All motor vs. turbo?
11-06-2007, 07:53 PM
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All motor vs. turbo?
well i have around $2,000 saved up and i want to know what you all think
my ride: 93 civic ex
my motor: B16A
other mods: jdm header, test pipe, skunk2 catback, skunk2 intake manifold, skunk2 70mm throttle body, K&N cool air intake cut down to a short ram.
now with all that under my belt, i was depating slapping turbo on. or tearing apart the b16a and building it from oil pan up??
whats your guys thoughts?
TURBO
ALL MOTOR
Modified by justinrl613 at 3:43 PM 11/7/2007
my ride: 93 civic ex
my motor: B16A
other mods: jdm header, test pipe, skunk2 catback, skunk2 intake manifold, skunk2 70mm throttle body, K&N cool air intake cut down to a short ram.
now with all that under my belt, i was depating slapping turbo on. or tearing apart the b16a and building it from oil pan up??
whats your guys thoughts?
TURBO
ALL MOTOR
Modified by justinrl613 at 3:43 PM 11/7/2007
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11-06-2007, 10:57 PM
#13
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I personally am an all motor kind of guy. Not just for the driveability but also the feel of them. The response, the exhaust tone, etc. The cool thing about boosting is the massive increase in torque, but then it's just a Japanese muscle car. I think 111lb-ft is plenty to get a 2600lb car moving (just don't load all of your friends into the car 
). 
).
11-06-2007, 11:02 PM
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Re: (Hardedge)
turbo that bitch NA is for fools
reliability all depends on you doing everything the way its suppose to be. just cause you turbo it doesn't mean its not realiable its the quality of the work that gets put into the car. your tune will be pretty much what breaks or makes your car. i've seen tons of cars be unreliable because people half *** **** that includes turbo and NA cars. so really in the end the choice is up to you. 
reliability all depends on you doing everything the way its suppose to be. just cause you turbo it doesn't mean its not realiable its the quality of the work that gets put into the car. your tune will be pretty much what breaks or makes your car. i've seen tons of cars be unreliable because people half *** **** that includes turbo and NA cars. so really in the end the choice is up to you.
11-06-2007, 11:04 PM
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Re: All motor vs. turbo? (95ProjectEJ1)
NA if anything. For $2k, you can not have a reliable turbo car. Unless you're stealing parts, and getting homie discounts on everything else. Unless your definition of reliable is very very relaxed. "Works sometimes" is not reliable to me. But I guess everyone has different views on that.
A good turbo will usually cost you around $300-500 even used. Tuning costs around the same. So you're allready at between $600-1k. That doesn't leave much money for the intercooler, injectors, engine management, lines, hoses, boost controller, wastegate, fabrication of exhaust parts, blow off valve, and a manifold. Not to mention countless other things. You either have to cut corners or put more money on your credit card. Then you have to think about a radiator, a clutch, tires to hold the power, parts that get broken from the power, etc. Then you're up to about $5k or more including labor...and your motor is still stock. Then you end up blowing that up for WHATEVER reason..and you have to buy a motor...maybe build it. Now you're looking closer to $10k or more. After spending all that, you'll probably be too afraid to drive it hard. Then you'll sell it and buy an Evo or STi for around $25-30k. I've seen this happen SO MANY times.
My suggestions:
First, put a cat back on. The test pipe is pointless.
Then I'd say throw a set of 00-01 ITR cams or CTR cams (same deal) into the head. Get some ITR or CTR springs for safety. Either get a CTR ecu or just get hondata and tune your stock ECU. Get an ITR intake manifold or skunk2 manifold. If you have any money left over, there ARE other things in life than cars.
You wont have the all out power of a turbo car, but your car will be more driveable, more reliable, and it will end up costing a lot less. It's more fun to just enjoy the car worry free.
BTW, what exactly are you going to do with all that power going to your FRONT wheels?
A good turbo will usually cost you around $300-500 even used. Tuning costs around the same. So you're allready at between $600-1k. That doesn't leave much money for the intercooler, injectors, engine management, lines, hoses, boost controller, wastegate, fabrication of exhaust parts, blow off valve, and a manifold. Not to mention countless other things. You either have to cut corners or put more money on your credit card. Then you have to think about a radiator, a clutch, tires to hold the power, parts that get broken from the power, etc. Then you're up to about $5k or more including labor...and your motor is still stock. Then you end up blowing that up for WHATEVER reason..and you have to buy a motor...maybe build it. Now you're looking closer to $10k or more. After spending all that, you'll probably be too afraid to drive it hard. Then you'll sell it and buy an Evo or STi for around $25-30k. I've seen this happen SO MANY times.
My suggestions:
First, put a cat back on. The test pipe is pointless.
Then I'd say throw a set of 00-01 ITR cams or CTR cams (same deal) into the head. Get some ITR or CTR springs for safety. Either get a CTR ecu or just get hondata and tune your stock ECU. Get an ITR intake manifold or skunk2 manifold. If you have any money left over, there ARE other things in life than cars.
