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1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
ok my head gasket is gonna blow soon i found antifreeze all over the front of my block, under my exh.mani., im workin with around 700 to 1000. i know i need the basics, timing set water pump, ect. im doing the work myself so ill save there, but what can i do with say 3 to 5 hundred bucks? im hoping to find some used stuff too like an intake, injectors, ect, so im thinkin a cam not full out race cam, but a "snappier than stock". ive heard of a few good places to look. what im lookin for is some one to one advice from someone whos been iin my shoes, and can help. oh, and time isnt an issue right now. and if youre gonna say "aduhhh..the search button workssf blah blah:wack:" i used it, got the info, ready for some fresh!..please... and i did use the search button.., its called google and it linked me to honda-forums.com....for those who have constuctive feed back, thank-you for your help.
exsisting: 89 crxsi d16a6. vin verified cold air, msd xternal. flowmaster, but sounds like farts :thumbdown: could use some help there too plz. im pretty good at following direction so i was thinking of a do it yourself port and polish, and a thinner head gasket. if that would made a diff.. too...like i said, ive got a little time and im brand new to hondas. this is my first, so again thank you. |
Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
you wnat boost or all motor?
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
a good start would to look at an ES tuning muffler, there cheap and sound nice and quiet till u jump on the throttle
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
efjunky, im glad you mentioned that cuz eventualy im going to get a turbo kit so i wanted something to kinda tied me over then work well with a little boost. and jdm civic, es tuning? does it sound comparible to an hks? ive heard one of those and it soiunded real nice. it was 00 honda, not sure what it had but it wasnt joking
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
ya you can either buy an actual kit and log type manifold or do a junkyard type build with a crx hf exhaust manifold
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
If I had a D16 with a blown head gasket and 1000 laying around, I would drive the motor until it blew up while saving another $600, and buy myself a B16 swap. You have a LOT more room to grow with a B16 than you do with that D...
If you drop $1600 into that D with its head gasket about to blow, it will not be half as good as stock B16 swap. It will take you more than $1600 to get that little D up to par with a B16 given the condition of your motor... Drop another $2k on a turbo kit and a tune, and you're likely to graduate into the 300hp club. Just my .02... |
Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
yeah, but aasarsak, just your .02 cost me like 36hunet..:beer: im fixing my little d. i just wanted to do little bump of performance man. i replace that head gasket. throw a cam in it, intake, header, and i got a fun car to play with.. i want to start slow, this is my first time dealing with a honda as far as gettin into the motor and all. besides, i dont want this chassis. im not lookin to be with the 300 club. 180 200s good for me now. i want to build something that i can use. so if i fix my head, turbo cam - the turbo, dependable fun car till i save for a turbo, (chipping away at suspension while saving for the turbo) the i have, hopefully, 150-200hp go cart, and i didnt even have to cut a wire....i will however have the ecu worked on. wich is another thing im curious about. these "chips"? do they work? or can i have someone work on my computer for my power upgrades to work?
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
Originally Posted by jayel79
(Post 37262578)
yeah, but aasarsak, just your .02 cost me like 36hunet..:beer:
As far as that other stuff you said about saving up for a turbo, you are wasting your money in my opinion. It is going to cost you way too much money to get to where you want to go in that D motor. It will probably cost you half as much if you just went with a B16 up front. And I would never recommend that somebody buy a "one size fits all" ECU chip. That is the best way to get an improper A/F ratio, and a blown or overly rich running motor. The only "work" that should be done on an ECU is to get some type of tunable hardware like CROME, UBERDATA, NEPTUNE, AEM EMS, E-TUNE, etc. and get your motor tuned properly. Motors are like fingerprints. No two are alike. Each motor needs to be tuned for the setup currently installed on it. Another bad thing about chipping is that once you install another performance part, the program on your chip instantly becomes obsolete and even more dangerous... Stay away from chips, and D series money pits... Disclaimer* I know there are guys out there with sick D series, but they are generally guys who have experience building motors, and/or a bigger budget. All I'm saying is that for a guy on a budget who wants to make 200 WHP some day soon, I would not recommend going the D route. And throwing a cam in an untuned, unmodified motor is like throwing lighter fluid on a log that hasn't caught fire yet. I'm not trying to flame you, I'm trying to save you time and a big headache and a broken heart. After you put in your cam, exhaust, and turbo kit, you will be about $3000 broker, and about 20 - 60 WHP short of your goal. Now if you dump that kind of money into a B16, I guarnatee you will easily hit the 300 WHP mark... |
Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
not true if you picked up Issue 7: Project Car CRX vs. Super Street Magazine's Civic Si of project car magazine the boosted d walked the b16 hatch.....
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
was the B16 boosted too?
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
and who built the D?
