SinsEvil666

Hey guys, my engine B16A2 has been running like **** for a while now, it runs rough & loud along with a ticking noise coming from the head. There is also a loss of power. I recently sea foamed it, it did is job car felt better & smoother but.

from what i searched and read it is possibly what i meantioned a bent/burnt or need valve adjustment.

I read ppl saying do leak down test and others compression test...

Question: which one is the correct one? or do i have to do both to get a more accurate answer of what is wrong with engine.

i dont have the leak down tester nor the compression tester....im financially screwed up right now....so im trying to spend only what i need.

Thank you guys and sorry for the bug.


Modified by SinsEvil666 at 12:37 PM 9/9/2008


Modified by SinsEvil666 at 2:19 PM 9/9/2008

Unit44justin

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1305086

Might as well try and adjust the valves

SinsEvil666

Ok thanx i will go ahead and purchase the feeler gauges and try do it for a first time....now is there a way to tell if i have a bent/burnt valve when taking off the valve cover? which results would let me know what exactly is wrong with the engine (as to the valves) leak down or compression?

Thanx.

Hanmin

pour oil in it and see how fast it drains. thes lower it drains, the better. if it drains really quick, then you have either a bent or burnt valve.

na+b18c_hatch

yeah def. try to adjust them before you go about replacing them. you might end up saving yourself some money.

SinsEvil666

Thank you all for responding, i appreciate it.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hanmin &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">pour oil in it and see how fast it drains. thes lower it drains, the better. if it drains really quick, then you have either a bent or burnt valve.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Pour oil while having my drain plug off? i just replaced my oil on sunday after the sea foam..i wouldnt want to drain that oil and buying some more new oil.

i can prob. do a compression test or leak down test before i check see if they need to be adjusted, would any of them tell me if i have a bent or burnt valve?

Either way, i will be trying to do my adjustment and hopefully thats all i need.

Once again, Thank you all for the help.

Hanmin

oh yeah=]. lol I completely forgot about the leakdown and compression test=].

gsrhatch2356

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hanmin &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">pour oil in it and see how fast it drains. thes lower it drains, the better. if it drains really quick, then you have either a bent or burnt valve.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I may be missing something out of this but how do you get a bent valve out of pouring oil in the head\crankcase?

DTA-Zombie

do a compression test - just went through same thing but found out was a rod bearing starting to go - typically the valves out of adjustment will sounds more like a bunch of butterflies - will be real light kinda like a whir in my opinion.

Compression testers can be had for 20 bucks easily or you could rent one at advance/oreillys wherever.

SinsEvil666

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by gsrhatch2356 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I may be missing something out of this but how do you get a bent valve out of pouring oil in the head\crankcase? </TD></TR></TABLE>

He was trying to help find out if i have a bent or burnt valve i think...i didnt really understand what exactly to do to find out....

But by the looks of it


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DTA-Zombie &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">do a compression test - just went through same thing but found out was a rod bearing starting to go - typically the valves out of adjustment will sounds more like a bunch of butterflies - will be real light kinda like a whir in my opinion.

Compression testers can be had for 20 bucks easily or you could rent one at advance/oreillys wherever. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Compression test it is! Im going to purchase the compression tester out of napa for around 45 bucks..that a fair price??? and ill try do it myself with my bros compressor.

I rather buy the tester than pay the 20 bucks...cuz i know that tester will come in handy in the future.

Once again, thank you all for replies. Pending my compression test. will post results when i get it done.

DTA-Zombie

I got a regular compression tester for 30 with adapters for any situation no need for a compressor...they sell em as low as 20 or less. Call around your local auto parts stores and ask what prices they have.

I bet you are consistent on numbers for 3 and one will be a little low.

my b1a2 had a consistent 190 or so

use that as a baseline to compare...

SinsEvil666

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DTA-Zombie &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I got a regular compression tester for 30 with adapters for any situation no need for a compressor...they sell em as low as 20 or less. Call around your local auto parts stores and ask what prices they have.

I bet you are consistent on numbers for 3 and one will be a little low.

my b1a2 had a consistent 190 or so

use that as a baseline to compare...</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thank you. i will look for one thats is pretty cheap. I didnt really know how to do a compression test. and ur right, no need for compressor. still looking and reading. So far this is what i got Correct me if im wrong.

1. Take the car out for a drive till its at operating temperature
2. have a fully charged battery.
3. Remove the 15amp fuse in the engine bay fuse box to prevent fuel to be sprayed
4. Take off the spark plug cables and spark plugs
5. remove the center distributor cable to prevent any damage or any shock
5. Screw in (preferably) the compression tester in cylinder 1(furthers to the right) and continue from right to left.
6. Crank car till needle does not move anymore.
7. Run the test about 2-3 times in each cylinder for accurate answer.


Modified by SinsEvil666 at 11:19 AM 9/10/2008

gsrhatch2356

everything looked great but I am not one for pulling plugs out of something that is warmed up. to much of a chance for the threads to strip out due to metal expanding so i would leave that part out. the reason why they tell you to do that is so that you give the rings a chance to expand but this could be a false test cause could have really low compression when cold and have plenty when warm so just base your numbers off a cold test and know that it would be better when warm.

94EG8

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SinsEvil666 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">5. remove the center distributor cable to prevent any damage or any shock</TD></TR></TABLE>

All correct except that, B series engines use an internal coil so there isn't a middle wire to pull.

SinsEvil666

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 94EG8 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

All correct except that, B series engines use an internal coil so there isn't a middle wire to pull.</TD></TR></TABLE>

So is there something else i have to do? just leave the cables hanging there throwing spark?


