liam821

Ive decied to start a new thread of this - since im pretty sure i know what my problem is...its just how to fix it?

Here is part1:

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=798190

Short version of the problem for all the lazy people:

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I have a obd1 ZC with a built 9:1 sleeved block (75mm). The head is stock
(until i have more money that is ) but with crower regrind cams.
Just running the stock intake manifold/ecu/injectors to work out the
problems with everything before i start trying to make power. Im still
running a p28 ecu until i swap to a hondata so im getting one code (vtec
solinode). The timing belt is correct, and the timing is right on. Im
running stock ZC cam sprockets.

My problem is i just cant get my honda to idle. When i first start the car
(cold) it will idle while the fast idle valve is open. But once it warms up
a little bit she just dies. The only way to keep it running is to hold your
foot on the gas. You can also make it idle if you unplug the factory FPR
causing an intake manifold vacuum leak then it will hold idle around
1100rpms. But as soon as you plug it back in...dies. Ive tested the IAC by
unplugging it with the car running and the idle drops like its supposed to.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I took some video this morning to show you all...so you can see for yourself what im talking about...

This is starting the car cold - lots of cam lope when its cold. You can see that as soon as it warms up - she just will not idle. Watch the vacuum increase...

http://liam821.com/pix/video/i...1.wmv

Video two shows what happens when you unplug the FPR to make a vacuum leak. Idles fine until you plug it back in. I also unplug the IAC to show that too.

http://liam821.com/pix/video/i...e.wmv

Here is the cam specs from the cam card...

INTAKE: 268 degrees with .375 lift
EXHAUST: 257 degrees with a .318 lift

Intake: Opens -2 ATDC
Closes 20 ABDC
Exhaust: Opens 35 BBDC
closes -13 BTDC

It looks like i have 15 degrees overlap in the cam.

It also says, spec listed above are based on a rockerarm ratio of 1.50 IN/EX.

Would these cams cause that much of a problem? They are just regrinds so they cant be that big. I just cant think of anything else it would be.

thanks,
liam


Modified by liam821 at 12:40 PM 3/18/2004

bretx0r

what injectors are you running

liam821

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bretx0r &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">what injectors are you running</TD></TR></TABLE>

Everything is stock right now...stock injectors stock ecu. Im just trying to get the bugs out of everything before i go bolting (more) aftermarket stuff on.

liam

degooser

dont know how to diagnose the problem, but have u tried the stock cams???

bump for a fellow san diegan...

good luck..

liam821

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by degooser &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">dont know how to diagnose the problem, but have u tried the stock cams???

bump for a fellow san diegan...

good luck..</TD></TR></TABLE>

If i had a set of stock cams...id try it. I have a bid on some on ebay - we will see if i get them or not.

liam

degooser

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by liam821 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

If i had a set of stock cams...id try it. I have a bid on some on ebay - we will see if i get them or not.

liam</TD></TR></TABLE>

good deal...if i find anyone with a dohc zc with stock cams..ill let you know... tried k watanabe?

cams would be my guess, but im not sure..

im the type of person who will put all the stock stuff back on if no one knows the problem...

D16A6Turbo

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by liam821 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Would these cams cause that much of a problem? They are just regrinds so they cant be that big. I just cant think of anything else it would be.

thanks,
liam


Modified by liam821 at 12:40 PM 3/18/2004</TD></TR></TABLE>

Liam, I had regrinds in my D16 way back and yes, regrinds can idle pretty damn lopey...mine would die sometimes when the fast idle kicked off...I agree try stock cams...

Also, w/ your fuel controller, can you richen the idle maps...try that once because big cams usually injest alot of air at idle...man, this would be a perfect time to have your hondata because you could easily adjust your idle maps...

Otherwise, I'm swamped...are those turbo spec cams? Did crower regrind for you...what did you ask for?

liam821

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by D16A6Turbo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Liam, I had regrinds in my D16 way back and yes, regrinds can idle pretty damn lopey...mine would die sometimes when the fast idle kicked off...I agree try stock cams...

Also, w/ your fuel controller, can you richen the idle maps...try that once because big cams usually injest alot of air at idle...man, this would be a perfect time to have your hondata because you could easily adjust your idle maps...

Otherwise, I'm swamped...are those turbo spec cams? Did crower regrind for you...what did you ask for?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Ive tried richening up the fuel with my afc - no love. And yes they are turbo spec - however a very aggressive grind. Im gonna try my uberdata this weekend. See if i can get some idle love.

liam

shermanyang

iTrader: (1)

hey i just installed some crower 62402s on my turbo ls and i have the same exact problem. they idle fine when you first start'em up but once they warm up, it tends to bounce back and forth and almost dies at times. i tried adjusting my idle control valve, fuel, and resetting my ecu but nothing seems to work. i think a nice pair of cam gears would do me some justice. i'm getting my car retuned again this coming thursday so i'm gonna see if they can do anything about the shitty idle problem...if not, i'll just have to live with it since my car runs a whole lot smoother/stronger with these cams than they did with stock cams.

Formula 1

bump

hope u get the problem fixed sry i couldnt help

blykins

My Toda B's sound like a Rotary when i give it steady gas when its cold. Once it warms up it lopes good like a v8.

D16A6Turbo

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by liam821 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Ive tried richening up the fuel with my afc - no love. And yes they are turbo spec - however a very aggressive grind. Im gonna try my uberdata this weekend. See if i can get some idle love.

liam</TD></TR></TABLE>

Just for kicks, have you tried going the other way and leaning the idle out?

liam821

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by D16A6Turbo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Just for kicks, have you tried going the other way and leaning the idle out?</TD></TR></TABLE>

yea all the way until the car just dies.

showtymers619

maybe you have a vacum leak on yo ur tb gasket spray some wd 40 .. if not.. maybe just swap out the fpr? just a try...

stackz

large cams with lots of lobe separation WILL require a higher base idle. while fast idling it will idle right because of the increased idle but your base idle is still set for factory cams.

do you have an automatic?? if so then you might have gone too aggressive for the stock torque converter.

also, lots of lobe separation will wreak havok on idle vacuum btw...

lopey cams are mainly for manual tranny cars or auto's with stall converters and vacuum cannisters to help the power brakes out

a good comparison would be my old 71 mustang. I tossed in a 560" 292 duration cam in it and had to increase base idle from 700rpm to 1200rpm in park just to keep it running when I put it in gear. I also had to run a 3500 stall converter or it would stall while in gear. Stock cam put out 21" hg at idle in gear...that cam put out 9" hg at idle in gear...not fun with power brakes starving for vacuum....as well as the transmission sensor shift sensor

showtymers619

hes not auto

dpw41285

isnt idle a trade of for power with the cams??

stackz

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ShowTymers619 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">hes not auto</TD></TR></TABLE>

eh, oh well, didn't know since couldn't view the vids

I'm still saying that he needs to adjust his base idle

mrbsponge

Have you hooked a vaccum gauge up to the motor? With large cams, you very well might need a small vaccum pump to make the car idle better when its warm. thats the trick in the domestics to run huge cams

Siguy00

Looks like your fuel preasure is low.

liam821

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mrbsponge &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Have you hooked a vaccum gauge up to the motor? With large cams, you very well might need a small vaccum pump to make the car idle better when its warm. thats the trick in the domestics to run huge cams </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yea that might do the trick. Thats a good idea.

liam

liam821

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Siguy00 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Looks like your fuel preasure is low.</TD></TR></TABLE>

My fuel pressure is factory pressure - its been checked.

liam