elohel

So I've basically had enough with my civic. I got a lemon-ish one, because the tranny seems to have so many problems. They aren't the same problems, unfortunately, so lemon-laws don't apply. That, and the dealer seems to find nothing wrong with this.

Anyways, I own an LX sedan, which was bought for my wife. She insisted she had to have the sedan/automatic for drive easibility. I tried convincing her into buying a lexus (I'm just fond of those for some reason), but she seemed pretty set on the civic. So civic it was.

5 months later.. she has commandeered my manual v6 accord, and I'm left with the civic. So deciding enough was enough, I told her I was going to trade it in for an 07 (or maybe 06 since they still have plenty on the lot) civic SI. She agreed, so down to the dealer this afternoon I went.

While my car was being inspected for a price eval., me and the dealer I've now boughten 3 cars from was showing me around at the SI's. The evaluator (no idea what his job title is) comes out and says I have a substantial scratches under the hood and that will take a large toll on the price. Perplexed by this.. I ask to see, thinking maybe I had ground off all the paint under the bumper due to steep drive-ways that I had bottomed out on a few times. What do I see? That black strip that runs underneath the bumper is just scuffed up, and not a scratch on the bumper itself.

The evaluator goes on to tell me that it's still damage, and that I would get $12,200 for the car. That, however, is unacceptable to me, because I know the dealer will turn around with a price of $17,000+ for the car. Keep in mind.. had car for 5 months, 4700 miles, and the car has been maintained immaculately (in my opinion). And on top of all that, I paid $18,100 for the car new. I'm not losing $6000 on it, when it's still more or less new.

So I tell them I will just sell the car myself, and buy the SI without a trade-in, since I have the LX paid off anyways. They have 5 SI's on the lot, 2 06 coupes, 1 07 coupe, 1 07 sedan, and one used 06 coupe. First I look at the new ones, they all look nice with 20-30 miles on it. Keep in mind, this particular dealer doesn't list prices on their cars, you have to ask. I was assuming at the time, around $21,000 for a new SI. Then I go look at the used SI..

2006 Hab. Red SI, perfect condition, 28k miles (how in the hell...). I take it for a spin and it still feels solid and everything feels right. Everything checks out fine. I ask the price... $22,100. How can that be?! I'm losing $5,900 on my car with less than 1/5th the miles on it.. and this car has somehow risen in value from what I've seen others buy it for. I asked him if it was possibly the price of the new ones, but he was certain it was that one. Seeing the look of disbeleif on my face, he added in they were "willing to negotiate." I told him that I hoped he was willing to negotiate 3k off the price, whereas he responded "Well, since these new honda's sell so well, we don't negotiate on the price. BUT we can throw in Fogs for free.

I politely told the guy I would look elsewhere, and when I commented on how overpriced the car was, he told me it would sell quickly reguardless. Funny, the new SI's on the lot ahve been there for months

So there's my story, and here's my question.. What dealers around the MN area have people had a good experience with? Considering I bought an 05 EX accord, 00 EX Oddyssey, 06 civc LX, and had my nephew buy an 00 SI from him.. I would of thought I would be better taken care of. So, any comments? Did I over-react to that price? Tell me if I'm wrong in thinking I was getting taken for a ride at this dealer (Tom Kadlec Honda, btw)

Thanks

RICO_

My god. What an arrogant son of a ...... I hope he goes through the same thing you're going through so that he can see how it feels. He's a blatant liar. lol. They sell so well and yet have been there for months?

06 Si with 28k miles for $22k. That's a RIP. That's basically still selling it for full price WITH the mark up on a USED CAR. That dealership is wack. You did the right thing by shopping elsewhere. Wish i could give you some pointers as to good dealerships but i'm not from around that area. Sorry.

But it just sounds like you went to the wrong place with a bozo salesman
I'm sure you can get more for your trade and find a better deal on an Si somewhere else. Good luck man. Hope it works out.

Rahxephon

so you there are no other dealers beside this one??...have you consider going out of MN? maybe it worth the drive. I've drove two hours for my Si..cuz the dealer near us is to much of a Hasshole..

Beefkake

I agree with rico_ $22k is waaaay too much for a used si with damn near 30k miles on it. I checked KBB.com and with that many miles they say the starting negotiating price should be around $18,875.

kamikaze84

Whats the name of the dealership, so nobody will go there?

accordselux

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by kamikaze84 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Whats the name of the dealership, so nobody will go there?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I like Hopkins Honda, they've always treated me well there and I'll buy my Civic there because I feel they have treated me so well in the past.

However, Buerkle Honda has given me nothing but headaches. I'd stay away from them.

elohel

Thanks for the replies guys. The name of the dealer is Tom Kadlec Honda.

I truly thought he would work on getting me a good price, since I've spent almost 80k on cars in the past 7 years from him. It's a shame, really.

