SOHC_MShue

I have a zex 59300 cam in my y8 head. I have it set to 3 degrees advanced on my cam gear which since its a z6 cam comes out to be about 2 degrees retarded. For some reason the farthest I can get the ignition timing advanced is only about 15 degrees. This is with the dizzy fully advanced. It seems that the more I retard my cam timing the less I can advance the ignition timing. Maybe its just the ecu i'm running...its a p28 chipped by hyperduck and I have a j's racing program in there right now. Anybody else having a similar problem running a z6 cam in a y8 head?

TeamNextGenChris

sounds like your cam timing may be off a tooth.recheck it.
Chris

TABIAS

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SOHC_MShue &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> Anybody else having a similar problem running a z6 cam in a y8 head?</TD></TR></TABLE>

i did.... but then i got a b18c hatch..... yummy

SOHC_MShue

no its not off. I've checked. Besides wouldn't it be running like **** if it was off that much? My car runs fine, but i'm just wondering why I can't get the ignition timing advanced to where I want it to be.

TeamNextGenChris

theonly reason i can think of that it would be off is if the cam timing was off,or the keyways in the cam are off a few degrees either for the cam gear keyway or the distributor keyway.
just to make sure-you are shorting the CEL jumper and checking the timing at the right RPM?
the car won't necessarily run really crappy if it's off a tooth.i've done it before,and the car ran decent,but definately not at 100% performance.
Chris

SOHC_MShue

well I checked it today and its definantely timed correctly. Cam and crank line up perfect. So what is the proper rpms that I should be checking the timing at? Just wherever it idles to once warmed up and everything. It idles somewhere around 600-800 rpms once warm. I think thats probably close enough to 750. I am also jumping the service connector when I set timing.

TeamNextGenChris

sounds like you have all the bases covered as far as setting the timing.off the top of my head i wanna say that 750 RPM is the right speed to check it at.
i wouldn't think that your small adjustment on the cam gear would dramatically change your timing range of adjustment.only thing i can think of is if the cam is ground a little off center.
i'm assuming you never had any problems with the stock cam?
chris

SOHC_MShue

well I never actually tried setting timing with stock cam. The thing is that my buddy that posted up in the beginning of this thread "preacherboy" couldn't get his past 18 degrees either with cam timing set to 5 degrees advance(actually 0 because of the y8 head) when he had a similar setup in his sohc coupe. So i'm guessing its just because i'm running the z6 cam in a y8 head. I was just wondering if other people have had similar problems with this cam in their y8 head.

Downey

i had a similar problem with my D16Z6 just recently. both cam gear and crank were lined up dead straight and my timing was way advanced. with the distributor all the way retarted the timing was still at 18 degress advanced. i had to move the timing belt back one tooth, and everything was cool.

you might wanna try moving the belt forward one tooth.

hows that header doing man? i wish i still had it.. i wanna buy another one. let me know how the cam works out. where did u get it and how much was it?

SOHC_MShue

hmmm...i'll have to try that. Maybe it is off by one tooth then. What car and motor setup are you running now? Have another sohc setup? Yea man the header is doing great. I love it so much. I'm not even sure where you would get another one though? I like having it because no one else I know of has one. As for the cam I got it from Nipponpower.com for I think it was $260 or something. I really like the cam a lot and with that and my p28 running the j's racing program the car pulls really strong all the way up to 7400 where I have to shift. I really need to upgrade my valvetrain so I can rev higher.

Downey

now im running a 95 D16Z6 engine/tranny. itr aem cold air, stock z6 header, stock cat and RS*R exhaust. have a 7.5 lbs Clutchmasters flywheel and ACT HD-SS clutch. feels better than my old engine. now i just want a header for it. cam and ecu chip sound good to. but i shouldnt mod this motor too much, im gonna do a B18C5 swap soon

dsadas89das78934

sohc... when you adjust the cam timing, you also adjust your ignition timing...

think about it.. the distributor is indexed into the cam, so when you change the pahse with which the cam runs with the crank, you change your possible ignition timing range.

