Engine swap rules for california ?
05-13-2007, 08:57 PM
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Engine swap rules for california ?
Anybody know what are the rules that the california dmv has or even the reff might put on you if you are trying to swap a motor into a vehicle. So far I have only found a site from a guy who is a smog tech and president of some environmental group. Who states that a person may swap any engine into a car as long as the engine is newer or the same year as the vehicle its being swaped into. He gave an example of swaping an 03 cobra engine into a 88 mustang. He also said that as long as you use all the emissions controls and computer that its ok and that you must take the car to a reff to be certified. Anybody ever heard of this? Just want to be on the safe side, because I cant stand being hassled by the cops over stuff like this.
05-15-2007, 04:02 PM
#3
H-T White Ops
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NOFX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Found the info on a California state government site.
More info in this link:
http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/replace.htm
Replacement Engines
Entire engines can be replacement parts. As with any other replacement part, the engine must be identical to the original. If the replacement block or engine is obtained without emissions equipment, all the equipment from the original engine must be installed on the replacement block.
If the engine is not identical to the original then it is not a replacement part, instead it is considered an engine change.
Engine changes are a modification that must meet certain requirements to be legal (please see "Engine Changes").
Japanese Replacement Engines
Used engines imported from Japan can be used as replacement engines as long as the engine being used has been identified as functionally identical to the original engine. Please refer to the engine importers catalogue to determine if a replacement engine is legal for installation in your vehicle.
Engine Changes
Engine changes are legal as long as the following requirements are met to ensure that the change does not increase pollution from the vehicle:
* The engine must be the same year or newer than the vehicle.
* The engine must be from the same type of vehicle (passenger car, light-duty truck, heavy-duty truck, etc.) based on gross vehicle weight.
* If the vehicle is a California certified vehicle then the engine must also be a California certified engine.
* All emissions control equipment must remain on the installed engine.
After an engine change, vehicles must first be inspected by a state referee station. The vehicle will be inspected to ensure that all the equipment required is in place, and vehicle will be emissions tested subject to the specifications of the installed engine.</TD></TR></TABLE>
More info in this link:
http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/replace.htm
Replacement Engines
Entire engines can be replacement parts. As with any other replacement part, the engine must be identical to the original. If the replacement block or engine is obtained without emissions equipment, all the equipment from the original engine must be installed on the replacement block.
If the engine is not identical to the original then it is not a replacement part, instead it is considered an engine change.
Engine changes are a modification that must meet certain requirements to be legal (please see "Engine Changes").
Japanese Replacement Engines
Used engines imported from Japan can be used as replacement engines as long as the engine being used has been identified as functionally identical to the original engine. Please refer to the engine importers catalogue to determine if a replacement engine is legal for installation in your vehicle.
Engine Changes
Engine changes are legal as long as the following requirements are met to ensure that the change does not increase pollution from the vehicle:
* The engine must be the same year or newer than the vehicle.
* The engine must be from the same type of vehicle (passenger car, light-duty truck, heavy-duty truck, etc.) based on gross vehicle weight.
* If the vehicle is a California certified vehicle then the engine must also be a California certified engine.
* All emissions control equipment must remain on the installed engine.
After an engine change, vehicles must first be inspected by a state referee station. The vehicle will be inspected to ensure that all the equipment required is in place, and vehicle will be emissions tested subject to the specifications of the installed engine.</TD></TR></TABLE>
05-16-2007, 01:38 PM
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Re: Engine swap rules for california ? (grizzman)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by grizzman »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> I cant stand being hassled by the cops over stuff like this.</TD></TR></TABLE>
You own a honda...better get used to it
they really like to profile here in CA, so unless you keep the stock exhaust ride height and wheels get ready.
You own a honda...better get used to it
they really like to profile here in CA, so unless you keep the stock exhaust ride height and wheels get ready.
05-16-2007, 01:44 PM
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H-T White Ops
Re: Engine swap rules for california ? (B16b-EJ8)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B16b-EJ8 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You own a honda...better get used to it they really like to profile here in CA, so unless you keep the stock exhaust ride height and wheels get ready.</TD></TR></TABLE>
But keeping it as legal as possible will certainly cut down on that. Honestly, if there's that big of a problem with the laws, then either try to get them changed (many people will be needed, not just one) or move.
they really like to profile here in CA, so unless you keep the stock exhaust ride height and wheels get ready.</TD></TR></TABLE>But keeping it as legal as possible will certainly cut down on that. Honestly, if there's that big of a problem with the laws, then either try to get them changed (many people will be needed, not just one) or move.
