mintscorpion

what up,

so i finally took my civic to the carb ref and failed. it has a b16 swap and everything is legit. i failed on HC and NOx. does anyone know what would cause this. cat? injectors? i have no idea. please help, much appreciated.

WrongWD

iTrader: (1)

hc and nox? sounds like cat to me if you failed on both numbers

Ignitecivic

how high was the hc and nox.

put brand new cat on, get a good working o2 sensor. run ur car hard so that the cat can burn more fuel then smog it.

Matty.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Ignitecivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">how high was the hc and nox.

put brand new cat on, get a good working o2 sensor. run ur car hard so that the cat can burn more fuel then smog it. </TD></TR></TABLE>

What he said and use the 'Top Cleaner' from Honda to clean the sludge out of your IM and combustion chamber. Then use the stuff from Autozone called Guaranteed to Pass. I've never tried it but hey you are guaranteed so its worth a shot. Actually remember someone posted that it worked for them.

ABK

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by gumtape_deathmatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

What he said and use the 'Top Cleaner' from Honda to clean the sludge out of your IM and combustion chamber. Then use the stuff from Autozone called Guaranteed to Pass. I've never tried it but hey you are guaranteed so its worth a shot. Actually remember someone posted that it worked for them.</TD></TR></TABLE>

the top cleaner will just get all the carbon out of it (unless you got a **** load of it, it shouldn't cause NOx). Guaranteed to Pass **** I would imagine is just pure alcochol, alot of people use it to pass emissions.

But this is BS. if you ask me.

Do you have a fucken cat on your car? What ecu are you runing, any other mods/hack jobs?

Marauder

Its probably the cat.....get a carsound cat, they can be had for around $70.

ABK

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Marauder &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Its probably the cat.....get a carsound cat, they can be had for around $70.</TD></TR></TABLE>

those things are like 50-50% chance that they will work efficietly.

Matty.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ABK &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

the top cleaner will just get all the carbon out of it (unless you got a **** load of it, it shouldn't cause NOx). Guaranteed to Pass **** I would imagine is just pure alcochol, alot of people use it to pass emissions.

But this is BS. if you ask me.

Do you have a fucken cat on your car? What ecu are you runing, any other mods/hack jobs?</TD></TR></TABLE>


The carbon in the chamber and sludge in your IM and TB show up in your emissions.....trust me I know. And thats what he is trying to pass BTW....emissions....

I've seen cars pass after getting a rag and wiping the sludge outta their TB and IM believe it or not....

ABK

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by gumtape_deathmatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


The carbon in the chamber and sludge in your IM and TB show up in your emissions.....trust me I know. And thats what he is trying to pass BTW....emissions....

I've seen cars pass after getting a rag and wiping the sludge outta their TB and IM believe it or not....</TD></TR></TABLE>

Well have fun wipping that stuff off. You do top engine clean (not with a rag, but by running a chemical thru the engine), it's not so much to remove the carbon out of the IM but it's more to remove the carbon trapped on the valve seats and the head. To reduce leaks past the valves, and remove the carbon out of the combustion chamber which in great amounts could raise your compression and cause hot spots and preignition.

I don't know, but I do that **** almost everyday at my shop.

picasso1

Dude,
Carbon build in the combustion chamber can cause high nox.
I highly recommend a OEM CAt convertor.
And Some GUm out b12 thottle body and intake cleaner.
Follow directions and replace with fresh NGK plugs
My last bi annual smog i blew 900 on nox still passed.
ALthough this time around i did the intake cleaner and some b12 fuel injector cleaner ran that **** out on a full tank. Replaced plugs and filled up 1/3 high octane and 2/3 regular.
This smog my nox was down to 250 and 300 for 15mph and 25mph.
Stock sohc 1.6 del sol
Post your emissions reading

Matty.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ABK &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Well have fun wipping that stuff off. You do top engine clean (not with a rag, but by running a chemical thru the engine), it's not so much to remove the carbon out of the IM but it's more to remove the carbon trapped on the valve seats and the head. To reduce leaks past the valves, and remove the carbon out of the combustion chamber which in great amounts could raise your compression and cause hot spots and preignition.

