reasonable modifications for a b16 that are worth the money.
12-07-2007, 12:08 PM
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reasonable modifications for a b16 that are worth the money.
preface: dont tell me to search. there are lots of other opinions out there that are pretty inconclusive and far too subjective. i know this seems like this has been asked way too many times, but i feel my goals are different than a lot of other peoples, especially those in the archives.
are there any good, cost effective, and inexpensive power mods for a 99 si? i do not plan on ever popping the head, swapping, or forced induction any time soon and when i do i will research for that kind of project.
it seems like a lot of people have the standard i/h/e, but are they really getting anywhere with it? does anybody know of any solid resources that show evidence of a significant gain on any bolt on or other mod?
i really would like objective posts but this is ht so i guess i am stuck with whatever you feel like giving me...
cliff notes: are there any worthy modifications for a 99 si short of rebuild, swap, or turbo? facts only.
are there any good, cost effective, and inexpensive power mods for a 99 si? i do not plan on ever popping the head, swapping, or forced induction any time soon and when i do i will research for that kind of project.
it seems like a lot of people have the standard i/h/e, but are they really getting anywhere with it? does anybody know of any solid resources that show evidence of a significant gain on any bolt on or other mod?
i really would like objective posts but this is ht so i guess i am stuck with whatever you feel like giving me...
cliff notes: are there any worthy modifications for a 99 si short of rebuild, swap, or turbo? facts only.
12-07-2007, 12:12 PM
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Re: reasonable modifications for a b16 that are worth the money. (thisisntjared)
You really can't gain too much without busting open the engine or FI.
A good 4-2-1 header (no eBay generic crap), CAI, test pipe, and catback will do only to a certain extent.
A good 4-2-1 header (no eBay generic crap), CAI, test pipe, and catback will do only to a certain extent.
12-07-2007, 12:32 PM
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Re: reasonable modifications for a b16 that are worth the money. (thisisntjared)
I'd say CTR cams. I know you don't wanna do anything major like that, but cam swap isn't too bad.
Other than that, a really sick header. Like a Toda or SMSP
I made 178whp with my all motor stock bottom end B16 with Skunk2 stage 2s, w.e bolt ons and a fake ITR header, but it still felt slow
Other than that, a really sick header. Like a Toda or SMSP
I made 178whp with my all motor stock bottom end B16 with Skunk2 stage 2s, w.e bolt ons and a fake ITR header, but it still felt slow
12-07-2007, 12:39 PM
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Re: reasonable modifications for a b16 that are worth the money. (thisisntjared)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by thisisntjared »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
i really would like objective posts but this is ht so i guess i am stuck with whatever you feel like giving me...
</TD></TR></TABLE>
search somewhere else then. you ask about something that has been discussed endlessly and by now is common knowledge. it is what it is. the b16 doesnt make power from just cheap "inexpensive" bolt-ons.
tip: dont dis the people who you are asking for help if you really want their help.
i really would like objective posts but this is ht so i guess i am stuck with whatever you feel like giving me...
</TD></TR></TABLE>
search somewhere else then. you ask about something that has been discussed endlessly and by now is common knowledge. it is what it is. the b16 doesnt make power from just cheap "inexpensive" bolt-ons.
tip: dont dis the people who you are asking for help if you really want their help.
12-07-2007, 01:09 PM
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Re: reasonable modifications for a b16 that are worth the money. (SkoundrelUSA)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SkoundrelUSA »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I made 178whp with my all motor stock bottom end B16 with Skunk2 stage 2s, w.e bolt ons and a fake ITR header, but it still felt slow</TD></TR></TABLE>
It felt slow cause the b16 is the torque less wonder. hp is good but tq is prob in the 105-110wtq range.
most of the comments in ht arent bad since some of it is based off of objective material. It's just our job to filter out what's
and what's real.
Search http://www.dragtimes.com for honda civic si. They have objective numbers and some specs for comparisons.
If you're looking at the ihe route, check out this link for what it can do on an ex. your results should be in the area percentage wise.
http://www.hondatuningmagazine....html
Dollar for dollar, your best bet is turbo. That's my opinion but see sig for objective proof.
I made 178whp with my all motor stock bottom end B16 with Skunk2 stage 2s, w.e bolt ons and a fake ITR header, but it still felt slow
</TD></TR></TABLE>It felt slow cause the b16 is the torque less wonder. hp is good but tq is prob in the 105-110wtq range.
most of the comments in ht arent bad since some of it is based off of objective material. It's just our job to filter out what's
and what's real.Search http://www.dragtimes.com for honda civic si. They have objective numbers and some specs for comparisons.