Yeah, I would be willing to drive out a bit. I too thought the negotiations would being around 19k, how wrong was I?... The dealer has been calling me repeatedly today, telling me about new SI's coming in and whatnot.

accordselux

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by elohel &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thanks for the replies guys. The name of the dealer is Tom Kadlec Honda.

I truly thought he would work on getting me a good price, since I've spent almost 80k on cars in the past 7 years from him. It's a shame, really.

Yeah, I would be willing to drive out a bit. I too thought the negotiations would being around 19k, how wrong was I?... The dealer has been calling me repeatedly today, telling me about new SI's coming in and whatnot.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I would give Hopkins Honda a call (might not be worth the few hours driving, but a call might give you a good idea what they'd offer).

One thing to think about though is that some dealerships count on repeat customers. They believe that repeat customers have been lulled into trusting them and may take advantage of it. I'd think it would be the other way around, rewarding long time buyers, but it's a sick world sometimes, you might get the 'valued customer' markup

Anyways good luck with the sale and purchase, and hi to a fellow Minnesotan. I'm a recent transplant from MI, here for college.

elohel

Thanks.. It is a sick world sometimes. You would think all the commission he has recieved from me would entitle me to some kind loyalty deal.

For college, U of M? That's where I'm headed to this spring.

06 Habanero-NaVi

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by elohel &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thanks.. It is a sick world sometimes. You would think all the commission he has recieved from me would entitle me to some kind loyalty deal.

For college, U of M? That's where I'm headed to this spring.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Okay, you have one problem living in that area..you live in 4wd GM country..so the Honda's in that area do not hold their value as well as they do down here in Florida..at my Honda dealership, you'd probably get around 13-13,500 for ur vehicle...you also gotta think too...if you can finaggle your way to around invoice on a LX model you're around 16 -16,500 buying it new...so take in the fact that you did take a hit driving it off the lot..regardless of the mileage..that's probably about right for that area...I think you you should be happy with around 13k..not to side with the dealer or anything..As far as the new vehicle goes..just give them til the end of the month..all u gotta do is hold off like 15 days...then they'll take pretty much what ever deal you take to them..they're just trying to hold firm on you...i'd offer 13k for your car..and get them down to around 20,500 on the used SI, or you could probably beat them up more on the new one's..since they have 5 of them..believe me..they'll get rid of them..offer them 500 over invoice on a new one..they'll take it...You also have to take in the fact that the used one that you are looking at is probably a certified vehicle, which does add quite a bit of value to the vehicle..you get a 7 yr 100k Powertraint warranty that you in essence don't really have to pay for...I'll let you in on a little dealer insight..that warranty costs the dealership around 500 bucks..and they have to do a comprehensive 150 point inspection on the vehicle too..so they have probably spent some money on that vehicle to get it prepped.. believe it or not...the technicians and the service writers are not a Used Car Managers best friend..they try to make money off of the Used Car Dept..so they probably raped him on a 30k service (hence the 28k on the vehicle) and whatever else they needed to do..so take that into consideration when you make an offer...all those things they really do have to do before they sell the vehicle...

I hope you get what you want..good luck, and have fun with your FG if you get it!!! Happy Buying sir..

accordselux

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 06 Habanero-NaVi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Okay, you have one problem living in that area..you live in 4wd GM country..so the Honda's in that area do not hold their value as well as they do down here in Florida..a</TD></TR></TABLE>

I doubt it. I lived in MI and coming back from MN there are MANY more american cars (and trucks) in MI than in MN. MN seems to be a lot more progressive than MI in everything...society, health, vehicles. I think I see more compacts and Priuses than I do trucks.

Oh and for college i'm going to Macalester in St. Paul. Been here 3 years now, planning on staying after I graduate. Not only is MI full of domestics, it's also full of people who got laid off from said companies

elohel

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 06 Habanero-NaVi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Okay, you have one problem living in that area..you live in 4wd GM country..so the Honda's in that area do not hold their value as well as they do down here in Florida..at my Honda dealership, you'd probably get around 13-13,500 for ur vehicle...you also gotta think too...if you can finaggle your way to around invoice on a LX model you're around 16 -16,500 buying it new...so take in the fact that you did take a hit driving it off the lot..regardless of the mileage..that's probably about right for that area...I think you you should be happy with around 13k..not to side with the dealer or anything..As far as the new vehicle goes..just give them til the end of the month..all u gotta do is hold off like 15 days...then they'll take pretty much what ever deal you take to them..they're just trying to hold firm on you...i'd offer 13k for your car..and get them down to around 20,500 on the used SI, or you could probably beat them up more on the new one's..since they have 5 of them..believe me..they'll get rid of them..offer them 500 over invoice on a new one..they'll take it...You also have to take in the fact that the used one that you are looking at is probably a certified vehicle, which does add quite a bit of value to the vehicle..you get a 7 yr 100k Powertraint warranty that you in essence don't really have to pay for...I'll let you in on a little dealer insight..that warranty costs the dealership around 500 bucks..and they have to do a comprehensive 150 point inspection on the vehicle too..so they have probably spent some money on that vehicle to get it prepped.. believe it or not...the technicians and the service writers are not a Used Car Managers best friend..they try to make money off of the Used Car Dept..so they probably raped him on a 30k service (hence the 28k on the vehicle) and whatever else they needed to do..so take that into consideration when you make an offer...all those things they really do have to do before they sell the vehicle...

