accv6

My car suddenly would not start and I heard just a bare clicking noise when I turned the ignition. So I took it into to my repair shop and they said the starter needed to be replaced. The cost for the starter on the itemized receipt before tax is $312 and is described as "reman starter w/sol". This is a lot more than I expected. Did I get ripped off?

BTW I asked for the old starter but they said they gave it to the place they bought the starter from as "core".

MSchu

yeah... it seems you might have. A new OEM starter motor is about 260-280'ish...

accv6

Thanks. Can you recommend any actions I can take to see if they will reduce the bill? I paid already but it seems quite unfair. Do repair shops normally tack on a profit margin on parts? Even so 35%+ seems ridiculous.

BLKFLSH

Here's a link. The differences between list (dealership), and online prices are almost $100.
New and remanufactured.
http://www.bkhondaparts.com/billkay/...itch=&hidIrno=

Targa250R

You already agreed to the price of the repair and they completed it based on your authorization. If you authorize a repair while fully knowing the price beforehand, you're obligated to pay the bill. It never hurts to ask them for some help, but don't go in expecting them to comply.

Suck it up and take this as a learning experience. Try a different repair facility next time and do your research. Many repair shops that are unfamiliar with imports will just go with a Honda-boxed part just to avoid potential problems. A specialist shop with more experience will deal with a parts distributor that procures aftermarket equivalent replacement parts from Honda's OE manufacturer (in the case of starter motors, this is usually Denso or Mitsuba). A self-branded part from the same manufacturer is almost always cheaper than the Honda-branded part, and in most cases is equivalent in quality.

Yes, it is normal and expected for a repair shop to make a profit on parts. You can't begrudge a business for wanting to profit from a job - otherwise, they wouldn't be in business. You can't make a living from giving away gifts unless you're Santa Claus. Now, excessive profit is another thing, but who is to decide what "excessive" is? 35% markup is certainly not unreasonable and is actually on the low side of average. How do you know what they paid for the starter though? Most likely they paid wholesale price rather than retail list, so their profit margin is higher than you think.

Also, remanufactured parts always carry a core charge. You can't keep the old part unless you want to pay the core charge on top of the cost of the reman part.

accv6

Thanks for all the replies.

True, but I assumed almost all of their profit comes from labor rather than part markups. But I guess that's not the case. I have a few follow-up questions if y'all have the time:

- is it very unusual for a starter to go after 65K miles? I bought the car used and it's been running flawlessly for 6 months, so of course I'm hoping this was just a fluke.
- did I have the option of buying my own starter and have them install it?
- would they quote me a lower price if I asked them for a quote over the phone rather than after they have my car disabled on their property?

ilikehonda

O'reilly auto parts has them for 119.99 for an auto and 170 for the 6 speed

2ed6sbandzc

you got ripped dude

KWayRacing

So the total bill was 300. So they bought a NAPA, oreilly, auto zone starter for 125, marked it up to 169, 1.5 hours labor at 65 per hour plus tax and shop fees. Sounds fair to me. If they sold you a OEM reman and installed it the bill would have been well over 400.

accv6

chemik

u got ripped dude. you live you learn. now start doing your own work :p

accv6

Unfortunately I'm completely clueless when it comes to cars and most mechanical stuff and I expect that will never change. I expect to pay a price for that when my car is broke I just don't want to get ripped off.

Based on everyone's comments it seems that if they bought the starter from NAPA I got ripped off, but if it is an OEM remanufactured starter then it's not so bad. I am thinking of talking with the repair shop to see if they can tell me which it is. Good idea?

I don't expect to get any money back I just want to know if I need to find a new repair shop.

On a separate note the starter apparently died the first time I tried to start the car after "accidentally" having my foot on the brake when I turned the ignition. For about 6 months since I bought the car I started it with my foot on the gas pedal. I guess I did this out of habit, but I now realize since it is fuel-injected it is unnecessary. Is it possible starting the car with my foot on the gas pedal for so long could have killed the starter? Like I said above I am clueless with the mechanics of cars

ilikehonda

no starting the car with you foot on the gas pedal did not kill the starter.