If you're looking at the ihe route, check out this link for what it can do on an ex. your results should be in the area percentage wise.
http://www.hondatuningmagazine....html
Dollar for dollar, your best bet is turbo. That's my opinion but see sig for objective proof.
12-07-2007, 01:12 PM
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Re: reasonable modifications for a b16 that are worth the money. (ekhatchling)
I already knew that. But just stating that it still sucked even with a decent amount of power lol.
Also the fact that my EG weighs 2300 without me in it.
Also the fact that my EG weighs 2300 without me in it.
12-07-2007, 01:33 PM
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Re: reasonable modifications for a b16 that are worth the money. (BlueIntegraBoy)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BlueIntegraBoy »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You really can't gain too much without busting open the engine or FI.
A good 4-2-1 header (no eBay generic crap), CAI, test pipe, and catback will do only to a certain extent.</TD></TR></TABLE>right, so it worth it?<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SkoundrelUSA »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'd say CTR cams. I know you don't wanna do anything major like that, but cam swap isn't too bad.
Other than that, a really sick header. Like a Toda or SMSP
I made 178whp with my all motor stock bottom end B16 with Skunk2 stage 2s, w.e bolt ons and a fake ITR header, but it still felt slow </TD></TR></TABLE>i am with you here, to swap out the cams(not valvetrain) i wouldnt need to pull the head right? the work i can do is limited because i live in an appartment complex now and really cant do much as far as work goes. i have to drive to my parents to change the oil. so in short, anything i do has to get done 100% in a few hours. 178whp isnt bad at all for a stock bottom end.... did you mill down the head or get a thinner head gasket for that?<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bonSI »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
search somewhere else then. you ask about something that has been discussed endlessly and by now is common knowledge. it is what it is. the b16 doesnt make power from just cheap "inexpensive" bolt-ons.
tip: dont dis the people who you are asking for help if you really want their help. </TD></TR></TABLE>you misunderstood me. peoples opinions in the archives are common knowledge and nothing in the archives could really show me that it was worth it to mod a b16. your opinion is my skepticism right? i really would like for people to prove you(and myself for that matter) wrong, with real evidence that boltons for a b16 can net a 20+whp difference. skoundrelUSA begain with 178whp which is encouraging, however that is with more significant headwork...
regarding the tip: i think you misunderstood me again, i am showing no disrespect in asking for more concrete posts. that statement was realizing that no matter what i request, i will get more opinions than facts. pessimism not disrespect
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ekhatchling »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Search http://www.dragtimes.com for honda civic si. They have objective numbers and some specs for comparisons.
If you're looking at the ihe route, check out this link for what it can do on an ex. your results should be in the area percentage wise.
http://www.hondatuningmagazine....html
Dollar for dollar, your best bet is turbo. That's my opinion but see sig for objective proof.</TD></TR></TABLE>thank you sir in less than 2 years i plan on swapping or turbo or both, but i have to get a house with a garage first.
what whp does a standard b16a2 baseline usually? maybe thats a good place to start...
A good 4-2-1 header (no eBay generic crap), CAI, test pipe, and catback will do only to a certain extent.</TD></TR></TABLE>right, so it worth it?<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SkoundrelUSA »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'd say CTR cams. I know you don't wanna do anything major like that, but cam swap isn't too bad.
Other than that, a really sick header. Like a Toda or SMSP
I made 178whp with my all motor stock bottom end B16 with Skunk2 stage 2s, w.e bolt ons and a fake ITR header, but it still felt slow </TD></TR></TABLE>i am with you here, to swap out the cams(not valvetrain) i wouldnt need to pull the head right? the work i can do is limited because i live in an appartment complex now and really cant do much as far as work goes. i have to drive to my parents to change the oil. so in short, anything i do has to get done 100% in a few hours. 178whp isnt bad at all for a stock bottom end.... did you mill down the head or get a thinner head gasket for that?<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bonSI »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
search somewhere else then. you ask about something that has been discussed endlessly and by now is common knowledge. it is what it is. the b16 doesnt make power from just cheap "inexpensive" bolt-ons.
tip: dont dis the people who you are asking for help if you really want their help. </TD></TR></TABLE>you misunderstood me. peoples opinions in the archives are common knowledge and nothing in the archives could really show me that it was worth it to mod a b16. your opinion is my skepticism right? i really would like for people to prove you(and myself for that matter) wrong, with real evidence that boltons for a b16 can net a 20+whp difference. skoundrelUSA begain with 178whp which is encouraging, however that is with more significant headwork...
