Need help finding the best build
#1
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Need help finding the best build
Hey everyone, currently, I have a 99 coupe si. I feel it is time to start building it up. The stock b16 has around 112,000 miles on it. However, I have to put in 2 quarts of oil per week, I do not think the oil has ever been changed in the vehicle, and the entire engine and transmission are totally covered in oil. So, my dilemma is choosing what the best build will be for this vehicle. I have not decided if I plan on going all-motor or adding forced induction, so what would be the best bet for building up and deciding later on whether to go all-motor or forced induction. I would assume the b18 c5 is most likely the best way to go all around, but is it really worth it? If I had to go with a lesser build, what is best? Which provides the most horse, and torque? What does the b18c5 do that is so much more coveted?
The choices I have been looking at are currently:
b18c5
h22
b18 ls/vtec
b16 ls/vtec
b18 with b20 block
b16 with b20 block
b16 (just keep what I have and hope I can rebuild it)
Can anyone help me out with making this decision, but also explain to me why I should do so and what specs each one may provide on average. If the best choice would be the b18c5, what would be the next best bet?
Thanks to everyone out there for helping.
The choices I have been looking at are currently:
b18c5
h22
b18 ls/vtec
b16 ls/vtec
b18 with b20 block
b16 with b20 block
b16 (just keep what I have and hope I can rebuild it)
Can anyone help me out with making this decision, but also explain to me why I should do so and what specs each one may provide on average. If the best choice would be the b18c5, what would be the next best bet?
Thanks to everyone out there for helping.
#3
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Re: Need help finding the best build
Please check out the FAQ for detailed info on this, or any subject before posting.
I will answer you question to an extent though.
If you can afford a B18c5, go for it. You are looking at a few grand at least all said and done. Great engine (Its the ITR engine, hand built by Honda techs), but really expensive.
The B18c1 (GS-R engine) is a good choice. Will cost you, but can be cheaper than the ITR or H22 swap. Would be my next choice personally.
H22 can make a lot of power, but its heavy and can be expensive to build up. Also can be hard (or just time consuming) for some to fit in their car. Would be my third choice. I actually like this motor a bit more than the B18c1 but just not in a Civic. Personal thing.
Thats all I'm gonna compare. I personally think that you SHOULD swap to something else. B16 is a good engine, but I just think its really overrated. Just doesn't make the power that the three I covered above will for a DOHC. My 2 cents.
I will answer you question to an extent though.
If you can afford a B18c5, go for it. You are looking at a few grand at least all said and done. Great engine (Its the ITR engine, hand built by Honda techs), but really expensive.
The B18c1 (GS-R engine) is a good choice. Will cost you, but can be cheaper than the ITR or H22 swap. Would be my next choice personally.
H22 can make a lot of power, but its heavy and can be expensive to build up. Also can be hard (or just time consuming) for some to fit in their car. Would be my third choice. I actually like this motor a bit more than the B18c1 but just not in a Civic. Personal thing.
Thats all I'm gonna compare. I personally think that you SHOULD swap to something else. B16 is a good engine, but I just think its really overrated. Just doesn't make the power that the three I covered above will for a DOHC. My 2 cents.
#6
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Re: Need help finding the best build
Go h22. The cost of it is not much more than the b18c1 and not much heavier as everone thinks. The most potential for high power, and pretty cost effective.
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#9
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Re: Need help finding the best build
the only thing the B18 has over the B16 is the chambers (for the valves) it has less of a chance for detonation.. beside that the B16 has more parts available and if your engine is built right you wont have any worries of detonation.. B16 heads are cheaper and their the same cast as the B18c5 only diffrence their is the cams intake manifold and the head has a slight hand port job done .. so thats why i say stay away from the c5.. its a great motor.. if you just want a B18 but if you wanna do something with it for get about what it came out of and just look at the base of it.. cause your changing everything anyways right?
