CRX Toad

It would seem to me that you would want the adjustability of the radius rods such as the Z10 or Jimfab where you can help reduce/ eliminate wheel hop.

The crossmember isn't going to reduce wheel hop alone.

phatrick2332

For you guys asking how this is going to help with wheel hop and traction. The whole idea behind the aftermarket traction bars and this crossmember are to reduce the flex that you get with the oem crossmember. The adjustable radius rods on the FR,jimfab, etc. dont really do anything in terms of help for wheel hope but are just that..adjustable. If you are experiencing wheel hope with an OEM front crossmember and radius rod setup, buy either a brand new set of radius rod bushing or a set from ES and see what a difference it makes. That is why this crossmember will work just as good as a FR or jimfab at a fraction of the cost. If I am wrong here, please let me know.

doublek

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CRX Toad &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It would seem to me that you would want the adjustability of the radius rods such as the Z10 or Jimfab where you can help reduce/ eliminate wheel hop.

The crossmember isn't going to reduce wheel hop alone.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Adjustability of the radius rods? What is it that you can adjust on the radius rods from either company you mentioned?

Please explain because im trying to figure these things out. Thanks man.

doublek

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by phatrick2332 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">For you guys asking how this is going to help with wheel hop and traction. The whole idea behind the aftermarket traction bars and this crossmember are to reduce the flex that you get with the oem crossmember. The adjustable radius rods on the FR,jimfab, etc. dont really do anything in terms of help for wheel hope but are just that..adjustable. If you are experiencing wheel hope with an OEM front crossmember and radius rod setup, buy either a brand new set of radius rod bushing or a set from ES and see what a difference it makes. That is why this crossmember will work just as good as a FR or jimfab at a fraction of the cost. If I am wrong here, please let me know.</TD></TR></TABLE>


Thanks for the explination.....your opinion on this sounds pretty accurate to me. Anyone else with knowledge give there insight?

turbotommy

the ajustability is for when you bolt them on and get your car re-aligned and dialed in how you want it. i also dont see how using 10year old bushings will eliminate wheel hop, unless you get aftermarket ones. the bushing itself is the problem and until i saw this one ALL of the traction bar setups i've looked at have sucessfully eliminated this bushing....oh well, are you supplying the much need new bushings or will that decision be up to the customer?

not only are the aluminum bars much stronger but MUCH lighter...and when people are mod'ing rex's im sure they have weight in mind. speaking of weight, 15lbs?

[QUOTE=phatrick2332] The adjustable radius rods on the FR,jimfab, etc. dont really do anything in terms of help for wheel hope but are just that..adjustable. QUOTE]

hahahaha to false information

vegaskurt

Im learning new **** now so I am sorry for being dumb. I managed to avoid the suspension topic for to long now.

I called them twigs cause I remember being able to flex them when I was taking my tranny out. Guess I will get some new bushings and see if that helps out.

thanks for the info.

Andy R

By the end, you really don't drop that much weight. The weight of the aluminum swedge tubes and rod ends weigh just slightly less than the stock radius rod (4.5 lbs vs 3.3 lbs for each side). Depending on the actuall crossmember, you still not dropping much weight either...so you can pretty much eliminate 'weight savings' as a reason. Strength of the crossmember itself. Well the stock unit is likely stronger than most of the aftermarket designs i've seen. space savings..yes. adjustability for load...yes. reduce wheel hop...yes. You could put in poly bushings into the stock unit, but your still not going to get the stiffness as a spherical bearing. All the load is transfered through the spherical bearing and absorbed by the xmember and not any rubber/poly bushing. You can view this as a good or bad thing. Good for sloppy wheel hop..yes. Good for street drivability and not replacing bearings every 2 years..no.

Anyways, not sure where I was heading with this..but for the unit, you could easily addapt a swedge tube with spherical bearing rod ends. But the reason your only paying $200 is because there is no rod and bearings (quality bearings run $20 each and pair of swedge tubes run $30 = $110 just to add adjustability).

doublek

So basically from what i can get out of this is that .........this new crossmember along with using your oem radius rods and a new set of new Front LCA bushings (which is desperatly needed on all of our EFs) would then be considered a traction bar.(minus the radius rod adjustability).

Then do YOU believe that this would COMPLETLY eliminate wheel hop like other competitors can promise?

When i purchased one last night i originaly called in ordering a L-CON traction bar, (soon to find out that they dont sell them for EF's anymore) Tom then told me about there new design that was developed from Place Racings old design, of course with his knowledge he talked me into it. I wont question his knowlede one bit because i know hes really damn good. Im just looking for a little bit more explination on this new product.

Hell i guess I will find out this weekend when i install them. I just need to know if he recommends getting a new set of the front LCA bushings as well to completly elimate wheel hop like jimfab or full-races traditional TRACTION BAR which was the only reason I purchased these.


