Sirgalt

Hello all,

I'm new here and hoping for some insight. I'm big on DIY and saving dough, so I'm trying to do as many repairs myself before I take my car to a shop.

I have a problem with my automatic Accord randomly dying. It happens stopped or at 75 mph. I don't lose any power, steering, or brakes. The engine just shuts off.

I replaced the ignition switch, even though it was recalled and fixed years ago. This seemed to be the biggest reason this problem occurs.

That didn't work. It died on me again today. In order to get it started again, I have to pump the brake over and over, sometimes for several minutes, until I hear the click come from the shifter. Once it clicks, the green light key on the dashboard will come on and it will turn over. Until I can get it to click, it will crank and crank, but the green light key won't come on, and it won't turn over.

It does have an EGR problem based on the codes. But since the green light key seems to be tied to this problem, I'm wondering if I'm looking at something electrical and should replace the main relay first. Or could it be the transponder that recognizes the key, and if so, how does one solve that?

FYI - when I can finally get it to start, it idles roughly and acts like it wants to die again. I have to rev it to get it to smooth out and stay on.

Additional info: it's not really that hot here right now, and I've read about main relays having issues when it's warm. It was only 70 yesterday. When it happened this morning, it was 55 and the car hadn't been running more than 15 minutes. Yesterday, I drove in 70 degree weather for 40 miles with no problem after replacing the ignition switch. Could this be fuel pump related?

Thanks in advance for any thoughts and advice.

Lost Again

Yes, could be the main relay, you can test this, of course it has to be acting up at the time. Get into a habit of looking at the CEL, when it dies, you turn the key to "on", does the cel come on for a few seconds and go off?

It could be a number of other things. What you really need to figure out is this not running because of fuel or spark.

Do you have a volt meter and timing light?

Sirgalt

Actually, the cel is always on, which apparently has to do with the EGR code, according to Midas. It's been on for awhile.

I don't have a voltmeter and timing light. I thought about it being a spark/fuel issue, but the thing that initially makes me think it's not that is the fact that I have to pump the brake repeatedly until I hear the "click" come from the shifter. As soon as I hear that click, I know it will start.

Of course, a problem starting it could or could not be related to why it randomly dies, I suppose.

Thoughts?

Lost Again

Again, turn the key to "on"/pos II, cel will come on (srs, abs will do the same) - this is a "bulb" check and go off - even if there are codes, codes won't "set" until the car has been started.....I bet what you find is at the same time you get the "click" from the interlock, the cel is going off.....

Sirgalt

OK gotcha. I turned to pos II, I heard the hum for the fuel pump, the interlock click, and then the CEL went off for a split second and came back on after another, fainter click from somewhere else.

Thoughts on that? I've found more information that says this could also be the ICM causing the engine to shut down. It's just so weird that I keep full power and systems but the engine just stops.

Sirgalt

Any other thoughts or help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!

Sirgalt

Hey all. Sorry to be one of those people who constantly bumps their posts, but I could really use more thoughts on this, if you have any. Thanks much!

Lost Again

Well, is it still dying on you? I was suggesting to do this when the car acts up.

These have a few common items that can cause the issue you are describing.

1) Electrical part of the key switch. These get worn and will loose contact.....meaning no power to the ign system......when the car dies, do you have 12v to the blk/yel wire at the dist?
2) Main relay gets hot or has weak contacts. When the car dies, turn the key to on - listen for the fuel pump to prime - watch the CEL to see if it cycles
3) ICM goes bad, usually when hot and stops the "spark". When the car dies, hook a timing light to one of the plug wires, turn the car over, does the timing light flash?

Hard to say what is wrong when the car is working?

Sirgalt

Thanks for the reply. Those items are a bit out of my hands right now because I don't have the necessary equipment. I did rent a code reader and do have the P0401 insufficient flow in the EGR valve. This wouldn't cause it to die, would it?

I thought main relay, since it seems common, but it's only been in the 60s here, so I don't think that's hot enough.

Hard part is, I have to duplicate the problem to fix the problem. I'm still thinking that the ICM is the most logical item, considering how badly it sputters when I get it to start again.

I do hear the fuel pump prime every time I'm starting it after it sitting. And the CEL is always on due to the P0401 code, but it does flash off quickly while the pump is cycling.

Does any of this help?

Lost Again

The 0401 would not cause the car to just die as you drive....so no but it is something you should have looked at....most common is the "port" in the intake gets clogged.

Some places (autozone, ect) claim to be able to test the icm's?

When it dies, what lights on the dash are on? When it does this and the "shift lock" is not clicking....is the clock coming on....pos I in this test not II of the key switch.

Sirgalt

If I remember correctly, I get the CEL, the ABS, and the green flashing key. The clock is also on.

I decided to go ahead and buy the ICM, main relay, and EGR. It won't hurt to replace those anyway. I still have a gut feeling that, because I can't get the interlock to click until after I've pumped the brake dozens of times, it's not one of those things, but who knows...

FurryBalls

Dude, for the EGR you don't need to replay anything. You just need to pull the intake body off of the car and using some carb cleaner, spray out over the EGR passages. While there check the intake gasket and replace it off necessary.

Sirgalt

OK good to know. So the EGR code is just a result of the deposits in the passages and valve? Cleaning that should clear that code?

Well that will save me $75 at least.

I've also now been reading about a problem with the brake light indicator or something between the brake pedal and the shift interlock system possibly causing my stalling/ignition problem. Thoughts on that?

Thanks again to everyone for helping out with this.

hothotpete

Same thing is going on with my wife's 98 V6 Sedan. I'm replacing the distributor assembly, not just the cap and rotor, because it doesn't get spark. You can test this by pulling out a spark plug wire and grounding it to a valve cover bolt and crank the engine to see if you get spark. Hondas have a reputation for the ICM in the distributor going bad (this will be the fifth dizzy I've replaced in my past Hondas). Test to see if you get spark first. Good luck.

Sirgalt

Just thought I'd update everyone on where I'm at with this (for those having the same problem). I replaced the ignition switch, and it didn't help.

I then replaced the EFI main relay. I've been on three test drives so far, and no problems. It will be awhile before I trust it, but I've had it die close to home twice (once I was idling in an automatic car wash when it died). I just went through the car wash this morning, and no stall.

I'm hoping this was it. Since it's not losing any power, just shutting off, it seems to me like it's an issue of fuel being cut off due to the relay. On the old relay, I couldn't see if there were any micro-cracks in the solder joints, but the two big fuses (or whatever they were) were loose. The new relay is designed completely different.

I'll keep everyone posted. If it dies again on me, the next step is replacing the ICM.

Sirgalt

Another update. 2000 miles later, the random dying hasn't returned. Looks like at least in my case, the main relay was the issue.

Sean Whittier

Hey guys i have a very similar issue with my 98 accord as well. I was wondering if you had to jump the car to get it started again everytime this occurred or did yours just start right back up?