Relic1

I have been through three master cylinders, bled the system more time than I can count and still have a sinking pedal problem.
So I'm doubting my bleeding order.

the civic manuals (EG/EK) state RR-FL-RL-FR order
the teg manual (DC2) states FL-FR-RR-RL order

which should I use?

my setup
92 VX
1" 96 GSR MS/BB (ABS)
4040 prop
SS lines
'99 SI front knuckles/rotors/calipers
'94 SiR rear disks

everything was perfect till one week after I reflared and rerouted the lines for the 1" MS/BB.

Is there any thing else that can cause sinking pedal??
I ran the pedal down 10-15 times, no leaks, no fluid loss in MS.

I searched and found tons of posts but nothing that matched.

IHateJDM

RR-FL-RL-FR order

that's how i do mine and it works fine. I don't think the order you are bleeding them in is your problem.

cxSHOE

brake bleeding order is not necessary. as long as you get all the air out of each line , order of brake bleeding is not important. most will argue, and say it does matter. ive have done about 10 brake bleeds with different orders and never had a problem with bleeding. but only once due to rushing.

you may have some air in your rear brake lines. i remember i had the same problem and flushing my drivers side for 10 minutes. finally the bubbles emerged.

as long as you dont see visible leaks, its most likely a line issue. so bleed the system again.

johnecon2001

Bleed farthest wheel from the M/C to the closest. RR LR RF LF.

Relic1

thanks guys, at least I'm thinking right. Frustration tends to add doubt, four days of it....

is there anything that would make a specific car more difficult to bleed?

I've bled several cars, even another 92 hatch and had no problems with them.
Yet mine will not play nice. It didn't when I upgraded the front and rear brakes either. I ran 4 quarts of fluid though it trying to get it bled and gave up, so I just drove it with a semi-squishy pedal, after a week or two the pedal went to normal.

As it sits now I don't even want to try driving it, you can get to the floor in ~2 seconds. So I'm not to the point of letting it settle out again.
I've all ready spent 5 hours bleeding it, three times around per MS, ~one reservoir worth of fluid per corner each time around.
Luckily I'm recycling the fluid now that it's obviously 100% clean, Motul fluid gets pricey when you're pumping it though like this.

I'll run a quart through tonight and see if I get any bubbles.

IHateJDM

just to make sure, you are releasing the bleeder valves while the brake pedal is still down, right?

Relic1

pump twice, pedal down till pressure, crack bleeder, pedal falls, close bleeder, pedal up, pedal down till pressure, crack bleeder, pedal falls, close bleeder, pedal up, pedal down till pressure, etc.

IHateJDM

ok, just making sure it wasn't something simple.

marshun

dont push the pedall all the way to the floor when youre bleeding.

also are you bleeding the master cylinder first? you should be doing so.


pushing the pedal all the way down when bleeding will cause the thing to fail

Relic1

I do bench bleed the MS first.
The pedal does remain slightly off the floor when releasing the fluid.

RTI

Are you sure the MC is not the problem? It sounds like there a leak internally with fluid leaking by the piston.

Relic1

I have no idea what the problem is.... but three (one used, two rebuilt) with the same problem?

marshun

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Relic1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I do bench bleed the MS first.
The pedal does remain slightly off the floor when releasing the fluid.</TD></TR></TABLE>

slightly off the floor isnt gonna cut it. you'd wanna pretty much push it just over half way.

also, you might've adjusted the MC a little too much

and have you tried just gravity bleeding it?