regarding the tip: i think you misunderstood me again, i am showing no disrespect in asking for more concrete posts. that statement was realizing that no matter what i request, i will get more opinions than facts. pessimism not disrespect
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ekhatchling »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Search http://www.dragtimes.com for honda civic si. They have objective numbers and some specs for comparisons.If you're looking at the ihe route, check out this link for what it can do on an ex. your results should be in the area percentage wise.
http://www.hondatuningmagazine....html
Dollar for dollar, your best bet is turbo. That's my opinion but see sig for objective proof.</TD></TR></TABLE>thank you sir
in less than 2 years i plan on swapping or turbo or both, but i have to get a house with a garage first.what whp does a standard b16a2 baseline usually? maybe thats a good place to start...
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12-07-2007, 03:15 PM
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Re: reasonable modifications for a b16 that are worth the money. (thisisntjared)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SkoundrelUSA »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I already knew that. But just stating that it still sucked even with a decent amount of power lol. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Im sure you knew, comment was for original poster.
See here for baseline at the wheels. Also honda tuning may06 got 140whp/101wtq with just CAI.
http://aempower.com/images/pro...S.pdf
If you know for sure you will swap or turbo, save ur money till then. only thing worth buying is the exhaust because you can keep that afterwards. CAI or header will be gone with turbo and maybe even for swap if not within bseries family. Or you can sell off the cai and header but you'll lose $$ either way.
Im sure you knew, comment was for original poster.
See here for baseline at the wheels. Also honda tuning may06 got 140whp/101wtq with just CAI.
http://aempower.com/images/pro...S.pdf
If you know for sure you will swap or turbo, save ur money till then. only thing worth buying is the exhaust because you can keep that afterwards. CAI or header will be gone with turbo and maybe even for swap if not within bseries family. Or you can sell off the cai and header but you'll lose $$ either way.
12-07-2007, 10:30 PM
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Re: reasonable modifications for a b16 that are worth the money. (ekhatchling)
interesting. that really makes the intake seem worthless hahaha.
saving really isnt an issue now. i dont have a budget for toys, i just buy a little here and there and its ok with the wife if its under the radar(bought with cash). we are in a pretty aggressive saving mode for a house. once we have the house she will be a little more relaxed on dedicated an entire pay check for savings, so naturally i can create a sufficient budget for "jareds toys"
anyway, getting back on subject, will the standard i/h/e net 20whp on a b16a2? i know lots of people do it, but is there anything out there beyond the butt dyno?
saving really isnt an issue now. i dont have a budget for toys, i just buy a little here and there and its ok with the wife if its under the radar(bought with cash). we are in a pretty aggressive saving mode for a house. once we have the house she will be a little more relaxed on dedicated an entire pay check for savings, so naturally i can create a sufficient budget for "jareds toys"
anyway, getting back on subject, will the standard i/h/e net 20whp on a b16a2? i know lots of people do it, but is there anything out there beyond the butt dyno?
12-09-2007, 08:36 AM
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Re: reasonable modifications for a b16 that are worth the money. (thisisntjared)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by thisisntjared »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> am with you here, to swap out the cams(not valvetrain) i wouldnt need to pull the head right? the work i can do is limited because i live in an appartment complex now and really cant do much as far as work goes. i have to drive to my parents to change the oil. so in short, anything i do has to get done 100% in a few hours. 178whp isnt bad at all for a stock bottom end.... did you mill down the head or get a thinner head gasket for that?you misunderstood me. peoples opinions in the archives are common knowledge and nothing in the archives could really show me that it was worth it to mod a b16. your opinion is my skepticism right? i really would like for people to prove you(and myself for that matter) wrong, with real evidence that boltons for a b16 can net a 20+whp difference. skoundrelUSA begain with 178whp which is encouraging, however that is with more significant headwork...</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah the cam install is basically a "bolt-on" Head doesn't have to come off. yeah it was milled, had supertech valvetrain, and whatnot.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by thisisntjared »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">anyway, getting back on subject, will the standard i/h/e net 20whp on a b16a2? i know lots of people do it, but is there anything out there beyond the butt dyno?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Without a tune, I doubt it. Also another thing you can get thats "cheap" and small is a BPi velocity stack.
Yeah the cam install is basically a "bolt-on" Head doesn't have to come off. yeah it was milled, had supertech valvetrain, and whatnot.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by thisisntjared »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">anyway, getting back on subject, will the standard i/h/e net 20whp on a b16a2? i know lots of people do it, but is there anything out there beyond the butt dyno?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Without a tune, I doubt it. Also another thing you can get thats "cheap" and small is a BPi velocity stack.
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