05-16-2007, 01:53 PM
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Re: Engine swap rules for california ? (NOFX)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NOFX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
But keeping it as legal as possible will certainly cut down on that. Honestly, if there's that big of a problem with the laws, then either try to get them changed (many people will be needed, not just one) or move.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I'm not complaining...I live in an area where there are not a lot of hondas...lots of kids whos mommy and daddy bought them a WRX or an Evo. So i really dont get bothered to much. But im not going around cracking VTEC all day either. You are correct keeping it as legal as possible will help a lot. My advice to the Op, before purchasing an intake or exhaust just make sure it is carb approved and you are all set. All of my parts are carb approved and have only had one really big run in with the cops and they had to let me and the car go...with an apology after realizing that everything was mine not stolen and all parts were legal in the state of Cali.
But keeping it as legal as possible will certainly cut down on that. Honestly, if there's that big of a problem with the laws, then either try to get them changed (many people will be needed, not just one) or move.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I'm not complaining...I live in an area where there are not a lot of hondas...lots of kids whos mommy and daddy bought them a WRX or an Evo. So i really dont get bothered to much. But im not going around cracking VTEC all day either. You are correct keeping it as legal as possible will help a lot. My advice to the Op, before purchasing an intake or exhaust just make sure it is carb approved and you are all set. All of my parts are carb approved and have only had one really big run in with the cops and they had to let me and the car go...with an apology after realizing that everything was mine not stolen and all parts were legal in the state of Cali.
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05-16-2007, 01:55 PM
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H-T White Ops
Re: Engine swap rules for california ? (B16b-EJ8)
Definitely. I wasn't tryign to say you were complaining, but I do know a lot of peopel in CA do complain about it. If I lived there and were still passionate about my car, I'd move. It'd just be the easiest and cheaper alternative.
05-16-2007, 01:58 PM
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Re: Engine swap rules for california ? (NOFX)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NOFX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Definitely. I wasn't tryign to say you were complaining, but I do know a lot of peopel in CA do complain about it. If I lived there and were still passionate about my car, I'd move. It'd just be the easiest and cheaper alternative.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I have thought about it many times. Even though they do profile here...they have been given good reason to. A lot of Fast and the Furious types running around out there
I have thought about it many times. Even though they do profile here...they have been given good reason to. A lot of Fast and the Furious types running around out there
05-16-2007, 05:48 PM
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Re: Engine swap rules for california ? (grizzman)
I bar'd my first civic (95 Ej1) in 1996 with a 95 LS swap, it was a major pain in my *** and the ref didn't know ****.
Needless to say, I had to do all the research at CARB and CHP to prove to the ref that I was complying with ARB standards.
2 weeks and 4 smogs later, I passed.
It's a pain, but now you have the benefit of all these people like me who have been there and done that.
Thanks to the old "Hybrid" board for showing me the path to DOHC freedom!
Needless to say, I had to do all the research at CARB and CHP to prove to the ref that I was complying with ARB standards.
2 weeks and 4 smogs later, I passed.
It's a pain, but now you have the benefit of all these people like me who have been there and done that.
Thanks to the old "Hybrid" board for showing me the path to DOHC freedom!
05-16-2007, 08:39 PM
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Re: Engine swap rules for california ? (Ag-Eng)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Ag-Eng »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I bar'd my first civic (95 Ej1) in 1996 with a 95 LS swap, it was a major pain in my *** and the ref didn't know ****.
Needless to say, I had to do all the research at CARB and CHP to prove to the ref that I was complying with ARB standards.
2 weeks and 4 smogs later, I passed.
It's a pain, but now you have the benefit of all these people like me who have been there and done that.
Thanks to the old "Hybrid" board for showing me the path to DOHC freedom! </TD></TR></TABLE>
haha wow 4 smogs haha that must of been a pain, i've had my car refed twice, what a pain.
The process to go through is very hard to get a legit swap. you can always do it the poormans way but if you have the money and time then getting the motor refed is the way to go.
Needless to say, I had to do all the research at CARB and CHP to prove to the ref that I was complying with ARB standards.
2 weeks and 4 smogs later, I passed.
It's a pain, but now you have the benefit of all these people like me who have been there and done that.
Thanks to the old "Hybrid" board for showing me the path to DOHC freedom!
</TD></TR></TABLE>haha wow 4 smogs haha that must of been a pain, i've had my car refed twice, what a pain.
The process to go through is very hard to get a legit swap. you can always do it the poormans way but if you have the money and time then getting the motor refed is the way to go.
05-19-2007, 08:44 PM
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Re: (NOFX)
so I should be able to drop a b18 gsr motor with no problems then. you think? because its still considered a passenger car motor and a newer one at that.
05-19-2007, 09:16 PM
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Re: (custom session)
Smogged is referring to the strenuous emissions tests that a car undergoes. When you go get your car smogged, you're putting it through the emissions tests.
Reffed is the same thing. Referees are the people that perform said emissions tests and also visual safety inspections.
Reffed is the same thing. Referees are the people that perform said emissions tests and also visual safety inspections.
05-19-2007, 10:00 PM
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Re: (Eran)
lots of awesome info here for me. awesome post! man hopefully im able to get my swap done right since me and a few buddies of mine are going to be doing it.