Thanx for all the replies...i will perform the test while cold cuz i dont want to break a plug or anything.

gsrhatch2356

No, you need to unplug the distributer. I have seen it in person that when the wires are not grounded it can surge the ecu and fry it. see the magic smoke. anyway I have done it before and got lucky but when going to school we were doing some test on this guys SI and POOF!

SinsEvil666

Damn, im doing my compression test......and i installed the adapter that came with the tester.....and yea....after i did cylinder 1 (Furthest to the right, which i got compressiong of 210) and now, wen i took off the the hose that hooks up to the gauge....i noticed the adapter had stayed in the spark plugs place...and i cant take that **** out....no 16mm or 17mm fit....the 17 is too wide for the spark plug hole and the 16 is a lil too small to actually grap the adapter to take it off.

I grabbed some head gasket maker silicone and put it on the hose thread where it meets the adapter and im here just waiting for it to dry up....see if that helps take it off.......any other suggestions incase this dont work?

Edited: The worst part of it, is my dumbass didnt noticed/checked that the adapter was not needed......im such an idiot.


Modified by SinsEvil666 at 8:00 PM 9/15/2008

SinsEvil666

This is the adapter that is stuck in there....this is the same exact thing i got for 25 bucks....

http://search.live.com/images/...4.jpg

SinsEvil666

Haha finally got it out before i left to work (i stucked the spark plug in there, screwed it in to the adapter and took a quick snap un-screwing it and it came off with the spark plug.

Well yea, re-did my compression on all cylinders this morning (overnight cold) right before i left to work. Oh, i forgot to keep it at WOT (how important is that?) Should i do test again when i get home.

Compression was about 210 all four cylinders (while in front of the car, Right to Left). This was within Four Revolutions on all four cylinders.

I Suppose Nothing is wrong with the bottom end? Im still looking for the Feeler Gauges and the tool, also trying to figure out reading on how to do a valve adjustment.....Seems Difficult, i feel like i will mess up....

Oh yea, I had oil all over the top part of the spark plug....alot.....I bought the new stem seals kit, just need to get Dizzy O-ring & V-tec Solenoid O-Ring as well. Anyone have the Honda parts number by any chance? Maybe this will fix my leaking problem which i thought it leaked from the headgasket.


Modified by SinsEvil666 at 10:10 AM 9/16/2008

DTA-Zombie

good compression so I would say most likely your rings and bearings are good so that is a plus. if you have oil on the plugs (I am guessing upper portion where the plug wire connects) replace the valve cover gasket kit - and I would go ahead and replace the plugs and wires. the stem seals alone will probably take care of the oil on the plugs.

I would have got the valve cover gasket kit personally.

SinsEvil666

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DTA-Zombie &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">good compression so I would say most likely your rings and bearings are good so that is a plus. if you have oil on the plugs (I am guessing upper portion where the plug wire connects) replace the valve cover gasket kit - and I would go ahead and replace the plugs and wires. the stem seals alone will probably take care of the oil on the plugs.

I would have got the valve cover gasket kit personally. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Well, good to hear that the bottom end is good. Yea thats the kit i got...it came with the valve cover gasket, the stem seals and some other lil things dont know what they are called or where they go i think ill figure it out when i take off the valve cover. I am super broke right now.....bills killing me and paying what i owe....I will probably keep the wires and plugs till i can afford some plugs (i have some crane cams plug wires at home, new) Should i just swap over the cables? or wait till i get the new plugs?

I just called The closest honda dealer for the Distributor O-Ring, said was $3.something is that correct? also, the vtec solenoid one was $23.Something? is that correct?? that 23 seems like alot (i have oil by the head gasket under the dizzy and the vtec solenoid, i am going after the right parts right?

i dont think i can afford that right now...

DTA-Zombie

I haven't seen those orings/gaskets go bad personally but they may. You can swap just the plug wires but take your plugs out clean them up nice and throw them back in. Just make sure and keep an eye on your oil levels.

both orings should cheap as hell - don't be afraid to hit up parts stores and ebay. it's a piece of rubber generally not gonna make a huge difference

SinsEvil666

When i get home i will take a picture of the plugs see if u guys can tell me anything on how they look....how exactly would i clean them? or just a rag and dry them off which i already did.

Also, remains unanswered....i didnt do the test while WOT. Does that really matter?

Ok, then i suppose the $23 bucks for the solenoid o-ring is wrong? i just need the part that prevents the oil to leak which should be a rubber rin look alike right?

I went to all the parts stores around my place and they all said i need to get it from the dealer as for the vtec solenoid one. Dizzy is about the same price.

Also, to change the Dizzy O-Ring or the Vtec solenoid O-ring...do i have to take off the valve cover?

I dont want to change the seals, valve cover gasket...and then have to get a new gasket when changing the o-rings if indeed i have to take off the cover.

DTA-Zombie

taking off the valve cover after replacing the gasket won't hurt anything - in general can clean oil and such off with a rag - may take some sandpaper and clean up the contacts and "spark area" can't hurt


edit: not doing compression test at WOT won't matter usually.

SinsEvil666

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DTA-Zombie &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">taking off the valve cover after replacing the gasket won't hurt anything - in general can clean oil and such off with a rag - may take some sandpaper and clean up the contacts and "spark area" can't hurt


edit: not doing compression test at WOT won't matter usually. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Thanx for the response all

Ok, will be looking for my valve adjustment tool and feeler gaugues....then i will replace the stem seals, valve cover gasket....and im afraid i might screw **** up when doing the valve adjustment on figuring out when its on tdc.... and what valves to adjust when on TDC for such valves.