H22s are nice yes ill give you that.. but thats about it.. their good for preludes and accords not civics.. alot of poeple do it but the price your pay on getting an H22 in your civic and making it fast isnt worth it.. i can take the same amount it takes you to put an H22 in your civic and make it "fast" into my civic with a B16ls vtec and ill blow you outta the water.. the H and F series has extra **** that you dont need in a motor especially a 4cyl but good luck with your build
H22s are nice yes ill give you that.. but thats about it.. their good for preludes and accords not civics.. alot of poeple do it but the price your pay on getting an H22 in your civic and making it fast isnt worth it.. i can take the same amount it takes you to put an H22 in your civic and make it "fast" into my civic with a B16ls vtec and ill blow you outta the water.. the H and F series has extra **** that you dont need in a motor especially a 4cyl but good luck with your build
#10
Re: Need help finding the best build
oh yes the war begins haha. Deff do some research though, they'res some many of these floating, i say go h2b (h22 motor with b series trans) really hard to beat. you can easily get into 12's with bolt on's, tune, and a good set of slicks. Theres guys that go internal with type s pistons i think and some pro-series or blox cams and get in the 11's i believe. They're a cheap k killer. Some people flame on the weight, theres a good weight comparison here somewhere, but it only weighs around 200 more than a b series (i think that was pallet weight of a whole swap and not just motor though). No different than having a passenger. stock 160 tq is hard to beat as well. Sure you could go with a b20 block, but they have thin walls so boost isnt a great idea. Yes the h22's are frm lined from factory so your only option for pistons is mahle golds (not all that bad, people are 50/50 on them, although theres one guy putting down close to 500hp with them) unless you sleeve it. But still the h has .2 more over the b20. h22 can also go to a 2.5 (technically a 2.45 or something with a crower kit). You really need to research though, im just a h motor bias haha
#12
Re: Need help finding the best build
H22s are nice yes ill give you that.. but thats about it.. their good for preludes and accords not civics.. alot of poeple do it but the price your pay on getting an H22 in your civic and making it fast isnt worth it.. i can take the same amount it takes you to put an H22 in your civic and make it "fast" into my civic with a B16ls vtec and ill blow you outta the water.. the H and F series has extra **** that you dont need in a motor especially a 4cyl but good luck with your build
#13
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Re: Need help finding the best build
So based on the fact that I already have the b16, would I be better off buying a whole new swap or just rebuilding what I have? Would I be better off keeping the b16 and putting the money I would have put into buying a new engine into my b16, or even going ls/vtec with my head? Or would I be better off buying the h22? Because by looking at the cost of the b18's, I think I would be better off building up a b16, by what it costs plus what I would end up with performance wise.
#16
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Re: Need help finding the best build
Please check out the FAQ for detailed info on this, or any subject before posting.
I will answer you question to an extent though.
If you can afford a B18c5, go for it. You are looking at a few grand at least all said and done. Great engine (Its the ITR engine, hand built by Honda techs), but really expensive.
The B18c1 (GS-R engine) is a good choice. Will cost you, but can be cheaper than the ITR or H22 swap. Would be my next choice personally.
H22 can make a lot of power, but its heavy and can be expensive to build up. Also can be hard (or just time consuming) for some to fit in their car. Would be my third choice. I actually like this motor a bit more than the B18c1 but just not in a Civic. Personal thing.
Thats all I'm gonna compare. I personally think that you SHOULD swap to something else. B16 is a good engine, but I just think its really overrated. Just doesn't make the power that the three I covered above will for a DOHC. My 2 cents.
I will answer you question to an extent though.
If you can afford a B18c5, go for it. You are looking at a few grand at least all said and done. Great engine (Its the ITR engine, hand built by Honda techs), but really expensive.
The B18c1 (GS-R engine) is a good choice. Will cost you, but can be cheaper than the ITR or H22 swap. Would be my next choice personally.
H22 can make a lot of power, but its heavy and can be expensive to build up. Also can be hard (or just time consuming) for some to fit in their car. Would be my third choice. I actually like this motor a bit more than the B18c1 but just not in a Civic. Personal thing.
Thats all I'm gonna compare. I personally think that you SHOULD swap to something else. B16 is a good engine, but I just think its really overrated. Just doesn't make the power that the three I covered above will for a DOHC. My 2 cents.
#17
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Re: Need help finding the best build
Build your current motor, take it out, rip it down and build it, that way you know exactly what your getting yourself into, you know how it was when you took it out and you are semi familiar with it.
#18
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Re: Need help finding the best build
Ok, thank you all for your input. Last question. I have a lot of people around my area telling me that I should get a ls block, use my head, and rebuild everything. What would this do for me? How much horsepower difference would this allow, as well as torque? Overall, what difference would I have by changing my b16 block with an ls block?
#19
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Re: Need help finding the best build
You would have an ls/v...
If I were in your shoes, I would go with the c5. Less questions, less confusion, less work, reliability. Consider this site a book. You should read first and do your research like everyone said.
If I were in your shoes, I would go with the c5. Less questions, less confusion, less work, reliability. Consider this site a book. You should read first and do your research like everyone said.
#20
Re: Need help finding the best build
for the ls/v just get the golden eagle kit, theyve done their research and it makes it easy. I wouldnt go with a c5 just because of the cost and if you want boost later thats not too practical with the compression of a c5
#21
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Re: Need help finding the best build
LS/VTEC is a good and strong set-up, if built correctly. There's a thread on here explaining everything you need to do to build a reliable LS/V, and the correct way to break it in. I'd suggest getting an B18C1 block, use your B16 pistons and have yourself a good, slightly higher than stock (I think), high compression motor.
#24
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Re: Need help finding the best build
Don't mind that guy. 4cylr4women is one of those guys that just trolls forums because they have nothing better to do in life. Look at his 2 posts. Maybe he should light himself on fire? lol
#25
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Re: Need help finding the best build
Id go turbo b20vtec password jdm is having a sale on b20bs at550 for a long block put ur b16 head on top and then get a cheap turbo kit (not ebay crap) boost at like 6-9 lbs and have fun. Just my .02
Eddie
Eddie