ek_will

i did a search and i have not found the answer to my question why do people want to leave their secondaries open?(lever is always down)

my prob is that they are always open, my low end is not what it used to be and my top end is no where to be found after vtec engages its just loud all they way to 8k i do not notice any butterflies.

any ideas what this could be i noticed this just recently.

petersayarath

same problem here.. i dunno..
bump

gsrjeff

check vac. lines if the are rev. the secondaries wont work properly. i want to elemanate the sec. all together i put a JG ELDEBROC intake mani. on but the ecu still tryed to open the sec. so id check the vac. lines if not maybe its the ECU but i dout it. WHAT kind of ecu do u have p72.?

GripFactoR

if your secondaries are not working properly, the secondaries are ALWAYS closed.
Vacum is introduced to open the secondaries at 5700 RPM.

check for vacum, and proper wiring.

there will be NO cel if the secondaries are not working.

ek_will

yeah my secondaries seem to always be open, im running a p72

my top end is no where to be found i thought leaving them open is supposed to be better for top end? is this not true for all situations?

edit: wait...when the lever is up its closed right? vac causes the lever to go down and open secondaries correct? *scratches head*

ek_will

bump

daver

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GripFactoR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">if your secondaries are not working properly, the secondaries are ALWAYS closed.
Vacum is introduced to open the secondaries at 5700 RPM.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

this is incorrect, its the opposite of what he said

d

BlackOnBlackTeggie

take them out the runners will be shorter so it wont feel doggy down low

ek_will

how would you take them out? wouldnt taking them out be the same as leaving them open?

daver

don't take them out, the low end doggyness will remain. You may gain a bit up top by removing the obstruction, but the beauty of the gsr mani is the low end power ability.

Trouble shoot your problem. unplug the iabs and jump the solenoid at idle. If the plunger does not move then its likely the soleniod. Otherwise, i'd test the appropriate ecu pin for voltage. If all is good, then its probably the wiring. To my knowledge, there is no fuse related.

d

BlackOnBlackTeggie

take them out

daver

leave them in

Luserkid

lol, you guys sound like kids.

If your running the stock GSR manifold, leave them in and keep them active (espeically if your running a p72).

Now if you dont want them, chip a p28 and get a new manifold. best power from that over pulling them out.

ek_will

im looking under the intake mani. from the driver side and i dont see any two wire plug for the IAB is it obvious to spot? any pics or diagarms?

white ex

follow the vacuum hose from the diaphragm and it will lead you right to it.

ek_will

hm after some reading if my secondaries dont work they should stay closed why does mine stay open? is there no vacc. when i start the car up (plunger does not move)

Padawan

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by dash_0n &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">hm after some reading if my secondaries dont work they should stay closed why does mine stay open? is there no vacc. when i start the car up (plunger does not move) </TD></TR></TABLE>

If there were no vacuum, they'd stay open.

Edited because posting when you're absurdly tired results in stupid mistakes


Modified by Padawan at 10:59 AM 10/23/2004

daver

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by dash_0n &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">hm after some reading if my secondaries dont work they should stay closed why does mine stay open? is there no vacc. when i start the car up (plunger does not move) </TD></TR></TABLE>

i'm telling you mr, they stay OPEN by default if they don't work. You've been reading bad info. I've been down this road of research already.

When you fire up the car, power is sent to the iab solenoid, opening it, allowing vacuum to CLOSE the butterflies. At 5750, the power to the soleniod it cut, vacuum is cut off, butterflies open.

don't just take my word for it. Do more searching, i found my answers on this site. The butterflies are open when the engine/ignition is off. You can pop off the breather tube and look in through the TB and see for yourself. this is the default position. If they are not working, the they stay in the default position.

d

ek_will

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by daver &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

i'm telling you mr, they stay OPEN by default if they don't work. You've been reading bad info. I've been down this road of research already.

When you fire up the car, power is sent to the iab solenoid, opening it, allowing vacuum to CLOSE the butterflies. At 5750, the power to the soleniod it cut, vacuum is cut off, butterflies open.

don't just take my word for it. Do more searching, i found my answers on this site. The butterflies are open when the engine/ignition is off. You can pop off the breather tube and look in through the TB and see for yourself. this is the default position. If they are not working, the they stay in the default position.

d</TD></TR></TABLE>

thats what ive been thinking,
so basically if my secondaries arent wired up or wired correctly they would stay open? thanks guys

Hapa88

I had this exact same problem. When I did my swap, the guy didn't wire them up at all. The butterflies stay open by default, meaning you have NO Lowend torque. You will hear VTEC kick in, but you won't hear the butterflies open (because they're already open).

The things to check are the Vacuum and then the wiring to the solenoid. First off, note that the JDM and USDM ECUs interface with the butterfly solenoid differently. One uses a Positive wire to get it to move (I think the USDM ECU does this), while the other uses a Negative ground to work (JDM one). Only reason I know this is because I swapped my USDM ECU with a friend's JDM ECU to see if there were any performance differences, and as soon as we swapped, we both lost our Secondaries.

ek_will

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hapa88 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I had this exact same problem. When I did my swap, the guy didn't wire them up at all. The butterflies stay open by default, meaning you have NO Lowend torque. You will hear VTEC kick in, but you won't hear the butterflies open (because they're already open).

The things to check are the Vacuum and then the wiring to the solenoid. First off, note that the JDM and USDM ECUs interface with the butterfly solenoid differently. One uses a Positive wire to get it to move (I think the USDM ECU does this), while the other uses a Negative ground to work (JDM one). Only reason I know this is because I swapped my USDM ECU with a friend's JDM ECU to see if there were any performance differences, and as soon as we swapped, we both lost our Secondaries.</TD></TR></TABLE>

sounds right, i just talked to the guy who did my swap and he doesnt remember wiring them. how do i go about wiring them? its very hard to see under teh manifold i dont see the two wire plug anyone have a diagram or pics? thanks

standinghollow

so how do you wire in jdm butterflies