I don't know, but I do that **** almost everyday at my shop.</TD></TR></TABLE>

What the fawk is the matter with you? Learn how to read. I never said thats how to use the Top Cleaner.

I merely reccommend the Top Cleaner because I tried it. There may actually be better stuff out there its just that I haven't tried anything else and it made sense to trust OEM brand. I sometimes wonder about the other brands safety to internals especially after reading stories about losing compression after doing things like seafoaming. Whatever the case it seemed to do a great job as I inspected the motor when I pulled the head a little down the road. THen again I only use 91 which helps prevent carbon build up as opposed to 87.

Besides Honda recommends pouring the cleaner into the brake booster vacuum line on the IM and I guarantee it still wont get everything that way if you have a used motor with major plaque build up. I mentioned the rag because I was just giving you an idea of how much it can help with emmisions by just getting some of the areas I know the top cleaner wont get like the throttle plate since you are pouring it into the brake booster if you are following the Honda instructions. Also because a combination of the solvent and rag is the best way to go with parts which are easy to reach like the TB and IM. Its the only way to get it all if they are really dirty.

As for the head and internals its obvious you have one choice which is to pour it in while running otherwise take the head off and get a valve job.

Anyhow I'm just saying what has worked for me I dont care if you take my advice or not.

I now run a catch can from the breather valve to the intake to keep any future sludge from ever entering my beautiful Spoon TB. Been driving over a year and just removed the intake last weekend and its still looking brand new. It also prevent the oil air from fouling your intake charge and diluting your already marginal 91 octane to much worse. This may be also helping to prevent knocking and pinging in my motor since it is a combination of high compression and street gas and allowing me to run stock to mildy advanced ignition timing.

aser1z

i suggest you get a v-tech controller and lower the fuel, then hide the controller by the air boxes behind the glove box.thats what i did after my second ref visit and i passed.

Matty.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by aser1z &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i suggest you get a v-tech controller and lower the fuel, then hide the controller by the air boxes behind the glove box.thats what i did after my second ref visit and i passed.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I've heard of that working too.

I was thinking about using a VAFC to help pass but I was always afraid they would look at the ECU and see a modded harness and follow the wires back to it and be like WTF?.

jay_cue

man, i dont even think they really looked at my ecu. i just hid the afc behind the optional center console. i'm running super high nox numbers. changed out the cat, and o2 sensor, and still running pretty high. dont know what else to do. was thnking of just leaning out with the afc since i'm running so rich

AnDThEnWuT

get a NEW CAT. had the same problem with my b16, just turned out to be a bad cat. when i replaced it, the old cat looked pretty normal. but it was really dead.

postman

all these answers and a better solutuion would be egr not working correctly

TK-4004

this happened to me too because the ref let my car sit too long. i told him that it would fail...but he put it on the dyno anyway.

when it DID fail...i asked him if i could drive the car around to heat the cat up....he said yeah. when i got back to the shop, he put the car right up on the dyno and i passed with flying colors.

so....make sure that the cat is heated up WELL. they are designed to be most efficient at operating temperatures

jay_cue

95's dont hvae egr's though. and i had my car running for a long time before i smog'd it too.

delusionracer

if your Nox and hc numbers are too high your gasses in your combustion chamber are running too hot. if your smog test is anything like Cali's then you will have to find out the exact rpm at which the nox failed and lean it out. i used the Apexi vafc to do this. the dude was cool enough to sit there with me and let me adjust it while the smog was in progress. when you get it perfect both your hc and nox should pass. i had the same problem.

ABK

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by delusionracer &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">if your Nox and hc numbers are too high your gasses in your combustion chamber are running too hot. if your smog test is anything like Cali's then you will have to find out the exact rpm at which the nox failed and lean it out. i used the Apexi vafc to do this. the dude was cool enough to sit there with me and let me adjust it while the smog was in progress. when you get it perfect both your hc and nox should pass. i had the same problem. </TD></TR></TABLE>

This would make the engine run leaner which would make it run hot. Increasing NOx. This makes no sence.
If anything he would have to richen it out but he already got to high of the HCs, so he can't do that.

The correct thing to do is to do a top engine cleaning, tune up, get a cat if he doesn't have one, and make sure ignition timing is set correctly (another cause of high NOx).