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
listen homie, 3600 was when i turboed the b16...im not a fool and also not trippin so i know im not getting 200 with 1600...hence the "youre two cents cost me 36hunnet.. i wasnt trying to insult your intelligence, but ,again, if i fix the head gasket, while im doing so, put a turbo cam in my head, put it back together, run it the way it is,noe this is the tricky part that threw you of,SAVE WHILE I DRIVE THE CAR FOR A TURBO..it have a kinda snappy car,WHILE SAVING for the turbo id chip away at suspension, then when i piut my turbo together, itll already have a turbo cam in it,then id have a 150-200 whp go cart...you understand now? power cost money, not a moron, just new to hondas....
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
no it was an allmotor b16 with a lightweight flywheel and the crx used the hatch's old engine and it was completely stock with like 300k on it or something they just used a rx hf exhaust manifold and a dsm turbo i think and beat the b16 on like 6 or 8lbs can't emember for sure and a base map type deal and i'm pretty sure they spent less money too....
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
you can swap oout the sohc zc cam in the d16a6 head. which from what i was told is a peppier cam because of how its high end performs. maybe make the block higher compression and basically build yourself a zc or work with the head and have it port and polished for the amount of money you have. build yourself strong gearing. cause not all the power is just in motor.
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
yes i had a d15b2 bottom end with 1.6l head and a single cam zc cam it ran really well....
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
Before you start spending the $$$ I'd spend some time on the tear down first so assess the damage.
If the head or block is warped beyond repair, no use buying a stage X cam for it. HG kits can easily be bought for $35-40 for our blessed cheap engines. A machine shop can machine it flat and pressure test it for no more than $50. HG can be cheap, I'd fix it, and save the dough for a future build or a faster honda (if you think 4 wheels is fun, try 2!!! That's what my inner Geezerdom is telling you bro. More parts swapped out = more variables that could go wrong. |
Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
if the head or block is warped you can get either of them milled
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
do a mini me with either a z6 or y8 head! get some vtec in your life!
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
lol at this guy and his b series, no offense to b series guys just saying open your horizens, there are good things about d series too, and if someone wants d, dont try to detour them away from it, hes not making any mistakes doing so....just because you have b you think everyone should
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
Originally Posted by ef_junky
(Post 37269009)
they just used a rx hf exhaust manifold and a dsm turbo i
1. Not designed for turbos (no place to bolt it up) it would have to be welded on 2. If someone wanted to WELD a turbo to an HF exhaust manifold, (which would be extremely stupid, rediculous, and pointless) the turbo would be mounted underneath the car because that is where the final collector is located which would make the charge piping a plumbing nightmare, and extremely innefficient and expensive. 3. non-turbo exhaust manifolds do not have a bung for a wastegate which means that the turbo would spool until it overheated or blew the motor (unless he used a turbo that had an internal wastegate). I could go on, but for argument sake, I will stop here.
Originally Posted by ef_junky
(Post 37269009)
a base map type deal and i'm pretty sure they spent less money too....
1. The base map for a CRX HF will not sustain a turbo because the stock ECU will throw a code and go into limp mode as soon as it sees anything more than 1 lb. of boost. This will hinder efficiency, and consequently, performance. 2. If they DID use the stock motor and somehow figured out how to get that DSM turbo to mount to the HF exhaust manifold like you said, the only way it would possibly run is if they used a MAP bypass valve and an FMU (caveman tuning tools) which are not even truly tunable. They are just cheap ways to trick the ECU into believing that there is not turbo installed. 3. If they had the turbo bolted up with the MAP bypass valve AND the FMU, they MIGHT be able to get it to run, but then you will have a problem with the injectors. I believe the flow rate on the stock CRX injectors is about 180cc/min which means that they are only capable of supporting a maximum of about 35 WHP per injector. This shows that the maximum power output of a CRX motor with OEM injectors is approximately 140 WHP which is about 170 HP at the crank. 3.5 Keep in mind that this rate of fuel will have to be continuously sustained in order to maintain a safe A/F ratio. This means that the injectors will be at or near peak capacity continuously. Fuel injectors are generally designed to operate at around 40-60% duty cycle. This will predispose his injectors to premature failure which may lead to a lean mixture and/or detonation, which we all know translates to wonderful things like rods through engine blocks and warped heads. 4. Turboing a D MIGHT be slightly faster than a B16, but it will definitely cost more money to make it run well. The B is the best way to go for good power and reliability plus plenty of room to grow. All that being said, it IS possible to put the smack down on a B16 with a D motor, BUT like I said above, it would either require more engine building experience and/or more budget. The bottom line is that I advised this guy to not waste his money on that D because he is obviously not experienced at building motors, so I seriously doubt he will be able to figure out how to get a DSM turbo to work with his HF manifold. Come to think about it... I don't even think I could figure out how to do that. In other words, like I said... pound for pound and dollar for dollar IN MY OPINION this guy would be MUCH better off investing in a B16 because he will have to slap a turbo on his D just to get to the level of a B16, and he still won't be able to touch his 200HP goal on that budget with a D... With that, I am going to rest my case, because obviously this guy has already made up his mind, so I'm not going to waste any more of my time trying to talk him out of it... |
Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
Originally Posted by justa4banger
(Post 37275736)
lol at this guy and his b series, no offense to b series guys just saying open your horizens, there are good things about d series too, and if someone wants d, dont try to detour them away from it, hes not making any mistakes doing so....just because you have b you think everyone should
Wrong. This guy presented us with a scenario, and based on the scenario he gave me, I gave him my opinion on what I thought his best option was. Now if he told me that he had been building honda motors for years, and knew a little bit about tuning, then I would have told him to go with a mini me because of the many advantages of VTEC. I have had my fair share of ass whoopins from D guys in the past even though I am running B16. I have nothing but respect for the D guys. I just think that a B is a better platform for beginners because you don't have to change anything about the internals, head, or block to make them quick. If he tries to build his D, he is going to have to swap his cam, possibly his entire head, run a VTEC line, swap out his ECU, cut up his wiring harness, and who knows what else. Slapping a turbo on a stock B16 vs. slapping a turbo on a stock D will yield completely different results. The stock B will outperform the stock D any day of the week. Yes, the D can compete, but only if the guy knows what he is doing and can afford the parts to make it possible for him to compete. At a minimum, the D will need a turbo kit, ECU, fuel pump, and injectors. This isn't counting all the basics that need to be done to the motor just to ensure that it is "safe" to turbo charge such as basic tune up, compression/leak down test, valve adjustment, the correct spark plugs, the list goes on and on. These simple diagnostics could lead to all sorts of other repairs. He already told us that it needs a head gasket. What if his head is warped? What if his block is warped? Might as well pull the 300,000 mile motor since he might have to do it anyway, and drop in a 35,000 mile B... |
Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
ya i was once a full d-series guy but when i had to buy another ar i found this one, aasarask yes you can use an hf manifold do some research buddy they make an addapter and i've seen plenty of people use them, and they may not have used a base map i haven't looked at the article in a while and ouldn't find it on any search boards, and i said a base map type deal not ya i'm for sure they used a base map so don't get you panties in a bundle there. and why would he have to run a vtec line for f**k single cam vtec it suck giant chewwbaka balls, and to keep his d and turbo it would be cheaper then buying a b16 to put in there then he has to spend more money to turbo it. i mean if he wants a full blown race ar i guess go with single am vtec but whats wrong with an a6 with a little bit of get up and go?
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
Are you missing the "C" key on your keyboard? If so, I have an extra one that I would me more than willing to mail you.
You said it would be cheaper to keep his D and turbo it than buying a B16. I disagree. Why? Because the guy told us that his head gasket is about to blow. What are the potential causes of head gasket failure? 1. Detonation 2. Warped head 3. Warped block etc... need I go on? This guy's head gasket is about to blow because his motor needs major mechanical repairs such as: 1. Detonation could be caused by a number of things including worn rings. 2. Remove, mill, pressure test, and replace the head 3. remove, mill, replace the block How much do you think all that is going to cost? Average labor rate is about $50 per hour. Pulling the head is going to cost him at least 4 hours of labor. That is $200 right there. Pressure testing it, and potentially milling it will cost him about another $50, and another $200 to put the head back on. That's almost $500 just to remove and replace the head! What if his block is warped too? Look, what I'm trying to say is that none of us knows how bad of shape this guy's motor is in. Just a head gasket alone is going to cost around $75. Even if he completely rebuilds the engine himself (which I doubt he has the time, money, or ability to do) it is going to cost him more time and money than just doing a simple B16 swap. With a JDM B16 swap, he will get a motor that has an average of about 35,000 miles on it as compared to his current motor which probably has over 200,000 miles on it. The total cost for the swap, including mounts, shift linkage, and axles will run him about $1600. All he will need to do the swap is an H-T motor swap thread, a buddy and a case of beer. Why put him through the hassle of pulling the block and the head, checking for leakage and warpage, replacing the head gasket, praying that the rings are still good, buying an adapter plate, hoping that the turbo kit works perfectly, blah blah blah... Just keep it simple for an inexperienced Honda guy. Do you get what I'm saying? |
Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
hey i thank you guys for your help, but it seems like it caused an argument more that it helped me. im now thinkin of getting a cheap, 93 civic with a vtec 1.6 in it, and do upgrades to it, build the block from my crx to handle a turbo and not shoot rods the first time i use it, find a vtec head, 1 to 350, pref. already to go, and drop it in th rex, use my civic for ecu, and other needs and have a sohc vtech, turboed. then when i get sick of that, ill have much more expirience, and look for th dohc. it does seem like it would be fun to have a tc crx.....just not now.
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Re: 1 blown hd gasket=reasons for speed parts
Sounds good to me. Good luck with that. Be sure to keep a copy of the EF service manual handy in case you get stuck. Here is a link to the manual in case you don't have it already...
http://hondatech.info/downloads/Auto/Manuals/Civic/ |
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