ECU Fried..Any Answers?
07-30-2005, 01:26 PM
#1
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ECU Fried..Any Answers?
I finished my JDM d15b swap today that I got from HMO, had alot of things wrong(broken valve cover bolts, exhaust manifold bolts, midpipe bolts and missing TPS) but other than that, it looks great. anyways, I got male and females pins for shocktower plugs and wired vtec up but left the two vtec plugs <U>unplugged</U>, put my DX ECU(chipped to p08 spec) and primed it and then cranked it up, started first time (thumbs up HMO), it idled about 15 seconds and my friend shut the car off, started choking and jumped into the passenger seat and unplugged the ECU, we walked out to get some fresh air and opened the ECU case up and this is what we found...
If anyone knows what part that is and what it controls or what might have happened, please chime in, im gunna keep trying to get ahold of John Vega (phearable.net) and see what he says...thanks all for the help!
If anyone knows what part that is and what it controls or what might have happened, please chime in, im gunna keep trying to get ahold of John Vega (phearable.net) and see what he says...thanks all for the help!
07-30-2005, 01:55 PM
#4
iTrader: (2)
Re: (SandstormGT)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SandstormGT »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">John called, apparently its something to do with the o2 sensor, thanks for te quick reply John!</TD></TR></TABLE>
Its actually evap purge being plugged into something its not supposed to be.
I thought it was an o2 sensor issue, but I guessed wrong at 1st until I realized it was q31.
Its easy to mix up those 2 wire grey plugs when your doing a swap which will cause you to damage q31 etc.
Let me know what happens when you figure out which plug is which in your engine bay.
Its actually evap purge being plugged into something its not supposed to be.
I thought it was an o2 sensor issue, but I guessed wrong at 1st until I realized it was q31.
Its easy to mix up those 2 wire grey plugs when your doing a swap which will cause you to damage q31 etc.
Let me know what happens when you figure out which plug is which in your engine bay.
07-30-2005, 02:02 PM
#5
Re: (mtber)
EVAP Purge solenoid and IAT sensor plugs were connected wrong. This is exactly what happens when the EVAP purge solenoid's plug is connected to the IAT sensor. You will need a new IAT sensor now as well. Q31 is a D1780, and is obsolete. The only way they can be sourced is from a parts ECU.
07-30-2005, 02:19 PM
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just went and put the ecu back in the car and cranked it up, it didnt throw any CEL's and the ECU didnt smoke anymore? could the plugs still be backwards?
EDIT1 :Also, I do have a JDM d15b, I think they are missing one of the sensors that the USDM manifolds have, I do know that I have a plug hanging from the harness below the intake manifold because there is nothing for it to go into...how do I tel lthe difference between evap purge and IAT?
EDIT2 : The color of the wires from the plug that is hanging is red/white and green/white i believe, its kinda dark outside....
Modified by SandstormGT at 3:41 PM 7/30/2005
EDIT1 :Also, I do have a JDM d15b, I think they are missing one of the sensors that the USDM manifolds have, I do know that I have a plug hanging from the harness below the intake manifold because there is nothing for it to go into...how do I tel lthe difference between evap purge and IAT?
EDIT2 : The color of the wires from the plug that is hanging is red/white and green/white i believe, its kinda dark outside....
Modified by SandstormGT at 3:41 PM 7/30/2005
07-30-2005, 02:58 PM
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I swapped the plugs and started the car, it showed no codes, if the IAT was bad should it show a code? also, the thing that exploded on the ecu, what exactly does it control, because if it controls evap purge, i dont have that on my intake manifold therefor I wouldnt necisarily need it, I appreciate the time Jim and thanks for calling John....let me know what you think, I will most likely just purchase a new ecu if my car wont run right with this ecu
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07-30-2005, 03:10 PM
#8
Re: (SandstormGT)
The D15B does not have the EVAP solenoid on the intake manifold because it is not needed for emissions control in Japan. You may have problems in your area, depending on local laws. The IAT plug has red/yellow and green/white wires. Pull the IAT sensor from the manifold and inspect it. They burn and melt when this happens.
07-30-2005, 03:16 PM
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So Jim, as far as the ECU goes, the part that poped on it, is it necisary for proper function of the car or no? i swapped the plugs and ran the car with the ECU, ECU didnt smoke, through no codes and idled good for about 10 minutes then I just shut it off. What do you think?
07-30-2005, 04:25 PM
#12
Honda-Tech Member
Re: (JDM-97CX)
There are no emissions in Mobile, Al as far as I know. So he should be fine. What are the specifications of that transistor, maybe that mdel is obsolete, but there maybe a replacement still just from another manufacturer.
Is that the part number, D1780? I can check at work to see if we have that in the parts bins. I can also check to see if it was used in any of the gear I work on and pull one off a circuit board from the carcass cage(A room we have for rejected equipment that we salvage components and parts from).