You wont have the all out power of a turbo car, but your car will be more driveable, more reliable, and it will end up costing a lot less. It's more fun to just enjoy the car worry free.
BTW, what exactly are you going to do with all that power going to your FRONT wheels?
11-06-2007, 11:06 PM
#16
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Re: (nihad)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nihad »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">See i love my boosted civic but some time i wish i had all motor because u have power all the time u dont have to wait for boost at 4k but when it hit i loose control of car Ha.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Dont have to wait? you have to wait till at least 6500RPM to make any power from a B16A all motor. But then again...you only have to wait once. The next gear puts you back in the power band if you shift at redline.
Dont have to wait? you have to wait till at least 6500RPM to make any power from a B16A all motor. But then again...you only have to wait once. The next gear puts you back in the power band if you shift at redline.
11-06-2007, 11:09 PM
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With a little over 2K on a turbo build you can hit 300hp at the wheels with a B16. You can't do that all motor, you'd be lucky to see 250.
11-06-2007, 11:15 PM
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Re: (Syndacate)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Syndacate »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">With a little over 2K on a turbo build you can hit 300hp at the wheels with a B16. You can't do that all motor, you'd be lucky to see 250.</TD></TR></TABLE>
uhh? with $2k, on a B16A, you'd be lucky to see 200whp. 250 out of a B16A would be INSANE. The motor would no longer even be a street motor.
But with a $2k turbo setup 300whp B16A, reliability goes down the tubes.
uhh? with $2k, on a B16A, you'd be lucky to see 200whp. 250 out of a B16A would be INSANE. The motor would no longer even be a street motor.
But with a $2k turbo setup 300whp B16A, reliability goes down the tubes.
11-06-2007, 11:50 PM
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Re: (B serious)
why do you think turbo people usually sell their cars after making 350-400 whp? because that **** is not gonna last long.
If you are planning to drive a lot and its your only car and you want to be quick go NA.
You can get much more miles out of it then a turbo car can.
If you are planning to drive a lot and its your only car and you want to be quick go NA.
You can get much more miles out of it then a turbo car can.
11-07-2007, 03:58 AM
#21
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Re: (SilverWarrior)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SilverWarrior »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">why do you think turbo people usually sell their cars after making 350-400 whp? because that **** is not gonna last long.
If you are planning to drive a lot and its your only car and you want to be quick go NA.
You can get much more miles out of it then a turbo car can.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
So why do car manufacturers sell cars with turbos on them? True, they need to be maintained more often, but then again, you're cramming quite a bit of air into a very confined place and making power.
To the OP, honestly, it's a B16 aka the Torqueless Wonder, and it would take alot of time/money to build a high-powered N/A car as opposed to turbocharging it and making MORE power for LESS...the downside is you have to maintain it a bit more, but is it really that hard?
I say turbo...and if you were to go all-motor, I'd get a bigger motor (B18, H22, etc.)
If you are planning to drive a lot and its your only car and you want to be quick go NA.
You can get much more miles out of it then a turbo car can.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
So why do car manufacturers sell cars with turbos on them? True, they need to be maintained more often, but then again, you're cramming quite a bit of air into a very confined place and making power.
To the OP, honestly, it's a B16 aka the Torqueless Wonder, and it would take alot of time/money to build a high-powered N/A car as opposed to turbocharging it and making MORE power for LESS...the downside is you have to maintain it a bit more, but is it really that hard?
I say turbo...and if you were to go all-motor, I'd get a bigger motor (B18, H22, etc.)
11-07-2007, 04:27 AM
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Re: (JKov240)
so what im hearing alot of is turboin my b16 is the most cost effective way of getting lots of power, but it wolt be as reliable
wehile go NA on such a small motor will last longer, but it will cost a little more and youll have less power, unless you go with a bigger motor....
well im still debating
the best i have heard so far is to get a h22 and go n/a with that
wehile go NA on such a small motor will last longer, but it will cost a little more and youll have less power, unless you go with a bigger motor....
well im still debating
the best i have heard so far is to get a h22 and go n/a with that
11-07-2007, 04:52 AM
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Re: (justinrl613)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by justinrl613 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
the best i have heard so far is to get a h22 and go n/a with that</TD></TR></TABLE>
you could do that, but you've already got a B16 installed. na can be fun, but with your budget, and considering of how little torque the b16 puts out, i'd go the turbo route.
And you definately shouldn't need to wait until 4k for boost. Get a reasonable turbo, smaller.
the best i have heard so far is to get a h22 and go n/a with that</TD></TR></TABLE>
you could do that, but you've already got a B16 installed. na can be fun, but with your budget, and considering of how little torque the b16 puts out, i'd go the turbo route.
And you definately shouldn't need to wait until 4k for boost. Get a reasonable turbo, smaller.