I hope you get what you want..good luck, and have fun with your FG if you get it!!! Happy Buying sir..</TD></TR></TABLE>

See, I disagree here. 13k isn't an acceptable trade-in value when this same lot sells them for $18,100 new. The price on a honda doesn't depreciate that quickly. I know it loses value when it's taken off the lot.. but the fact that their 28k SI (KBB value of 18,900) is going for over 22,000, I should be getting like.. 19k for my car (kidding )

But honestly.. 15k for my car sounds a lot more reasonable. A 3,100 loss on a car driven for 5 months in great condition sounds about right to me. But 6k? Naw.

As for the SI, I'm just gonna print off the KBB website listing of their SI and see what they h ave to say. I'm not going to spend 3k more than the KBB reccomends Maybe they will come around.

06 Habanero-NaVi

[QUOTE=accordselux]I doubt it. I lived in MI and coming back from MN there are MANY more american cars (and trucks) in MI than in MN. MN seems to be a lot more progressive than MI in everything...society, health, vehicles. I think I see more compacts and Priuses than I do trucks.

My used Car Manager was a manager at a Honda Dealership in MN, he's from there..and no one ever wanted Honda's in that area...he told me all the money was in Subaru, and 4WD trucks in that area..so just going off of what he said..but he could be wrong...I dunno..just trying to justify the lowballing I guess..

06 Habanero-NaVi

I think right now you're having a problem of paying too much for your car to begin with..seriously..go to Edmunds.com and look up invoice on a 07 LX civic..it's like 16,300...Honda's hold their value really well...but not THAT good..you didn't only lose 1,300 dollars for having your vehicle for 6 months...regardless of the miles..you lost 2k the minute you started busting bugs..13k is the number on ur car...hate to be the one to break it to u..maybe 13,500 if you get really really really lucky...but you'd have to drive to Florida and buy it from me

2007 Honda Civic
LX 4dr Sedan (1.8L 4cyl 5A)
TMV®
What Others
Are Paying
MSRP Invoice
National Base Price
A note about advertising fees $17,760 $16,261 $17,635
Regional Adjustment
for Zip Code Change - - $0
Optional Equipment N/A N/A N/A
No optional equipment selected
Color Adjustment - - $0
Atomic Blue Metallic
Destination Charge $595 $595 $595
Total with Options $18,355 $16,856 $18,230

16,261 is invoice...then u have to subtract the 2k..for the lot leaving..and then you have ur typical loss of time..so...13,500 if you're lucky sir..

06 Habanero-NaVi

As for the SI, I'm just gonna print off the KBB website listing of their SI and see what they h ave to say. I'm not going to spend 3k more than the KBB reccomends Maybe they will come around.[/QUOTE]

I'm totally with you on the used one..but just take into consideration about what I said about the certification...I'd say 20 - 20,500 is the number..

And also think about how touchy that you are about ur Civic..and think about the person that traded in the SI..regardless about their miles..they know it's a hot item..and sometimes dealer's really do have to step up to make deals with people..and give them OVER trade in value...they're not out to rip off everyone...contrary to everyone else who's never been in the car business thinks..

06 Habanero-NaVi

One last thing, and I'll stop..the numbers I showed u are on a 07..they were cheaper in 06..not by a lot..but some...

accordselux

Yea I don't doubt it in more of the boonies, where i'd rather have 4wd and some towing capacity for my ice fishing shack or boat, but in the twin cities it's definitely 2-3x more Hondas then I see in MI. As a matter of fact I was shopping around between MI and MN for Honda prices and the selection was vastly different; MN had many more available at a lower cost. Don't get me started on Scions either. There were like none of those in the Detroit area when I looked

RICO_

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by elohel &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thanks for the replies guys. The name of the dealer is Tom Kadlec Honda.

I truly thought he would work on getting me a good price, since I've spent almost 80k on cars in the past 7 years from him. It's a shame, really.

Yeah, I would be willing to drive out a bit. I too thought the negotiations would being around 19k, how wrong was I?... The dealer has been calling me repeatedly today, telling me about new SI's coming in and whatnot.</TD></TR></TABLE>

You said the car was paid off right?? Did you tell the salesman that? Because if you did it probably made him more inclined to rape you on the trade. Alot of dealers do that when the car is either paid off or close to being paid off.