05-19-2007, 10:03 PM
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Re: (grizzman)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by grizzman »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">so I should be able to drop a b18 gsr motor with no problems then. you think? because its still considered a passenger car motor and a newer one at that.</TD></TR></TABLE>
As long as that motor is from a car of the same year or newer than your car.
As long as that motor is from a car of the same year or newer than your car.
05-19-2007, 11:13 PM
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Re: (Eran)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Eran »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Reffed is the same thing. Referees are the people that perform said emissions tests and also visual safety inspections.</TD></TR></TABLE>
no there not, a refree is a state ref, one who would also be doing bar swap inspections,
a refree is able to smog a car and pass it, and may act as a smog tech but with certain more qualifications to the title
a smog tech could be anyone who passed the course that is requred
Reffed is the same thing. Referees are the people that perform said emissions tests and also visual safety inspections.</TD></TR></TABLE>
no there not, a refree is a state ref, one who would also be doing bar swap inspections,
a refree is able to smog a car and pass it, and may act as a smog tech but with certain more qualifications to the title
a smog tech could be anyone who passed the course that is requred
05-22-2007, 07:19 AM
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Re: Engine swap rules for california ? (RHD-EK)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RHD-EK »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">can they really know if i have a jdm 95h22a in a 96 civic? and how? it wont pass their test?</TD></TR></TABLE>
The motor "MUST" be the same year or newer. However, if you play your cards right and do lots of research, the year can be overlooked especially if it appears to be an OBD2 motor.
Trust me, the refs know the difference.
The motor "MUST" be the same year or newer. However, if you play your cards right and do lots of research, the year can be overlooked especially if it appears to be an OBD2 motor.
Trust me, the refs know the difference.
05-22-2007, 07:49 AM
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Re: Engine swap rules for california ? (Ag-Eng)
alrite.. so... when i get my GSR swap... would i need proof of installment.. as in a qualified mechanic... and do i need right paperwork for motor? what kind of paperwork would i need if i bought the motor off my friend which was the original motor to his car? i really want to know. i want to build a street legal bseries turbo over the next few months.
edit:: i can use ecu obd harness jumpers right?
edit:: i can use ecu obd harness jumpers right?
05-22-2007, 08:24 AM
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Re: Engine swap rules for california ? (bpkmrtoes)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bpkmrtoes »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">alrite.. so... when i get my GSR swap... would i need proof of installment.. as in a qualified mechanic... and do i need right paperwork for motor? what kind of paperwork would i need if i bought the motor off my friend which was the original motor to his car? i really want to know. i want to build a street legal bseries turbo over the next few months.
edit:: i can use ecu obd harness jumpers right?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Forget the turbo if you are trying to be legal...well unless you want to spend like 5k for the greddy one, and even then i think its only for a b16.
Having a mechanic do the install might not be a bad idea, make sure he knows you are planning on getting the engine BAR'd at the state ref and that you need all emission equipment hooked up accordingly. Make sure you have a copy of his registration showing the VIN so they can match it up to the VIN plate on the engine, along with a bill of sale.
edit:: i can use ecu obd harness jumpers right?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Forget the turbo if you are trying to be legal...well unless you want to spend like 5k for the greddy one, and even then i think its only for a b16.
Having a mechanic do the install might not be a bad idea, make sure he knows you are planning on getting the engine BAR'd at the state ref and that you need all emission equipment hooked up accordingly. Make sure you have a copy of his registration showing the VIN so they can match it up to the VIN plate on the engine, along with a bill of sale.
05-22-2007, 02:38 PM
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Re: Engine swap rules for california ? (B16b-EJ8)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B16b-EJ8 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Forget the turbo if you are trying to be legal...well unless you want to spend like 5k for the greddy one, and even then i think its only for a b16.
Having a mechanic do the install might not be a bad idea, make sure he knows you are planning on getting the engine BAR'd at the state ref and that you need all emission equipment hooked up accordingly. Make sure you have a copy of his registration showing the VIN so they can match it up to the VIN plate on the engine, along with a bill of sale.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Correct! When I did my GSR swap, I made sure the seller put the VIN number of the vehicle it came from just in case. Although I didn't need it, the ref called it in to CHP with the block number.
Best to CYA
Forget the turbo if you are trying to be legal...well unless you want to spend like 5k for the greddy one, and even then i think its only for a b16.
Having a mechanic do the install might not be a bad idea, make sure he knows you are planning on getting the engine BAR'd at the state ref and that you need all emission equipment hooked up accordingly. Make sure you have a copy of his registration showing the VIN so they can match it up to the VIN plate on the engine, along with a bill of sale.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Correct! When I did my GSR swap, I made sure the seller put the VIN number of the vehicle it came from just in case. Although I didn't need it, the ref called it in to CHP with the block number.
Best to CYA
