much throttle and having the bike come out from under me. </TD></TR></TABLE>
I thought the same thing, but with my new 750 so far I've managed to stall it way more times then I've given it too much throttle...i need alot of practice in 1st gear.
I thought the same thing, but with my new 750 so far I've managed to stall it way more times then I've given it too much throttle...i need alot of practice in 1st gear.
12-26-2005, 05:44 AM
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Re: (BlueShadow)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BlueShadow »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I did look at the 500's that Suzuki Kawaski had, but I was unsure if I wanted to go with a bigger bike. I thought it would be better if I got underpowered bike on purpose. That way I can concentrate on the basics like turning, braking, shifting, etc without worrying about getting overwhelmed by the power. I am definately not going to be breaking any speed records, but I'm worried about giving it too much throttle and having the bike come out from under me. When I go to the Kawaski dealership I think I'll check out the 500R too.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Its not like that....
It may seem like somthing that happens, But 99% of us will agree it does not happen often if ever. Once you get on the bike and ride you will get a feel for what it has, They are not jerky, Power comes on pretty realtive to car. You almost make it seem like Sport bikes are on and off. The best advice is just go take the MSF course or another local rider course before you buy the bike!!
On a side note, I went to the dealership and bought the best 600cc bike they had, I had my roomie drive it home (he had experince) Then i rode around the neighborhood for 4 hrs, stoping and going. That same night I was out riding in traffic!
Eric
Its not like that....
It may seem like somthing that happens, But 99% of us will agree it does not happen often if ever. Once you get on the bike and ride you will get a feel for what it has, They are not jerky, Power comes on pretty realtive to car. You almost make it seem like Sport bikes are on and off. The best advice is just go take the MSF course or another local rider course before you buy the bike!!
On a side note, I went to the dealership and bought the best 600cc bike they had, I had my roomie drive it home (he had experince) Then i rode around the neighborhood for 4 hrs, stoping and going. That same night I was out riding in traffic!
Eric
12-26-2005, 02:44 PM
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Re: (rainmanEK)
Well one of the reasons I'm looking at the 250R is because it will probably get dropped a few times while I'm learning to ride it. I would rather do it on a cheap $3000 bike, instead of a nice $5000 bike.
12-26-2005, 03:33 PM
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Re: (BlueShadow)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BlueShadow »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well one of the reasons I'm looking at the 250R is because it will probably get dropped a few times while I'm learning to ride it. I would rather do it on a cheap $3000 bike, instead of a nice $5000 bike.</TD></TR></TABLE>
You can buy a used bike and just have it checked by a bike shop.
My first bike was an 84 nighthawk 450, it was $450 bucks. Great first bike. And it was dropped.
There's plenty of cheap bikes out there. I wouldn't pay 3g's for a 250 Kawi. Plus, dropping the bike isn't such a big thing, I dropped that nighthawk in a parking lot thinking the kickstand was down.
You can buy a used bike and just have it checked by a bike shop.
My first bike was an 84 nighthawk 450, it was $450 bucks. Great first bike. And it was dropped.
There's plenty of cheap bikes out there. I wouldn't pay 3g's for a 250 Kawi. Plus, dropping the bike isn't such a big thing, I dropped that nighthawk in a parking lot thinking the kickstand was down.
12-26-2005, 07:57 PM
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Re: (newtothis)
I'm not buying a used bike. If I do it's going to be less then 5 years old, and I'm not gonna pay more then $2000 for one.
12-26-2005, 09:14 PM
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I just thinkbuying a new entry level bike isn't worth it. It's better to get a cheap used bike, get comfortable riding (make sure it's for you), then go and get yourself your new to semi-new sportbike of choice (636, 600RR. etc etc). At 3g's, you might as well spend a grand or so more on a bike like an F4i, or F4, or an SV, not a 250R (you'll outgrow that quickly).
But to each his own, good luck with whatever you choose.
But to each his own, good luck with whatever you choose.
12-26-2005, 10:43 PM
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Re: (snowman95)
My two CRX's that I own now are 14-15 years old...my last car was an RX-7 and at the time I owned the FD it was 10 years old. The next car that I buy will probably be used. Because of these reasons, I want a new bike.
12-27-2005, 01:12 AM
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Re: (BlueShadow)
I will say again, I was concerned about alot of the same things you have mentioned, but I have to say I am really glad I went with the 750 for a first bike. I am concerned about the power, but once you get out on the street with cars, its better to have power then not.
Riding a motorcycle has taught me one thing...THOSE PEOPLE WHO RIDE SCOOTERS IN THE STREET ARE F*$Y@*#$HJING INSANE!!!!!11111
Do what you gotta do, but I will say I was in your shoes a few months back, and I'm completely satisfied with purchasing a 750 as my first bike, and if I could do it all over again, I'd probably get a 'busa.
Riding a motorcycle has taught me one thing...THOSE PEOPLE WHO RIDE SCOOTERS IN THE STREET ARE F*$Y@*#$HJING INSANE!!!!!11111
Do what you gotta do, but I will say I was in your shoes a few months back, and I'm completely satisfied with purchasing a 750 as my first bike, and if I could do it all over again, I'd probably get a 'busa.
12-27-2005, 09:31 AM
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Almost any bike will do, as long as your respect it.
All bikes are dangerous, all bikes are fast (some more than others).
My favorite bike of all time was an F4i I had. So much so, that I want another one, but will most likely go with a 954 (it's essentially the same, only more power).