Modified by doublek at 4:28 PM 7/12/2005


Modified by doublek at 5:22 PM 7/12/2005


Modified by doublek at 5:22 PM 7/12/2005

Arvid

That crossmember looks really nice , and for $200 I may just have to order one.
Is it possible to jack up the car on that one ? I just love the central jacking point on the stock crossmember , would hate to lose it.

doublek

I have a questin for the creator of this topic please give your insight to all of us......

Do you like the new crossmember? Im curious because i just bought one also........did you replace your front lca bushings or did you stictly just bolt this one up? Do you feel this crossmember with oem radius rods and fifteen year old bushings are pretty equivalent to a "name brand" traction bar? Did it help in your wheel hop any, like a traction bar would?

I sent you this is a PM but i thought everyone on here would like to know! Thanks

turbotommy

yeah i was just thinking about the price....$200 cant beat that for this setup.

as far crossmemeber strength. the FR traction bar setup is the only one i know of that has sucessfully tested their bars to be extremely strong. "Full Race Traction bars are CAD designed. They are engineered with a factor of safety (FOS) of 5, meaning they are 5 times stronger than they need to be." &lt;-- off the site.

damn, you got the eg radiator to work *Selling point"

ripperbone

200 isnt a bad price for the crossmember at all.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Andy R &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> Anyways, not sure where I was heading with this..but for the unit, you could easily addapt a swedge tube with spherical bearing rod ends. But the reason your only paying $200 is because there is no rod and bearings (quality bearings run $20 each and pair of swedge tubes run $30 = $110 just to add adjustability).</TD></TR></TABLE>
Andy what did you use for yours when you built one, stock or made some?

Full-Race Geoff

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by phatrick2332 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> The whole idea behind the aftermarket traction bars and this crossmember are to reduce the flex that you get with the oem crossmember. The adjustable radius rods on the FR,jimfab, etc. dont really do anything in terms of help for wheel hope but are just that..adjustable</TD></TR></TABLE>

you are incorrect. The purpose of an aftermarket traction bar is such that it allows you to keep the lower control from moving (deflecting) to the front of the car. Under hard acceleration, the wheel pulls the car forwards. Becuase you are using a bushing, the bushing is compressed and the wheel is allowed to move forwards *without* the car. To clear this up:

Wheel hop is caused when the wheel moves forwards, without the car.

The control arms flex the bushings and cuase the alignment to go nuts. The car Toes out, and caster goes to hell. When using a radius rod setup like ours or Jimfabs, etc, the advantage of the metal heim joints is such that the wheel can only move as far forwards as the flex of the crossmember allows it to. Our design is extremely strong so the wheel can only move forwards about 6 thousandths of an inch. The Jimfab design would move forwareds about 25-30 thousandths and each weaker and weaker design allows the crossmember to flex and the wheel to move farther forwards.

chalesfoo

this is a replacement cross member not a traction bar..... to make your ef stogner without buying a tracion bar you can use the ES hard urethane inserts which our customer from above used... We could have sold him a taction bar but the ES inserts supposely helped him out enough without buying a traction bar so this is why we made this unit... for $200 you cant go wrong... add $30-40 for the inserts from ES and you got your self some major clearnace too..... also have front toe hooks and is very very solid

REMEMBER OURS COMES WITH EG HALF CORE RAIDATOR MOUNTS AND WE ALSO HAVE THE BRAKCETS TOO...!!!

2point2

that looks very nice!

turbotommy

well that clears things up a bit

to functioning radiator tabs

phatrick2332

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Full-Race Geoff &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">you are incorrect. The purpose of an aftermarket traction bar is such that it allows you to keep the lower control from moving (deflecting) to the front of the car. Under hard acceleration, the wheel pulls the car forwards. Becuase you are using a bushing, the bushing is compressed and the wheel is allowed to move forwards *without* the car. To clear this up: </TD></TR></TABLE>
Thank you for correcting my mistake

efcalvin

so do you still have to lean the half rad back a little, or does it sit normaly with the use of this bar?

chalesfoo

the EG half core raidator fits perfectly without leaning... WE did our homework... We also have the moutning brakcet too for extra... No cutting no welding all bolt on..!!! damn

RCautoworks

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by turbotommy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
not only are the aluminum bars much stronger </TD></TR></TABLE>

So you're saying aluminum is stronger then steel ?

Runnerdown

What a bunch of nerds some of you guys are. Do everyone a favor, If you dont know what your talking about then STFU I have the full race bar, it is extremely strong and well made. Props to camp for making a great bar also. The fact that is provides such good clearance and accepts a EG radiator makes it a great buy.

efcalvin

thanks

turbotommy

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 90blackcrx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

So you're saying aluminum is stronger then steel ?</TD></TR></TABLE>
no, the rod design is

chalesfoo

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Runnerdown &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What a bunch of nerds some of you guys are. Do everyone a favor, If you dont know what your talking about then STFU I have the full race bar, it is extremely strong and well made. Props to camp for making a great bar also. The fact that is provides such good clearance and accepts a EG radiator makes it a great buy.</TD></TR></TABLE>

thank you sir... at least someone understands

turbotommy

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by turbotommy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
hahahaha to false information</TD></TR></TABLE>