Bavarian330

Hello,

over the weekend I picked up a 98 Civic Ex with a manual gear box. The car has 124k and is extremely clean all things considering. This morning, I changed the oil/filter with Royal Purple synthetic etc. and added some Lucas fuel injector cleaner in the tank. Next weekend I will flush the cooling system and tackle the manual trans fluid change. However, I have no prior service history, am I flipping a coin with the transmission health by changing the fluid at 124k? Also, if I get the green light from the forum, what would be a high quality trans fluid to use?

Best,
Justin

Bavarian330

Also, any particular coolant I should use?

Fnix

iTrader: (1)

It wouldnt hurt. I use Honda OEM Trans fluid and diluted prestone coolant. If you live in a warmer climate and track your car you can use distilled water instead of coolant.

Bavarian330

Ok, I was just making sure because I know there is a general rule of thumb that if you haven't change the trans fluid after 100k....you should just leave it...because it can cause significant damage to the transmission

the171

oem mtf is perfectly good. redline makes a nice mtf also. have heard good things about torco fluid but haven't tried it. As for coolant... i don't think its quite as drastic a choice... any 50/50 mix has worked for me.

shotoutacc0rd

IV heard this before about autos but IV never hear it for manuals. Personally I think its just that people use crap fluid, which will hurt the transmission.

try GM synchromesh

nub

New to you, used vehicle with no service records. Go through every maintenance item as your budget allows. This way you know where you stand and can start regular service intervals for everything. The timing belt and associated items should be a priority if previous service is unknown at your mialage.

To your trans fluid question...regular 10W-30 NON synthetic motor oil, GM Syncromesh is a good mix.

Don't use the currently available Honda MTF. It's thin as water and better suited for newer transmissions, not to mention it's overpriced.

B serious

iTrader: (1)

No, you're not going go hurt a MANUAL trans by changing fluid that hasn't been changed in a long time. This rule only applies to auto transmissions...and even then only applies to actual flushes....not drain and fills.

Honda MTF is neither too thin nor overpriced. Amazon has bottles for $7.75 shipped (if you have amazon prime). Otherwise, dealers sell it for about $9/qt. You need 2qts (around 1.5-1.75 go in the trans).

Torco MTF also works well. I started using this on cars that I track. I really like the hot temp performance. You'll probably never see those temps on the street though.

Some people like 10W30 non synthetic, but I feel like the trans shifts like **** when it's cold.

Honda OEM coolant is what I use. Or prestone 50/50 if immediate availability is an issue. Don't use tap water if you're going to try to flush the cooling system.

Bavarian330

Thanks everyone and B serious, that was exactly what I was looking for. I will pick up Coolant and MTF fluid from the dealership and do both jobs this weekend. I will let everyone know how it goes! After that, brakes & power steering fluid and I think thats it for fluid refresh.

Best,
Justin

shotoutacc0rd

are you kidding? You're forgetting windshield washer and blinker fluid

B serious

iTrader: (1)

Just make sure the power steering fluid comes from the dealer or you're going to have huge problems.

If you're buying dealer coolant, wait to put it in until you change your t belt/water pump and thermostat. That coolant is a little spendy...but it's good stuff. Might as well not do the job twice.

Bavarian330

Basically, everyone should be sourced through the dealer with the exception of brake fluid and engine oil where you can find higher grade oils for the vehicle...

B serious

iTrader: (1)

^Yeah, that's kind of how I roll.

TomCat39

From the tranny experts I've spoken too the Honda MTF is not as good as it used to be for our older cars. It's now formulated for the newer tranmissions and is considered "acceptable" for the older manuals. Doesn't mean it's the best any more just acceptable.

Torco MTF is touted best out there for street use in our older transmissions while Torco RTF is what is touted as the track fluid of choice.

Many street users tout Redline but I haven't seen it recommended by tranny rebuilders unlike Torco.

From the rebuilders it's either non synthetic 10w30 or Tocro MTF.

GM/Penzoil Synchromesh with Molyslip MT additive is supposedly good but I don't like how it shifts when cold. Still driving on it and it hasn't killed my tranny yet but can't say it's as nice. Winter time it sucks too for shifting into 1st while moving until warm.

B serious

iTrader: (1)

I keep hearing about how Honda MTF is too thin and not meant for older transmissions. Idk...I've had no issues using it in my ITR, GSR, EM1, AP1, TSX, AP2, FG2, BB6, EJ8, or any other old or new honda I've used it in. I've even used it on cars that I've heavily tracked.

Torco MTF is great stuff though. I'm not sure it's needed for a street driven D series....but it couldn't hurt. I bought a case of 12 on amazon for $110. Small quantity price is about $15/bottle.

I use RGO in my diff (S2000). Also very good stuff. But I can't bring myself to use it in my trans....even for track use.

TomCat39

Yeah, not really sure. I've heard it doesn't protect as well once hot like it used to. Older formulas of Honda MTF provided better hot protection. Worked well in my tranny with Molyslip but who's to say if the wear was a little heavier. Maybe instead of 20 years before rebuild it only lasts 15.... Not like I'm ever going to know the difference.

tony_2018

Are you sure its not 5w30, manual states you can use 5w30 if mtf could not be source. I would assume synthetic would best be used for tranny but now thinking about the abuse it takes on more than the engine maybe a non-synthetic would do the job.

TomCat39

Yeah I'm sure it's 10w30 conventional oil that is recommended by the rebuilders while the manual says 5w30. Doesn't the manual imply 5w30 as a temporary solution? I think 10w30 conventional is considered a solid replacement for MTF. I guess it has all the characteristics that older Honda MTF had before it was changed to it's latest formula so can be used for a full service interval.

Also for some reason full synthetic is harder on the synchros so I guess it causes faster wear. I suspect it has to do with less additive package to synthetic over conventional. Conventional is full off additives to meet certain specs while synthetic meets those specs by engineered oil molecules. I'm willing to bet it's the additives that helps protect the synchros better.

tony_2018

Yes, 5w30 is a temp solution.

B serious

iTrader: (1)

I'm going to guess that Honda MTF is some sort of synthetic lightweight oil with zinc and other additives...as well as tons of friction modifier. It's made by Idemitsu.

tony_2018

I've used it will no ill effects but if you're tracking or abusing it day to day than I suggest something more on the perfomance line.

ej6fade

I would change the fluid regardless, easy job and shouldn't take more than 15-20 minutes tops. Amsoil Manual Synchromesh Transmission fluid is all I use, and I'd swear by it. I currently have a used 92 ex trans mated to my zc, when I got it (was low on cash at the time and needed a trans asap, cost $100) slight grind in second and third, didn't feel or shift that great, with Amsoil it is smooth as butter, shifts perfect, much smoother than the oem mtf. I don't track my mileage, I just change it once a year.

tony_2018

Thats what you call a band-aid, and luckily its still holding on.

ej6fade

Thank you for telling me what I already know. Amsoil still makes great products

lostforawhile

there are two kinds of Honda MTF now use the early one, or syncromesh