Is that the part number, D1780? I can check at work to see if we have that in the parts bins. I can also check to see if it was used in any of the gear I work on and pull one off a circuit board from the carcass cage(A room we have for rejected equipment that we salvage components and parts from).
07-30-2005, 04:54 PM
#13
Re: (hybrid_vtec)
Yeah, D1780. http://pdf.alldatasheet.com/da....html
High gain NPN with a zener diode across the base and collector. I haven't found a direct replacement yet, and I would be cautious about using a standard NPN transistor because the D1780 is made specifically to be directly driven from an IC without a pre-driver.
High gain NPN with a zener diode across the base and collector. I haven't found a direct replacement yet, and I would be cautious about using a standard NPN transistor because the D1780 is made specifically to be directly driven from an IC without a pre-driver.
07-30-2005, 05:17 PM
#14
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Re: (Jim Truett)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Jim Truett »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Yeah, D1780. http://pdf.alldatasheet.com/da....html
High gain NPN with a zener diode across the base and collector. I haven't found a direct replacement yet, and I would be cautious about using a standard NPN transistor because the D1780 is made specifically to be directly driven from an IC without a pre-driver.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I will check on it when I go back to work Monday.
High gain NPN with a zener diode across the base and collector. I haven't found a direct replacement yet, and I would be cautious about using a standard NPN transistor because the D1780 is made specifically to be directly driven from an IC without a pre-driver.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I will check on it when I go back to work Monday.
08-01-2005, 09:13 PM
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Wow, that mad my head hurt, you guys know your ECU components, everything seems to be working fine, I got it aligned today, been driving it around carefully, pulled the check SES code (TPS), went and bought a multimeter...hopefully either my USDM or JDM will be a working TPS and I can get it set right, will the TPS SES not let vtec engage, I got vtec wired up correctly this afternoon and I took it out to see if it worked and I could hear or feel a switchover, i figure SES is not letting it engage, either way, I appreciate all you guys' help!
08-01-2005, 10:02 PM
#16
Honda-Tech Member
Re: (SandstormGT)
I am TAD(temporary assigned duty) to a micro-minature repair class. i will be back at work in 2 weeks, so I will go by the lab when I get out of class and check on it this week. I love goingto school. i only go a couple of hours a day and I am off for the rest!
08-01-2005, 10:08 PM
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Re: (hybrid_vtec)
When I had this problem 2 weeks ago....no one except kenji knew WTF was going on. Now I come to this thread and get all excited to answer the question, and all of a sudden everyone knows whats wrong...
08-01-2005, 10:14 PM
#19
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Re: (SandstormGT)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SandstormGT »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Wow, that mad my head hurt, you guys know your ECU components, everything seems to be working fine, I got it aligned today, been driving it around carefully, pulled the check SES code (TPS), went and bought a multimeter...hopefully either my USDM or JDM will be a working TPS and I can get it set right, will the TPS SES not let vtec engage, I got vtec wired up correctly this afternoon and I took it out to see if it worked and I could hear or feel a switchover, i figure SES is not letting it engage, either way, I appreciate all you guys' help!</TD></TR></TABLE>
don't forget, Vtec will only engage when proper engine operating temperature is achieved. it will not engage when its cold
don't forget, Vtec will only engage when proper engine operating temperature is achieved. it will not engage when its cold
08-02-2005, 05:58 AM
#20
Re: (GetawayInMoscow)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GetawayInMoscow »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">BTW...
You shouldn't need a new IAT sensor because of this.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yes, he does. The IAT sensor is a Thermistor, a thermally varaible resistor. What he has now is a ball of carbon with melted plastic on it. It will still show resistance, but will not change based on temperature.
You shouldn't need a new IAT sensor because of this.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yes, he does. The IAT sensor is a Thermistor, a thermally varaible resistor. What he has now is a ball of carbon with melted plastic on it. It will still show resistance, but will not change based on temperature.
08-02-2005, 06:48 AM
#21
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Re: (Jim Truett)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Jim Truett »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Yes, he does. The IAT sensor is a Thermistor, a thermally varaible resistor. What he has now is a ball of carbon with melted plastic on it. It will still show resistance, but will not change based on temperature.</TD></TR></TABLE>
This doesn't make sense at all. The way the IAT works is it measures resistance. As the temperatrure changes the resistance changes. So if it still reads resistance, why won't it change bases on temperature?
Also wouldn't it throw an IAT code if this was the case?
Modified by GetawayInMoscow at 9:15 AM 8/2/2005
This doesn't make sense at all. The way the IAT works is it measures resistance. As the temperatrure changes the resistance changes. So if it still reads resistance, why won't it change bases on temperature?