B18C5-EH2

Well I just checked the OEM starter and a Bosch (crap) and here's what I came up with via World Pac, a good parts supplier for my shop:

OEM Honda part number: 31200-RKB-004RM - the "RM" means reman

List price: $346.78
My cost: $208.07
Price I charge my customer, including tax (part only): $284.00 (30% mark up over cost + 7% sales tax)

Funny thing is that unlike buying from an actual dealership I can get this starter BRAND NEW from World Pac from the exact same manufacturer for Honda themselves. You cannot even get a brand new one from Honda at all!!!

Bosch reman part number: SR1329X

No list price shown
My cost: $157.75
Price I'd charge my customer for part if I ever even installed one of these pieces of garbage: $215.00

My shop would charge 1.5 hours of labor at $78.00/hour for a total of $117.00 in labor.

So in total if we did the job with the brand new Genuine Honda starter (probably Mitsuba) the price would be $401.00 out the door. I might catch crap for posting this, but I'm just trying to show you how an independent shop such as myself could price the job.

0Steve@Spreen

No you were not ripped off, providing the installer used original Honda parts. The Honda list for the reman is $303.45 w/exchange. Depends on the shop, but our discounts range from 20% off list to 10% off, depending on the volume of the shop. A shop cannot surviving making profit on labor only these days. Aftermarket starters, sorry to say, are usually crap (I spent nearly 30 years in the a/m business), and you'd be better off buying factory. HTH

Evs-One

I'm in the exact same boat as Tom. Independent shop that uses WorldPac and OE Honda suppliers for parts.

I always list the brand of OE supplier on my cust receipts, unless it was OEM Honda...ie, Mitsuba or Denso starter.

I'd at least ask what brand starter it was. Charging that much for a crappy reman starter(probably just needed 3 bucks in contacts) is a rip off, UNLESS they are giving you a lifetime warranty.

0Steve@Spreen

Except that the lifetime warranty usually will not cover the labor cost involved.

vivid 02

Sounds like your battery was just dead and not a starter issue.

Did someone try to give you jump before having the car towed to the repair shop?

0Steve@Spreen

A battery will usually make a multiple clicking noise, much like your car farting , a single 'click' is usually jus the solenoid kicking the gear into the flywheel/flexplate and not allowing the engine to turn over.

bobinator5000

This site has the lowest OEM part cost around and is ****ING SWEET for finding impossible-to-get-shazbot.

http://www.hondapartsnow.com/online/...%29%20%28V6%29

Cost: $299.50 +Tax, +Shipping.

The shop tacks on a margin as a finders fee; if a mechanic had to call multiple auto parts stores, then drive all the way to the store, order and/or or pick up a starter, drive back then install it, the 10-20% markup pays for their time.

Most mechanics basically do only OEM parts replacements if they are any good; they don't want to waste your money on stuff they know is junk and they want repeat business.

I've seen some dealerships (Honda of Aurora, Illinois) that charge 50% markup on everything then dick with you over labor costs.

accv6

Thanks for the info. Your total bill is not too far from what I paid (they also charged me $40 for the initial diagnostics and $24 for supplies). I still need to check with them to see if it is an OEM starter, otherwise I definitely got ripped off.

accv6

After reading some posts on this forum about the solenoid contacts I suggested that to the repair shop but they said they don't do that kind of stuff and they said "trust me your starter is shot." All I could do is take his word that replacing the solenoid contacts was not an option.

There is no brand listed on the invoice, just some part number that didn't return anything useful in google.

accv6

Yeah we tried that. I also took the battery to NAPA and it tested fine.

B18C5-EH2

I find it odd that the diagnostic fee wasn't waived when you approved the repair work. We charge a $58.00 check out fee and waive that if you approve the repairs.

The only time this is not the case is if the check out is electrical diagnostics time ($78.00/hour) or if the check out is an a/c service which costs $135.00 just to find out what else is wrong in many cases.

If their bill looked close to my quote, but they used a parts store starter than I'd be a little pissed. I have seen too many Bosch and World reman starters either not work right out of the box, or crap out within a year to ever trust them again.

ch0baca

just got my starter replaced 2 weeks ago, took about 15 mins to finish the job, but took about two hours waiting for the part, but the total cost was $220

it was Honda OEM for 6MT, that's why the part took so long, they had to first "find" it since it's different than automatics