Si Jeff

iTrader: (1)

ok so i have an 00 Civic SI and just recently my car had electrical failure. At first I thought it was the alternator. After that was replaced I still had the same problem. Which is after my car has been running for 5 or so minutes, it just dies slowly. So I also used a multimeter to read the battery and when the car was running it showed that it was losing voltage gradually. Disconnected the battery and tested it and it read 12.3ish. Well I proceeded to go and buy an optima battery. Hooked it up and the car started up fine and the battery was holding its voltage. My CEL was still on. I found the code and I called Honda about it and they told me I had to buy an entire fusebox to fix the ELD problem. Which they quoted it for $130+ tax plus an additional 3-5 business days for it to come in. So i found a fuse box from an ek hatch and hooked it up. Started the car and I still had the same code. Also by this time i returned the optima battery and was using my original battery again. After about 2 minutes the car started dying out again. Now from what I hear ELD problems are uncommon but not unheard of. So I asked myself, "wtf, two fuseboxes with f'd up ELD's???" I noticed that a wire plugs directly into the ELD. Now I am thinking that something is up with the actual wire. Which I believe is part of the wiring harness. The plug is pretty small and is brown. Also the ELD in the fusebox is brown and looks like a memory card for a digital camera. What do you guys think??? Please help with some insight..

pdiggitydogg

Maybe this is a silly question...but you did reset the ecu after swapping boxes right?
Is your alternator fuse good? (a blown alt fuse will cause an eld cel)

Si Jeff

iTrader: (1)

I reset the ecu with my obd2 code reader. Which one is the alt fuse?

pdiggitydogg

Id still pull the neg battery cable

the alt fuse is under the dash, its labeled if i remember right

Si Jeff

iTrader: (1)

the battery cable was unplugged aswell. well i will have to wait until tomorrow to check the alt. fuse.

sicky

The alt fuse is a 7amp under the dash. I had the same problem, lost voltage, speedo quit working, and it was throwing a code 41 and a code 20, just turned out to be that fuse. That's your only problem, I am sure.

Si Jeff

iTrader: (1)

k.thkns. i'll post an update tomorrow. i hope it's only a fuse. sucks not having a car to drive

Si Jeff

iTrader: (1)

what are the chances it could be the actual wire that plugs into the ELD??

Si Jeff

iTrader: (1)

Today I found out I had a blown alternator fuse. So I changed it out and everything was running fine afterwards. The battery was holding its charge. So I decided to take my car for a spin around the block. After driving about 2 mins, bam the CEL came on. I was like wtf?!?!! So I pulled up to my buddy's shop and bust out the code reader. code 1298 aka CEL 20 came on again. So I took out the fuse and looked that it was blown. WTF?!?! So I went to the store and bought some more fuses. Put a new one in and less than a minute later the CEL comes back on. Check the fuse and it is blown again. Could I have a short in the wiring? Please help me!!

pdiggitydogg

youve either got a short or drawing too much power for the fuse to handle
Id try just upping to a 10amp (I know, thats not right) and if that blew Id take it in for the problem....I hate electrical

Si Jeff

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pdiggitydogg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">youve either got a short or drawing too much power for the fuse to handle
Id try just upping to a 10amp (I know, thats not right) and if that blew Id take it in for the problem....I hate electrical</TD></TR></TABLE>
tried a 10 and it blew aswell. Also as soon reset the code with the 10 the CEL came on in about 15seconds. When i used the 7.5 it took a minute or 2.

Hybrid96EK

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pdiggitydogg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Maybe this is a silly question...but you did reset the ecu after swapping boxes right?
Is your alternator fuse good? (a blown alt fuse will cause an eld cel)</TD></TR></TABLE>

That is pretty silly considering to change the fuse box, you must unplug it. Since unplugging it would be the same as removing the ECU fuse, what do you think?

Hybrid96EK

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SLOWFBP_EM1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
tried a 10 and it blew aswell. Also as soon reset the code with the 10 the CEL came on in about 15seconds. When i used the 7.5 it took a minute or 2. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Dude. Sometimes you just shoud not listen to people on Honda-Tech. Upping the fuse size will only cause more current then the wires can handle to travel across them. Do you like electrical fires? If so, continue on with your 10amp. If not, find the cause of the problem and CORRECTLY resolve it. You clearly have something on that circuit that is drawing way too much current.

92eg6

iTrader: (1)

did u look at all ur fuses under the hood? i had the same problem but it was only the fuse and never gave me problems again....and i think i upd the voltage on the fuse and was working fine

pdiggitydogg

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hybrid93Eg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
That is pretty silly considering to change the fuse box, you must unplug it. Since unplugging it would be the same as removing the ECU fuse, what do you think?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah, guess it was pretty silly...