All bikes are dangerous, all bikes are fast (some more than others).
My favorite bike of all time was an F4i I had. So much so, that I want another one, but will most likely go with a 954 (it's essentially the same, only more power).
12-27-2005, 08:21 PM
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Re: (newtothis)
this is a great thread to read !!!
I am basically in the same situation, i would really appreciate it if you guys can give me some opinions as well.
I have been driving my scooter for almost 2 years, automactic Yamaha 125 cc, in Hong Kong. I have driven it on the highway, roads, everywhere. I have dropped it, I have had accident with it (a guy didn't stop when he is supposed to yield). I feel very confident driving on busy roads, I am a very careful guy on the roads, coz I assume nobody sees me when I am on a bike.
I have also driven my friend's 250 cc 2 stroke honda PGM III. It was NUTS !!! the power was incredible, I drove it for less than a week, and found it too small and very uncomfortable. But the power was crazy, but I managed to control myself and not drive too fast.
I want to move on to a sportsbike, wanting to get a R6 05' brand new. what's ur opinions? I am around 170 cm tall, weight around 145 pounds.
My concerns are I wont' be able to control this bike becuase it's too heavy, too powerful.
I wanted to get a 400 or 500 cc bike, but there is none out there.. brand new, because the old ones are really uncomforable and looks really old...
Any suggestions?
In terms of road experience, I think i am good enough. It's just my skills and techniques...
Thanks guys !!
I am basically in the same situation, i would really appreciate it if you guys can give me some opinions as well.
I have been driving my scooter for almost 2 years, automactic Yamaha 125 cc, in Hong Kong. I have driven it on the highway, roads, everywhere. I have dropped it, I have had accident with it (a guy didn't stop when he is supposed to yield). I feel very confident driving on busy roads, I am a very careful guy on the roads, coz I assume nobody sees me when I am on a bike.
I have also driven my friend's 250 cc 2 stroke honda PGM III. It was NUTS !!! the power was incredible, I drove it for less than a week, and found it too small and very uncomfortable. But the power was crazy, but I managed to control myself and not drive too fast.
I want to move on to a sportsbike, wanting to get a R6 05' brand new. what's ur opinions? I am around 170 cm tall, weight around 145 pounds.
My concerns are I wont' be able to control this bike becuase it's too heavy, too powerful.
I wanted to get a 400 or 500 cc bike, but there is none out there.. brand new, because the old ones are really uncomforable and looks really old...
Any suggestions?
In terms of road experience, I think i am good enough. It's just my skills and techniques...
Thanks guys !!
12-27-2005, 08:27 PM
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Re: (TurBoXBirD16)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TurBoXBirD16 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">this is a great thread to read !!!
I am basically in the same situation, i would really appreciate it if you guys can give me some opinions as well.
I have been driving my scooter for almost 2 years, automactic Yamaha 125 cc, in Hong Kong. I have driven it on the highway, roads, everywhere. I have dropped it, I have had accident with it (a guy didn't stop when he is supposed to yield). I feel very confident driving on busy roads, I am a very careful guy on the roads, coz I assume nobody sees me when I am on a bike.
I have also driven my friend's 250 cc 2 stroke honda PGM III. It was NUTS !!! the power was incredible, I drove it for less than a week, and found it too small and very uncomfortable. But the power was crazy, but I managed to control myself and not drive too fast.
I want to move on to a sportsbike, wanting to get a R6 05' brand new. what's ur opinions? I am around 170 cm tall, weight around 145 pounds.
My concerns are I wont' be able to control this bike becuase it's too heavy, too powerful.
I wanted to get a 400 or 500 cc bike, but there is none out there.. brand new, because the old ones are really uncomforable and looks really old...
Any suggestions?
In terms of road experience, I think i am good enough. It's just my skills and techniques...
Thanks guys !! </TD></TR></TABLE>
You sound to me like you are ready for a 600. Once you jump on one and ride for a week you will laugh at how intimidating they really arent. Just make sure you are comfortable with it before you start opening the throttle. How tall are you?
I am basically in the same situation, i would really appreciate it if you guys can give me some opinions as well.
I have been driving my scooter for almost 2 years, automactic Yamaha 125 cc, in Hong Kong. I have driven it on the highway, roads, everywhere. I have dropped it, I have had accident with it (a guy didn't stop when he is supposed to yield). I feel very confident driving on busy roads, I am a very careful guy on the roads, coz I assume nobody sees me when I am on a bike.
I have also driven my friend's 250 cc 2 stroke honda PGM III. It was NUTS !!! the power was incredible, I drove it for less than a week, and found it too small and very uncomfortable. But the power was crazy, but I managed to control myself and not drive too fast.
I want to move on to a sportsbike, wanting to get a R6 05' brand new. what's ur opinions? I am around 170 cm tall, weight around 145 pounds.
My concerns are I wont' be able to control this bike becuase it's too heavy, too powerful.
I wanted to get a 400 or 500 cc bike, but there is none out there.. brand new, because the old ones are really uncomforable and looks really old...
Any suggestions?
In terms of road experience, I think i am good enough. It's just my skills and techniques...
Thanks guys !! </TD></TR></TABLE>
You sound to me like you are ready for a 600. Once you jump on one and ride for a week you will laugh at how intimidating they really arent. Just make sure you are comfortable with it before you start opening the throttle. How tall are you?