abiliojr

Checking timing light on my 1998 Civic (D16Y), I got weird results as explained in this other thread (https://honda-tech.com/honda-civic-d...light-3222133/).

So I checked for top dead center with a stick inside the spark plug #1, and found the marks were completely off. Removed the valve cover, and the marks in the camshaft pulley did align when cylinder #1 is at TDC. So crankshaft and camshaft are perfectly aligned.

Then, the only possible reason for the marks to be that far away is that the crankshaft pulley is off. Now the question is, how did that happen? I did the timing belt last time, and I'm pretty sure everything was perfectly aligned.

Plus, doesn't the Woodruff key keep the pulley aligned to a crankshaft indentation? So how come the marks are not aligned anymore?

09chaplak

Posted this in your other thread then saw you were changing to this one......
When you change the belt, the last step is putting the pulley back on. If you noticed, the drive pulley has that key in which the pulley can only go on one way. The Crank pulley does not, leaving it susceptible to movement when installing it. This will cause your timing marks to be out of sync making the timing light looking like it's far out of time when in fact the car could be running just fine. You have to make sure the Crank pulley does not move when bolting it back in. When installing the pulley back on, I try to hold it while tightening the bolt as much as possible to ensure it does not move. Then I grab the crank bolt tool to tighten it all the way to spec. Hope this helps.

JPhilBradley

https://www.google.com/search?safe=o...TDI&gws_rd=ssl

All of these have a notch for the woodruff key...

abiliojr

Ok, the woodruff key jumped away, and the crankshaft is chipped at the place. Going to open a new thread

abiliojr

While disassemble to check for the culprit of my displaced timing marks, got the crankshaft pulley out, just to find out a chipped crankshaft and what I believe is a very distorted woodruff key, lying on the bottom of the timing belt cover.

I'm currently trying to find a replacement for the key (which is hard in my country), but I don't know what to do with the chipped portion of the crankshaft. Obviously I don't want to replace the crankshaft, so I want to hear options. Also, what should I do if I can't find the key?

abiliojr

Is a Civic 98 D16Y engine. TI attached two pictures of the crankshaft end.

A few questions questions: what is the woodruff key for? Is it meant to avoid the pulley to slip in normal operation? Lets suppose I don't use the woodruff key. Will the pulley slip or will the bolt keep it in place?

My pulley rotates freely when placed over the crankshaft. Is it supposed to do that?

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

The woodruff key is supposed to lock the crank pulley to the crank. No, the bolt will not hold it in place. No, the crank pulley is not supposed to spin freely. Yes, you need a woodruff key there. Ideally, you should either replace the crank, or bring the motor to a professional welder and have them build up and file down that section to repair it. If you're too [insert excuse here] to do either of those, I have heard of people having good results with JB Weld. Personally, I wouldn't trust it.

abiliojr

Just to know, why a thing like this would happen?

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

Old metallurgy, combined with a sudden force on the crank pulley (jammed PS/Alt pulley, misfire), or just randomly from age.

abiliojr

If the pulley rotates freely around the crankcase (no effort required) instead of kinda sitting and getting stuck into it means the pulley is gone and I need a replacement?

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

...wut?

Your crank pulley is rotating freely because you don't have a Woodruff key in there. Fix the fucked up keyway, and install a new woodruff key, and your pulley will no longer spin freely.

tony_2018

The crank pulley is not suppose to spin freely, even if you think you tightened it with the crank pulley bolt. You need that key. I kinda figured this had to be the issue.

abiliojr

But interesting enough (or pure luck) the timing marks didn't move out of their wrong place in 3 months (so the pulley was at the exact same position) the two times I tested the timing light, 3 months appart.

I can't belive a 4 mm thing can drive several horsepower (not including the inertia that needs to be broken) into the accessories (I've been told the AC compressor uses 3 HP just itself). 4 mm split 2 makes 2mm on the indentation in the crankshaft... seems that the woodruff key is really strong, but even more impressive, the crankshaft material is quite amazing to drive that much force into such a tiny space.

There is no friction at all between the crankshaft and the pulley? I keep asking this because a mechanic told me I needed to replace the pulley no matter what, and in here pulleys are not that cheap, so I would like to know.

abiliojr

Lets say I remove the plastic cover and the rubber oil seal... Would it be ok to weld it in place, or should I take the crankshaft out (which I guess I wont be doing myself). Should I remove the oil pump? In case the crankshaft removal is a must, should I change anything else (I've heard you can't just remove and reinstall the crankshaft without replacing a lot of things, almost half of an engine rebuilt).

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

There's more behind that cover than just the seal. Unless you need to replace your timing belt or oil seal, don't fiddle with it. Bring the engine to a welder, have them build the metal back up and file it down, ask them to check your pulley to see if they need to do the same there, buy a new woodruff key (they're stupidly cheap), and reinstall everything. Removing the crank shouldn't be necessary, and a good welder should be able to do the job without damaging your seal.

tony_2018

Take a picture of the pulley where the key sits. NO there is no friction between pull and crank. If you notice there are no splines on the crank or the pulley.

Where is "in here", choice of words are weird.

abiliojr

So you say there is no need to remove the crankshaft from the engine? Do you know the kind of electrode that should be used?

Jimster480

I had this happen on my turbo setup before. It is fixable. Do you have a pic of the crank snout?
What I used was a new key + a cut nail and a bit of JB-Weld. It held fine since then. It will be a bit hard to take off next time but if you just changed the timing belt you should be fine.

tony_2018

Sure, why not. Just redneck it.

Jimster480

Can guarantee it's 1000x better than replacing the entire engine. Because if the end of the crank is damaged it's GG. Replace engine or redneck it.

jdmcivicsi187

File the crank to where the next size woodruff key will fit. You will probably need to make a stepped key. Or if not take it to a machine shop theyll fix you right up if they know what they are doing