Si Jeff

iTrader: (1)

i recently got HID's about a month ago. do you think it may have caused the problem?

92eg6

iTrader: (1)

ehh dont think its ur hids, i got hids too but neva hapnd again

Hybrid96EK

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SLOWFBP_EM1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i recently got HID's about a month ago. do you think it may have caused the problem?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Alright, here is a list of what I show is on the Alternator circuit. Its fuse 15 and is indeed 7.5amps.

Alternator
VSS
Evap two way valve
Oxygen sensors (both primary and secondary)
Evap canister vent shut off valve
Evap purge control solennoid valve
ECM (engine computer)
ELD unit
Charging system light

Now, with some of these, you can setup the meter to read current (amps) and set it inline with the negative battery cable. Then you can unplug them and see if the current load drops... problem is its going to take you a few fuses most likley to "see" the problem. I would also assume the key would need to be in the "run position" also to do these test, so don't forget that. The thing is, you can't really unplug your ECU you know? Best thing would be to substitue a good known ECU and see if the problem goes away, but not everyone has a spare ECU kicking around. You have already tried two different fuse boxes so I would THINK that it would be unlikely that you got two bad ELD's there. Personally, I have never seen one fail, that doesn't mean it can't happen though. I would probably start like I said by unplugging say the VSS, the O2's, the EVAP solenoids (all one by one) and seeing what the current draw looked like on the meter. If all those checked out, then I would move on testing the alternator (possible you have a bad regulator in the new one or a shorted diode/winding). If that checked out, its got to be either a bad ELD or the ECU itself. Take your pick on which one to select next. Hope this helps.


EDIT: and one thing we can't forget is the possability of a short to ground (frayed wire) or that someone has added some kind of aftermarket item to the circuit for this fuse. Don't forget these options also..

EDIT AGAIN: more info. According to the helm, you will have a problem in either the ELD or the ECU. So I guess disregard what I typed above except as a last resort. To test the ELD, measure voltage between body ground and the ELD 3 pin connector terminal #3. If there is approx 4.5 volts, replace the ELD, its dead If that fails, you need to check for a short in the wire. Turn the ignition switch off, disconect the ECU connector A (32 pin). Check for continuity between ground and terminal A30 (Green/red). Continuity = short in wire. No continuity, they say replace ECU, I saw run through my list up top

Also, there are two kinds of codes for the ELD. Voltage too high, and voltage too low. You would need a scan tool to really know which one you are dealing with. I gave you the info on voltage too low.

Modified by Hybrid93Eg at 11:44 AM 12/17/2005


Modified by Hybrid93Eg at 11:51 AM 12/17/2005

Si Jeff

iTrader: (1)

Well my obd2 code reader threw a code PO1298 which is ELD circuit voltage is high..

Hybrid96EK

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SLOWFBP_EM1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well my obd2 code reader threw a code PO1298 which is ELD circuit voltage is high..</TD></TR></TABLE>

Ignition off, disconnect the 3 pin connector on the ELD (bottom of fuse box)
turn the ignition on to the run position (don't start)
Check terminal 1 on the connector. Do you have battery voltage?
If no, you have an open between the alternator SP sensor (fuse under dash) and the relay box (where the ELD is located)
Check for continuity betweel terminal 2 of the connector and ground
if you don't have continuity then you have an open between the ELD connector and G402 (ground junction)
Disconnect ECP connector A (32 pin) anc check for continuity between terminal 3 of the ELD and A30 of connector A. If you have continuity then you have malfunction in the ELD..
If you don't have continuity, you have an open between the ELD connector and the ECU.

Si Jeff

iTrader: (1)

Ok so I took my car to honda today and they told me that my secondary O2 sensor is causing my alternator fuse to blow since the sensor is bad. They told me that the O2 sensor runs on the same circuit.

Hybrid96EK

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SLOWFBP_EM1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Ok so I took my car to honda today and they told me that my secondary O2 sensor is causing my alternator fuse to blow since the sensor is bad. They told me that the O2 sensor runs on the same circuit.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes, that was in my list

sicones

unplug the o2 sensor and drive around to see if it the CEL goes away before you buy a new one

Hybrid96EK

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by sicones &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">unplug the o2 sensor and drive around to see if it the CEL goes away before you buy a new one </TD></TR></TABLE>

Well, obviouly it wont go away sine unplugging the o2 itself will result in a code

Si Jeff

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hybrid93Eg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Well, obviouly it wont go away sine unplugging the o2 itself will result in a code </TD></TR></TABLE>
true true... i already got a bosch o2 sensor and will put it in tomorrow. we'll see how that goes....