bass6153

sooo just wondering how you guys downshift? i ussually clutch brake and then turn... people say clutchin very early is realli bad and so you should slow down the speed first... anyone know a good pro technique of making good fast downshifts from high speeds? I'm trying to perfect my driving so that i 'm driving a manual like an auto... Btw i just got my lisc

DaveSi677

I think what they are trying to tell you is if you are at red line in a certain gear you should not try and downshift in a lower gear.

As for techniques, I you usually press the clutch in a blip the throttle and then change gear and release the clutch... it takes like 1 second to do really. I think the best way for you to get is by try it yourself.... remember practice makes perfect!

Dave

bass6153

hmm would you say downshifting gear and making that loud sound wen it like tryin to slow down the (i dunno wt its called) but i think it is the gears bad for the caR? nah i dun redline my car well not intentionally...

Dilly

yeah, what dave said, pressing in the clutch and blip the throttle... in other words, rev matching. one of my favorite techniques is called heel and toe. its a rev matching technique. just search heel toe on google and there will be some sites that'll teach you how to do it.

bass6153

Holi ****... its all comin togethor now... alll this drift bible that i have been watchin... i finally understand what this heal and toe is tks everyone :D time for practice :D

DaveSi677

lets say you are doing 60 mph in 4 gear. Now to go into 3 gear nice and smooth you would press the clutch in and then give a shot of gas to make the rev go up so you would be able to get in to 3rd nicely.

By doing this you are try to REV Match the speed for the lower gear. Basically going into 3 gear at the right RPM for 60 mph.

What you are trying to accomplish is basically make the transmission and engine turn at the same time. When you become really good at this you will be able to do it with the clutch even.

If still a little confused don't be shy to ask. I think it is good to now how to downshift properly. By doing it right you are going to have less problem with your transmision.

Dave

DaveSi677

ok forget about that drift bible that is so bullshit... remember you drive a fwd and not a rwd!!!!

Dave

Dilly

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bass6153 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Holi ****... its all comin togethor now... alll this drift bible that i have been watchin... i finally understand what this heal and toe is tks everyone :D time for practice :D</TD></TR></TABLE>

haha. yeah, practice will get you there. by the way, congrats on getting your license. drive safe out there too... a lot of bad drivers out there. haha. oh also... since you said you watched drift bible a lot, dont try to drift your civic.. or whatever it is.

bass6153

ahahha nah just watchin it coz the old japanese guy is like realli pro... but yer ...i watched him explain his techniques on drifting and hes 'like "you should apply heal and toe" and i had no clue wt he was on about untill now .. if i'll drift ill do it maybe on tracks some day Hmmm tryin to you tube the heal and toe and results come up of girls heals and toes?! i'm like WTF?! anyone got a good link ?

Dilly

haha. girls heals and toes is probably showing up because its spelled "heel". not "heal". haha. but umm.... links... try this one http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heel-and-Toe

bass6153

AHAHA maybe thats y i failed english... but yer anyways... i just saw this other technique about double clutch? which one would u guys recommend me practice first?

Tiger_Si

i hope you are not misunderstanding the concept of heel and toe.....

heel and toe is only performed when you are braking and downshifting, it is not your regular downshift.

TIPS: if you are just driving at normal speeds, dont bother with heel and toe, when the turn comes just shift to neutral and then gas a little (while in neutral) and shift to a lower gear.

bass6153

your tip is double clutch right?

jadugartir

no, double clutching is popping the clutch in the same gear.

Before you can learn to heeltoe, you need to practice rev matching. That is where you downshift, tap the gas to get it up to the perfect RPM before letting the clutch engage. You have to first learn where your car needs to be in any gear at any speed. After you have a feel for that, you can start to heeltoe, which is basically just rev matching, except you throw braking into the mix, might want to get a new pair of driving shoes, chucks work pretty well.

Bense

[b]<FONT SIZE="8">R-E-P-O-S-T</FONT>

Syndacate

heal and toe is completely UNECCESSARY for road driving.

It depends what ur downshifting for, if I'm putting it into 3rd for a curve (or 4th for that matter....obviously from 5th) I clutch/shift, kick up the RPM's, let out the clutch, then get on the gas (or if I'm in a hurry just keep the gas down and let the clutch slam out (worse for the tranny/clutch, faster and more powerful downshift)..

for like a 4 way intersection you downshift BEFORE the turn (either to slow u down or after u've slown down) because if u torque up the wheels DURING a turn and overtorque them you'll understeer (usually only applicable at tracks, though I've seen instances where it's happend on the road).. Personally I downshift to slow down and take the turn in the same gear (the best way)..

if ur going to take a hairpin at like 40mph, ur gonna need to drop it into 2nd before that turn comes or the torque'll lock those wheels so fast u'll understeer right off the end, u have to have 2nd full engaged before u even start turning that steering wheel..

There's a whole "way to drive" that's differed between street and track driving...

Just remember 2nd gear's good for about 60mph...so if ur in the 50's and need to slow down fast, that's a good way (just make sure u kick theRPM's or the car'll have a heart attack )

Give a more specific application w/ speeds

If ur talking about the loud sound being high RPM's, that's fine, the stock engien is good to the redline...that's why it's there...I wouldn't recommend riding the redline b/c that'll just wear ur engine out faster, but if u downshift to 7.2k in a D16Z6 to slow down (although that's a bit dramatic of a downshift) it's not gonna hurt the car...

If ur talking about grinidng the gears then yes taht's bad for the syncros....

Don't worry about rallying or drifting in ur civic....just don't worry about it - keep the car in one piece..

As for dillywong, don't listen to him, the heal 'n toe motion is better for autocross and drifting - not really a practical move for every day driving - though I've seen pple use it for everyday driving (same pple who tend to throw rods on a monthly basis)...

If you need help like "learning" plz feel free to PM me, one of the things i greatly enjoy is helping pple to drive standard - whether it be online or in real life...

Listen to jadugartir - practice rev matching before u do anything else - it's by far the most efficient and tranny/engine saving, (not to mention useful), practical tactic you will ever use when driving a standard - not to mention ur passengers will appreciate not going through the windshield b/c u suck at downshifting :-P


EDIT:
The reason I discourage the use of heal and toe is it serves one (1) purpose: To downshift while entering a turn while still braking. This is ONLY needed when ur in an autocross race and u need to slow down as quickly as possible (as much brake time as possible) but need to downshift as well....

Syndacate

Here: This is what pros do at the track:
http://www.funny-base.com/vide....html

This is PROS though, as you can see, he's very good at heal and toe...

You DON'T NEED to do this street driving AT ALL


One word:
Uneccessary.

pli

uh oh! i always stick it into neutral and roll and just stick it back into gear whenever i should. ive only attempted to downshift a couple times and when i do it, i never rev match it. is that bad? no one taught me how to downshift so i experimented a couple times. i knew it was bad, the way i was doing it.

hehe, well, another lesson learned. thanks again H-T