FourthGenHatch

Ok here is the deal. Today I go outside and try and start my car and when I turn the key to I and II power comes on like it should, I can hear the fuel pump come on and I can hear fuel going to the throttle body. When I turn to the start position nothing happens except for a whirring sound. I had my Dad turn the key while I had my head under the hood and there is a sound coming from the Distributor. I took off the cap and the rotor was still on so that isn't the problem. I took out a spark plug and held it to the valve cover and had my Dad crank it and there was no spark. The starter also does not crank. My car worked fine yesterday and yesterday I also did my Battery in the trunk swap and everything worked fine then. I thought the starter was dead because it never tried to crank but I don't know cuz its not even a year old and worked strong all the time I've had it. I think it's a distributor problem. Does the starter have to work for the distrubutor to turn? What do you think it is.

Cliff notes: Car has fuel, power, no spark though and sound coming from the dizzy and the starter doesn't crank either.

Also not sure if it helps but when I turn to start it my fuel gauge rises really high and for some reason the left turn signal light comes on. I checked all the fuses and all of them are fine.


[Modified by FourthGenHatch, 7:41 PM 3/10/2003]

one slow d16

everything grounded properly? ECU throwing any codes?


[Modified by one slow d16, 3:29 PM 3/10/2003]

FourthGenHatch

It has no codes. I went out and checked the ground wires and still nothing.

I noticed a clicking sound coming from around the main relay though. My main relay is pretty new though.

How do I check if I have fuel, I think I hear the pump but maybe not.

Malgerus

Maybe the solenoid in the starter? Because I had a buddy who's civic crapped out, had good battery power, spark, fuel, and the starter turned out to be crap...

MAD SCIENTIST

put a test light to the positive side of the starter and a ground then try it.if the testlight comes on you need a starter.if not starter the search for the holy ground
wire


[Modified by MAD SCIENTIST, 3:00 AM 3/11/2003]

Hcivic88

so you're not getting spark and your starter wont crank??. are all the connections and everything still fine on the starter? not corroded or anything, just a clean connection? it could also be that your starters gone. and another thing. could your battery possibly be dead for some reason and its not giving the starter enough power to turn over the engine?? those are just a few things u could look at.
my guess would be to hook the battery up to a volt meter and see what kinda power it has.


[Modified by Hcivic88, 6:58 PM 3/10/2003]

MAD SCIENTIST

he wont get spark if its not cranking

swaplighter

he wont get spark if its not cranking

my thoughts exactly..

FourthGenHatch

Yeah see when I did my battery in trunk thing the old Negative Battery Terminal had a wire that went from the terminal to the body metal to the tranny. I removed that but the car worked. So tonight I put that part from the body metal to tranny back on and tried it and still nothing.

I also noticed the click from around the main relay. Like I said it is new. HOWEVER yesterday was very warm, today was freezing, and I know that thing hates temperatures.

Also my starter is like less than a year old. It's from Pep Boys which might explain it breaking cuz their stuff sucks I guess but I don't know.

We also pushed it down a hill and I tried to kick start it but I got nothing.

Hcivic88

hmm. you say that u tried jump starting too. so it shouldnt be your starter then. are all the ground grounded well? like to bare metal? when you moved the battery to the trunk, where did u ground it?
haha, how many times can u say ground


[Modified by Hcivic88, 7:12 PM 3/10/2003]

FourthGenHatch

I grounded it to the old spare tire hold down thing. My stereo, headlights, wipers, all that stuff still work. I understand maybe they take less power than a starter but I mean it is still connected some what.

FourthGenHatch

Another thing I noticed this morning was when I cranked my car I saw a puff of smoke rise above the gauge cluster area. It was very faint. My main relay was clicking tonight. You think it died? And why? It was warm yesterday and cold today. But its not even a year old. Do they die that easily?

Also you might note that I have 2 8 gauge wires going to my starter from when I did my battery in trunk. Do you think that fried it?

Hcivic88

The spare tire bolt hole should be ok, i think someone else used it on this board, although there are better places cause its only welded to the body, it would have probably been better if it were attached right to the floor or something. did you make sure to sand down to bare metal before you put the bolt in?
Stereos and wipers take up barely any power, so there may be a good enough contact for them, although like u said the starter does take up a lot more power than them. I still think that you should check over all your main grounds(from battery to chassis, the grounf from tranny bracket to chassis, and even thr ground that goes onto the starter if u havnt checked that yet. it should come out of the wiring harness.

no that shouldnt do it, the starter can only pull as much power as it needs, the extra wire shouldnt have done anything.

above the guage cluster area?? i dont know what could have blown up there. the main relay is down by the drivers kickpanel so I would think that you'd see the smoke coming from down there if it was coming from the relay.

[Modified by Hcivic88, 7:19 PM 3/10/2003]


[Modified by Hcivic88, 7:21 PM 3/10/2003]

one slow d16

i had a similar prob, my girls civic had a similar prob and both times it was a ground. what about the alternator? have you tested that?

FourthGenHatch

Alternator doesn't do anything until the car is already on though. So I can't see that as a problem. I'm going to inspect the grounds in the sunlight.

The main relay clicking is probably not what I think, cuz relays click anyway, thats what they do.

FourthGenHatch

My Dad said that the puff of smoke might have been like condensation getting heated up real fast or something. It never did it again so I'm not terribly worried. And yeah that smoke would have to travel up pretty fast to the cluster which I'm sure it did not.

Hcivic88

only thing i can tell ya to do is tomorrow, when its light outside, unbolt all the important grounds, clean em off and bolt em back up. it wont cost u anything, just a little bit of time, but at least then you can come back and say that it isnt a grounding problem. also, check to make sure the ground is still connected on the starter, that could have vibrated loose. also, if you have a voltmeter handy, u may want to check the battery, just to be sure that it isnt low, also something you can do that doesnt cost anything


[Modified by Hcivic88, 7:47 PM 3/10/2003]

FourthGenHatch

Yeah everyone basically says it is a ground. I haven't checked that starter ground I don't think but that would make sense wouldn't it.


[Modified by FourthGenHatch, 4:20 AM 3/11/2003]

FourthGenHatch

Ok I checked the grounds again and still I think they are fine. I hear the rapid clicking coming from around my main relay. Does the main relay control anything else besides the fuel, could it control starter and dist?

one slow d16

rapid clicking? last time i heard that i had a dying starter.

FourthGenHatch

I don't know my starter died before but the sound seemed different. What I'm going to do is buy a new starter and put that in. Worse case scenario is it doesn't work so I return it. I can hear fuel going to the TB mos def so unless Main Relay controls other non-fuel things then it must still work. This sucks!

But p.s. thanks to all you guys who are helping me out. Without H-T I would be f'ed!

***Also I remoted started my car and I hear a ping sound come from the starter itself so I'm sure it has power. It's probably dead. LESSON: DON'T BUY FROM PEP BOYS! EVER!

MAD SCIENTIST

did you do the test light thing i told you to do?this would have eliminated the possiblity of it being the starter but no one listens to the certified honda tech.look replace the damn starter.lets stop wasting time.if that doesnt work return the starter hook you car up stock again.then work from there

Vinceg99

OK is your car a 5 spd? Why dont you just try and push start it?? If it starts you know the main relay is OK and if it starts and its charging you know the grounds and alternator is OK. So then if all you had to do was push start it it would then be your starter.

FourthGenHatch

Hey guys the problem is fixed, go search through my post. You can stop yelling at me I fixed the problem, car runs.