Also wouldn't it throw an IAT code if this was the case?
Modified by GetawayInMoscow at 9:15 AM 8/2/2005
08-02-2005, 08:51 AM
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Re: (GetawayInMoscow)
Hmmm.. to see if the IAT is gone why dont you troubleshoot it with a multimeter? Doesnt the helms have the appropriate resistance values for different conditions?
08-02-2005, 09:52 AM
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Re: (JDM-97CX)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDM-97CX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You know that magic smoke that came out of the ECU? Yea, you can't put that back in there.</TD></TR></TABLE>
rotfflmfao...
rotfflmfao...
08-02-2005, 11:43 AM
#24
Re: (GetawayInMoscow)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GetawayInMoscow »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">This doesn't make sense at all. The way the IAT works is it measures resistance. As the temperatrure changes the resistance changes. So if it still reads resistance, why won't it change bases on temperature?
Also wouldn't it throw an IAT code if this was the case?
Modified by GetawayInMoscow at 9:15 AM 8/2/2005</TD></TR></TABLE>
No, it won't give a CEL because the ECU only measures the signal. It isn't programmed to expect change. This is why the IAT resistor mod will not illuminate the CEL. It still shows resistance because the sensor is now a damaged thermistor, and it still is a resistive.
Read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermistor
It makes sense because you destroy the thermistor by passing 12v DC through it. It would not melt the IAT if this was a normal condition. Have you ever seen an IAT melt in normal operation? No, that just doesn't happen.
If the IAT has been distorted or melted because it was connected incorrectly, it should be replaced. You can test it against it's resistance curve, but not everyone has the proper tools. Bottom line, if the tip of the IAT sensor is melted, it is trash.
Modified by Jim Truett at 4:22 PM 8/2/2005
Also wouldn't it throw an IAT code if this was the case?
Modified by GetawayInMoscow at 9:15 AM 8/2/2005</TD></TR></TABLE>
No, it won't give a CEL because the ECU only measures the signal. It isn't programmed to expect change. This is why the IAT resistor mod will not illuminate the CEL. It still shows resistance because the sensor is now a damaged thermistor, and it still is a resistive.
Read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermistor
It makes sense because you destroy the thermistor by passing 12v DC through it. It would not melt the IAT if this was a normal condition. Have you ever seen an IAT melt in normal operation? No, that just doesn't happen.
If the IAT has been distorted or melted because it was connected incorrectly, it should be replaced. You can test it against it's resistance curve, but not everyone has the proper tools. Bottom line, if the tip of the IAT sensor is melted, it is trash.
Modified by Jim Truett at 4:22 PM 8/2/2005
08-02-2005, 12:18 PM
#25
Honda-Tech Member
Re: (Jim Truett)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Jim Truett »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
No, it won't give a CEL because the ECU only measures the signal. It isn't programmed to expect change. This is why the IAT resistor mod will not illuminate the CEL. It still shows resistance because the sensor damaged thermistor still is a resistive element.
Read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermistor
It makes sense because you destroy the thermistor by passing 12v DC through it. It would not melt the IAT if this was a normal condition. Have you ever seen an IAT melt in normal operation? No, that just doesn't happen.
If the IAT has been distorted or melted because it was connected incorrectly, it should be replaced. You can test it against it's resistance curve, but not everyone has the proper tools. Bottom line, if the tip of the IAT sensor is melted, it is trash. </TD></TR></TABLE>
I have a Huntron Tracker!
Also about that transittor, I checked the Federal Supply System today and all I could find was P/N "2DS178", which I do not think is the same thing. Also the computer had no information on it so I couldn't compare it to teh sheet Jim posted up!
I have the manufacturer phone number soI will call them this week and see. I will also ask one of the civilian guys in my lab, if he would know a replacement!
No, it won't give a CEL because the ECU only measures the signal. It isn't programmed to expect change. This is why the IAT resistor mod will not illuminate the CEL. It still shows resistance because the sensor damaged thermistor still is a resistive element.
Read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermistor
It makes sense because you destroy the thermistor by passing 12v DC through it. It would not melt the IAT if this was a normal condition. Have you ever seen an IAT melt in normal operation? No, that just doesn't happen.
If the IAT has been distorted or melted because it was connected incorrectly, it should be replaced. You can test it against it's resistance curve, but not everyone has the proper tools. Bottom line, if the tip of the IAT sensor is melted, it is trash. </TD></TR></TABLE>
I have a Huntron Tracker!
Also about that transittor, I checked the Federal Supply System today and all I could find was P/N "2DS178", which I do not think is the same thing. Also the computer had no information on it so I couldn't compare it to teh sheet Jim posted up!
I have the manufacturer phone number soI will call them this week and see. I will also ask one of the civilian guys in my lab, if he would know a replacement!
