rodav8

I'll try and keep this short but I've done a lot and still having issues. Here's the trouble I'm having with my son's 2004 Civic Ex 4 door 1.7L with 184,000 miles. Initially it overheated...BAD...to the point of the timing belt cover that mounts to the head actually melted away. Here's a list of parts I've changed tryng to fix this issue:

1. Rebuilt cylinder head
2. New head gasket kit
3. New head bolts (Properly torqued)
4. New water pump
5. New Timing belt
6. New timing belt tensioner
7. New radiator
8. New thermostat (x2)
9. New fan thermo switch
10. Swapped fan relay
11. New Radiator caps (x3, one of them was Honda OEM)

I've also flushed the cooling system, tested for combustion gases (None), compression is good, cylinder leak-down tested good, and the radiator held 15 psi for over an hour. I added several specialty tools to my toolbox because of this car . I bought a cylinder leak-down tester, radiator pressure tester, combustion/block tester and a special funnel for adding coolant.
One thing I did notice while bleeding the radiator is air bubbles kept coming which didn't make sense since I had checked for combustion gases and the fluid NEVER changed color. It stayed blue. Plus the leak-down test was good too. With the cap on the radiator and the engine running the upper and lower radiator hoses build up A LOT of pressure and are hard enough that they feel like a solid piece of rubber when you squeeze them. The cap will release some of the pressure but it still holds most of the pressure until the next day.
I'm sure I'm forgetting something because this has been an ongoing issue for almost a year. Sometimes it'll drive for about an hour with no problems then others I can't even make it a block until it overheats. I'm not a rookie working on cars, but this has me stumped. Just when I think I have it figured out, this car screws me!! Any input ANYONE has, I'd really appreciate it. Thanks in advance!!

NDNV

You've certainly put a lot of work into this issue. Hope you get it resolved soon.

Ideas: still could be a head gasket leak - did the head need to be planed after the severe overheat situation?, old coolant hoses replaced - could old lining inside old hoses cause restriction?, are you losing coolant?, parked or moving same overheat situation? - thinking water pump or fans here, plugged radiator - I know it's new though...

AccordEX1991

Cracked head.

Juan Carlos 123

Hi, roda: Did you solve your hard hose problem?

I have the exact same issue now.

rodav8

Juan Carlos, I finally gave up and took it to a shop. Of course they did all the same tests/checks I did. They had the car over 2 months but I don't think they worked on it more than a day before they called me and told me it needed a new engine They couldn't tell me exactly what was wrong either, But assured me it was something internal in the engine. I asked the guy 3 times what the "internal issue" was and he didn't have an answer. $1650.00 plus fluids and belts was the quote!! Well, since I was at a loss and I didn't want to mess with it anymore I had them go ahead and do the work. The final bill...$1889.00!!! I would love to publish the name of the garage because they REALLY F@CKED me!!! I will say the garage is located in Dillsburg, PA. They dropped the engine or something heavy on the hood latch area because the black plastic grill cover was cracked, the hood latch was damaged and it looks like they repaired it with channellock pliers, all the new bumper clips I put prior to taking it there were damaged, I was told they had to replace the hood latch cable because it broke "The first time we tried to open the hood" and they had the ***** to charged me for it!!!! OK...I feel better now that I got that off my chest. So far I haven't had any issues with the overheating and the excessive pressure. But as far as giving a definite answer to exactly what caused my problem, sorry, I cant provide that information. Only the ASE certified mechanic at that lovely garage can tell us and I don't think he's going to.

Juan Carlos 123

Hi, Roda. Sorry to hear you were probably screwed. Seems very convenient for the shop to tell you they couldn't find the cause and stick you with the new engine bill. I did the same work you did on my engine, except my problem started with a bubbling overflow bottle (engine actually did not overheat, gauge only came up to 3/4). So I did the head job and engine will overheat even in idle.
Gauge will come up to 3/4, shut engine and overflow bottle will bubble up like crazy. I also bought the air bleeding funnel thinking I was not bleeding all air for lack of a bleeding valve. Tried bleeding 4 times and same results. after a couple of weeks, finally figured out. Air was trapped in head. I placed the funnel, filled with coolant to top. Had an assistant with a gallon ready to pour more as needed, took out the Engine Coolant Sensor out and let coolant pour out. Coolant should have pour out immediately as I removed the sensor, but it took a little while, and the sensor was completely dry on the inside, so was the head!!. I let a lot of coolant go out as the assistant poured the full gallon on the funnel. Reinstalled, started engine with rad cap off, idle for 20 minutes, rev to 2000 a few times in between, no air bubbles, placed rad cap on, road tested, problem solved.
I posted to the internet too and people will tell me "cracked head" "bad gasket" "head needs planning" "poor job, redo" "swap engine" even when I told I used a rebuilt head and did all the test you did and HG was ruled out. I bet I will have been stuck with a new engine if I had gone to a shop too.

