amej8

This may sound stupid, but I'll be honest and admit I really don't know much at all about how a car works.

So I notice when it's cold, and I start my car, it takes FOREVER to warm up. At least a half hour for the needle to even start moving and the RPM's to drop around below 1000. But my buddy (he has a 99 civic ex coupe just like mine, but with ~106k miles and not 188k), when he starts his car, his needle starts moving within 5 minutes and his car warms up easy.

Does this have anything to do with the thermostat or anything else? If so, would changing the thermostat help the car warm up easier and/or faster? It's been getting close to 0 degrees here (even during the day) and my car just takes ages to warm up and I don't really like driving it when it's ice cold and doesn't warm up at least a little bit.

Hardedge

Under what conditions is this happening between the two cars? Are you going by how your car warms up in the morning after it's sat all night and comparing it to when your friend starts his car after it's already been driven recently, or what? I live in southern Arizona and for the last couple of days we've had temperatures in the 70s and my car still takes over 10 minutes of idling to fully warm up, so yours seems normal for freezing temperatures. By the way, the thermostat is just a valve that's operated by temperature (it opens and permits full coolant circulation when it gets hot enough), so it has nothing to do with warming up because technically it shouldn't ever open early. However if it malfunctions and doesn't open, then your hot coolant doesn't get to the radiator and your engine could overheat.

If you want it to warm up faster, it shouldn't hurt to hold the throttle open a little and keeps the revs a little higher than the IACV wants to. Maybe hold it at a gentle 2500 RPM or so and increase to 3000 after you're about halfway warmed up. The only better advice I could give you is to wait to hear from another HT member who lives in similar conditions to you and find out what works for them.

amej8

I'm talking like when the car has been sitting off for 5+ hours in 10-20 degree temperatures so it's back to being a block of ice. So basically the same as sitting over night.

Is there anything I could change that might be causing the car to not warm up as quickly as it should? Or would it just be a case of the engine being old and so worn out (188,xxx miles) that it takes longer for it to warm up.

cimo463

Most likely its your thermostat. I have been changing alot lately at work with the same problem

Hardedge

Engine wear doesn't have much to do with it (if anything). Maybe your friend is running a higher percentage of water in his coolant. Then again, he may have a block heater which comes in handy in your climate. It's basically an electrical device that preheats the coolant before the engine starts. The only way it's the thermostat is if it's stuck open permanently.

robfrmny21

change it is cheap and easy to change.

your car should not take a half hr to warm up, unless your in -20f weather

amej8

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hardedge &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Engine wear doesn't have much to do with it (if anything). Maybe your friend is running a higher percentage of water in his coolant. Then again, he may have a block heater which comes in handy in your climate. It's basically an electrical device that preheats the coolant before the engine starts. The only way it's the thermostat is if it's stuck open permanently.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm almost positive he doesn't have that. As long as it's a clearly visible device in the engine bay, then I'm 100% sure he doesn't have it. I've been in his engine bay almost as much as I've been in mine and I've never seen such a thing.

So I'm getting mixed opinions on thermostat being a possibility or not... Hmm

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by robfrmny21 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">change it is cheap and easy to change.

your car should not take a half hr to warm up, unless your in -20f weather</TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm really not exaggerating when I say it takes at least a half hour for the needle to even start moving after I've turned on the car.

Anyone know how much thermostat's run from the stealership?

cimo463

Man I am telling you the thermostat is stuck open...whick is constantly cycling cold coolant through your block...therfore not allowing your coolant to heat up in normal time

Hardedge

http://www.hondaautomotivepart...81%29

Twelve bucks, change it. When was it last changed anyway?

amej8

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hardedge &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> http://www.hondaautomotivepart...81%29

Twelve bucks, change it. When was it last changed anyway? </TD></TR></TABLE>

Never lol. A lot of the parts on my car are still original, never changed. Except timing belt, water pump, and maybe 1 or 2 more things. Which reminds me I have to get around to doing that again since I'm getting close to 190k.

Thanks guys .

Any How-To's on changing it? lol... I know it's sad. But I really don't know much about cars (mechanically) in general. I'd like to know what I'm up against before tackling this problem.

Hardedge

Do a search on this site. I know that there have been at least a couple of write-ups on changing a Civic's thermostat. Also, don't be intimidated, it's basically requires you to just be able to work a socket wrench.

amej8

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hardedge &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Do a search on this site. I know that there have been at least a couple of write-ups on changing a Civic's thermostat. Also, don't be intimidated, it's basically requires you to just be able to work a socket wrench. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Thanks man . Appreciate the help. If H-T had a rep system like D-Series, I'd rep haha.

cimo463

I am assuming you have an ej8....so take the airtube or if ya have an intake take that off...it will give ya alot more room...right below that look for the coolant hose that is running into the block...take the bolts off the thermo housing and swap it out...its pretty simple...

amej8

Yeah I searched and found out it's just 2 bolts holding it in. Few more questions...

1: should I consider flushing out my old coolant and putting new in if I'm going to change the t-stat? Or will I be fine running current coolant.

2: if 1 is true, how do I know when I have enough in there? and how to check?

3: will coolant spill out of the radiator hose once I unhook it? I don't want coolant everywhere and have to clean it up in this freezing weather =/. I'd rather swap it out in a few minutes and get it done.

amej8

Eh I read a bunch of threads on how to change the coolant. Seems easy. Just unplug the radiator drain plug and block drain plug. I'd rather not run water through the block. Too much arguments about mineral deposits and such being left behind.