SOHC_MShue

yea i know that, but should my range have changed that much. A guy with a similar setup on the alternative honda d series board said he got his cam to -3 retarded(2 advanced since its in a y8 head) and he still got his timing set to 18 degrees easy.

Jim Truett

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SOHC_MShue &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">its a p28 chipped by hyperduck and I have a j's racing program in there right now. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Ask them what the base timing is set to at idle. It should be around 16.5 degrees. You can shift the distributor zero in relation to the cam zero by retarding or advancing the entire ignition tables with a rom editor. You may consider looking into a custom program to set your timing properly.

SOHC_MShue

eh...i don't think i'm gonna go to all that trouble right now. Plus i'm poor I'm just trying to figure out if my timing belt may be off by a tooth like downey said it may be. What do you guys think? Can anyone who has ran this same setup (zex 59300 cam in a y8 head) comment on how far they could advance their ignition timing at certain cam settings?

Jim Truett

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SOHC_MShue &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">eh...i don't think i'm gonna go to all that trouble right now. Plus i'm poor I'm just trying to figure out if my timing belt may be off by a tooth like downey said it may be. What do you guys think? Can anyone who has ran this same setup (zex 59300 cam in a y8 head) comment on how far they could advance their ignition timing at certain cam settings?</TD></TR></TABLE>

It could be nearly free. You can research at http://www.pgmfi.org and program it yourself. If you find out how far your distributor is off in relation to the cam, let me know.

SOHC_MShue

alright thanx man I was thinking about it and shouldn't I have even more room to advance the ignition timing because I had to advance the cam to work in the y8 head. The only thing I can think of is maybe the keyslot for the dizzy in relation to where the slot on the other end for the cam gear is different between the two cams? Is there a difference between the keyway relations of the z6 and y8 cams? If not then i guess maybe I'm off by a tooth on the timing belt. Its weird though because the car already feels fine and pulls really hard. I would think that if it was a tooth off then it would run pretty bad.

SOHC_MShue

bump

SOHC_MShue

anybody know about the relation of the keyslots or have a z6 cam in a y8 head and can comment on this topic?

dsadas89das78934

maybe check d-series.org

SOHC_MShue

yea i've been looking on alternative honda

builthatch

z6 cam keyways are 4 degrees or so retarded compared to y8. sounds like you have a z6 cam in your y8. the distributor mounts do not allow for any further adjustment past like 17-18. you need to elongate the slots by filing or something

y8 gear


d16a1 gear, but same keyway location of z6


see how the keyway location of the top y8 gear is moved to the left a bit, about 4-5 degs advanced vs. the z6

Modified by builthatch at 4:44 PM 2/3/2004


Modified by builthatch at 5:14 PM 2/3/2004

SOHC_MShue

are you sure 17 or 18 is the max I will be able to get on the dizzy with the z6 cam in my y8 head? Also I now have discovered something new. It appears that I have a z6 cam gear instead of a y8 cam gear like I thought I had. I was looking at my str cam gear box and the part number matched that of their z6 cam gear and not their y8. I also took off the bolt holding my cam gear to the cam to check the cam gear and it looks like the keyway is not a few degrees to the left of the up mark like pictured on the y8 camgears, but seems to be more inline with it like on the z6 camgears. Maybe its my eyes playing tricks, but thats what It looks like to me. Is there any sure way to check? I would think that If I had a z6 cam gear then my timing would be thrown way off or maybe I could just set the cam timing to 0 and it would actually equal zero. I tried setting it to zero and the car got real slugish down low and midrange and pulled really hard up top past 6k, but where I had it set still feels best. Also with it set at zero the farthest I could get my ignition timing was 6 degrees advanced .

SOHC_MShue

oh btw I also tried advancing a full tooth on the timing belt like you guys said and it threw my timing pretty far off and the car ran like poop so I know I had everything lined up tdc as far as the cam gear and the crank.

builthatch

compare your gear to this stock y8 one...



the most important marks are the side marks and their relation to the keyway...also, note where the marks are in relation to the teeth, in the middle of a tooth, in the middle of a valley, etc...

everything should be like this gear or it is WRONG.