rodav8

Juan, I wish I would've thought of pulling the temp sensor out!!! Makes sense, since its the highest point on the engine and the funnel would be higher and when you removed the sensor the fluid would have an easy place to escape. Freaking brilliant!!! I might have missed out on all this drama and wouldn't have spent all that money. Seems like I'm going to have to try doing that now. The engine they put in is now over heating!!!!! Two days after we got it back the CEL came on. I had 7 codes!!!! The major ones were P2646, P0300, P0301, P0302. My scanner gives suggestions on what usually fixed certain issues. For the P2646, it suggested checking and/or replacing the VTEC solenoid. Since I knew that there was a screen on the VTEC solenoid I figured it was clogged causing the engine to go into limp mode when it reached 3000 RPM. I was just about to tear into it and went over the other easier options the scanner suggested. One of them was to check the engine oil level. Guess what I found...NO OIL IN THE CRANKCASE!!!!! How in the hell can someone put in a new engine and not have the common sense to change the oil or at least make sure the engine HAS oil?!?!?!?! Like I said before, this garage isn't the best. SO after I filled the oil to the proper level and cleared the codes I haven't had a problem with that issue. But now it's overheating and the heat isn't working. I haven't looked into it yet but I'm hoping its just a thermostat or something easy. I called the garage that did the engine swap and they want me to bring it in and they MIGHT get to it next week!! I'm really getting frustrated!! I'm not sure if I want to take it back to them or just fix it myself. I'm sure they are going to try and charge me for something. It might be cheaper for me to do it myself.

OH, I forgot to mention that the hood latch cable they supposedly changed just broke on the inside of the vehicle. The plastic part you pull on to release the hood came off in my sons hand when he tried to open the hood!! That's another $20+ to fix if I let them do it..

Juan Carlos 123

Hi, Roda: That really sucks! spending all that money and you are back to square one. Seems likely that if you have no heat, you do have air in your cooling system. I suggest you make sure the thermostat has an air bleeding hole in it. I would not be surprised if the shop used a very cheap tst without one. Definitely try to bleed system by removing the temp sensor.
think the bleeding funnel is not foolproof, since an air pocket can be simply compressed if it has nowhere to go.
I did not find my solution the easy way. I went nuts just like you, trying to figure out what was wrong. I even changed the waterpump again, for a different brand.
I just hope no major damage has come upon your new engine by running it low on oil.
Good luck finding the cause, again!

rodav8

My son drove it yesterday and didn't have a problem. No overheating and the heat worked. I just now came in from messing with it. I did remove the temp sensor and, like you said, no coolant came out. I put the funnel on and added about 16 oz of coolant went in the radiator and it started coming out the temp sensor hole. I added more coolant to the funnel and held my finger over the hole so it wouldn't gush out then lifted my finger slightly to let a little out. While I was doing that I squeezed the upper and lower hoses to try and force any remaining air out and all that came out was coolant. I'm thinking it did have air in it and that's what caused the overheating and no heat. Hopefully its fixed now!!! Thanks again for the removing the temp sensor trick!!!

JuNiOr Ts

I have my fair share of overheated engines 4-5 times, 3 times resulted in a blown HG. 1 time faulty radiator fan, 1 time worn piston ring burned all my oil
To let the engine overheat to the point of melted timing cover is extreme. A lots of parts could be damaged.
Check the Thermostat again (if overheated usually goes bad too, test it in a pot of boiling water on a stove-top is it opening when boiling)
Piston Rings melted > burning all your oil > over heats
Fan temp switch faulty (good = both fans turn on with temp gauge is at normal operating temp)
Fan Relays (tip: swap it with the other big relays in your fuse box like the headlight/condenser to test)
FAN both turn on? (my radiator fan motor was faulty, some time turn on which cause my car to overheat when idle at stop light and climbing steep hills.Pull over Pop hood a check right away when the temp gauge start to overheat and look at the fans are they spinning)
Warp head or block, did you get head resurfaced at a machine shop?
Good luck

Juan Carlos 123

That's great! All our troubles on account of lack of an air bleeding valve.
Please post back if you have an issue again. If not, please post back in a month or so, just to kill my curiosity.
Take care!!