Thanks again guys .

amej8

Well I just changed the t-stat and within 6 minutes, the needle started moving . Engine got warmed up SO MUCH quicker than normal. Note - car's been sitting off for the past 5 hours in 20-25 degree weather.

I'd take a picture of the old t-stat but I have no camera. Some of the rubber is missing and it's rusted a little bit.

Coolant flush / change to come this weekend.

Thanks H-T .

mistersparco

Please let us know if your MPG is improved.

bigsyke

Hardedge almost all the info you gave was unfortunately wrong. Sorry but wrong info is a killer;

- The thermostat would be the #1 thing to inspect, because most chances it gets stuck open.

- Dont EVER hold the throttle to warm the car up. Again horrible advice. Honda recommends 1 minute to warm the engine before driving. I wait 5.

-Engine wear is caused on cold starts. WRONG again.

-Running a higher ratio of water in the coolant? That would mean it would take 8x longer to warm up, because water doesnt mix as well with the coolant, and the water portion will freeze. I filled my reserve tank with water and a little coolant, and the water part is still frozen.

-How is the device supposed to heat the coolant up when the water pump isnt running to circulate?

cimo463

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by amej8 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well I just changed the t-stat and within 6 minutes, the needle started moving . Engine got warmed up SO MUCH quicker than normal. Note - car's been sitting off for the past 5 hours in 20-25 degree weather.

I'd take a picture of the old t-stat but I have no camera. Some of the rubber is missing and it's rusted a little bit.

Coolant flush / change to come this weekend.

Thanks H-T .</TD></TR></TABLE>

Its the T-stat every time! glad we could help ya

amej8

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mistersparco &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Please let us know if your MPG is improved. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Might sound stupid but how would MPG be effected by the thermostat? Doesn't it just control the flow of coolant to and from the engine depending on engine temperature or whatever?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bigsyke &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">- Dont EVER hold the throttle to warm the car up. Again horrible advice. Honda recommends 1 minute to warm the engine before driving. I wait 5.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Don't mean to argue with you but all the auto teachers I've had and met have said rev'ing the engine just a tiny bit higher doesn't hurt the engine. 1 of them is a professor and master tech (if that makes a difference ). He's been in the field for longer than I've been alive.

randerson0248

Cool engine runs richer. Warm engine runs leaner. Controlled by ECU.

SOHC_4dr

and on a cold start and if its been sitting for a few hours, the oil isnt instantly coating everything which is metal to metal and yes that causes wear. but its nothing to be concerned of

austinkli

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bigsyke &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Hardedge almost all the info you gave was unfortunately wrong. Sorry but wrong info is a killer;

- The thermostat would be the #1 thing to inspect, because most chances it gets stuck open.

- Dont EVER hold the throttle to warm the car up. Again horrible advice. Honda recommends 1 minute to warm the engine before driving. I wait 5.

-Engine wear is caused on cold starts. WRONG again.

-Running a higher ratio of water in the coolant? That would mean it would take 8x longer to warm up, because water doesnt mix as well with the coolant, and the water portion will freeze. I filled my reserve tank with water and a little coolant, and the water part is still frozen.

-How is the device supposed to heat the coolant up when the water pump isnt running to circulate?

</TD></TR></TABLE>

no offense man but you're a little off too. as a matter of fact running just a few rpms extra is better for the car. it allows oil to heat up faster and yet still at a constant rate, much more so than if you were driving around, which allows the oil to spread through and coat the engine much faster, especially in cold conditions slightly decreasing wear and tear on the engine from warm-up. also, about the water thing, what you said makes sense, but that's off too. increasing the water will actually allow the car to warm faster as water heats faster than coolant. it only takes a few moments for the water to heat up, keep in mind this guy is funning his engine for 30 minutes, not 1. so a few minutes of heating the water will come in to play allowing it to begin circulating easier and quicker. also, a big thing, engine wear is absolutely caused on cold starts, the parts of your engine are still brittle, especially in 20 - 25 degree weather. You are 100% correct about the t-stat though.

B serious

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by amej8 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">This may sound stupid, but I'll be honest and admit I really don't know much at all about how a car works.

So I notice when it's cold, and I start my car, it takes FOREVER to warm up. At least a half hour for the needle to even start moving and the RPM's to drop around below 1000. But my buddy (he has a 99 civic ex coupe just like mine, but with ~106k miles and not 188k), when he starts his car, his needle starts moving within 5 minutes and his car warms up easy.

Does this have anything to do with the thermostat or anything else? If so, would changing the thermostat help the car warm up easier and/or faster? It's been getting close to 0 degrees here (even during the day) and my car just takes ages to warm up and I don't really like driving it when it's ice cold and doesn't warm up at least a little bit.</TD></TR></TABLE>

A thermostat swap couldn't hurt. at most, you're out of $15 or something. Buy OEM parts.

amej8

Yeah t-stat ran me $25 inc. tax. Not bad.

Turned on my car this morning from leaving it off the whole night. It was about 28 degrees when I turned it on. Waited 2 minutes, then drove. 4 minutes later, it was fully warmed up . Didn't overheat or anything. I'm really glad I got this "problem" fixed.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by randerson0248 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Cool engine runs richer. Warm engine runs leaner. Controlled by ECU.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Ah that makes sense. Thanks .