Slow&Steady

A small shop and the dealership shop have told me my car's brake line is pretty corroded. How difficult is a DIY replacement? I can jack it up and block it up as high as a hydraulic shop jack can get it and I have access to a home garage do it it out of the weather.

Is this best done by a shop?

sikpupy

Which line is it? Got a pick of it?

Slow&Steady

There is more than one line? (Not feeling too smart all of a sudden). Best I can recall it's the one that runs front-to-back above that plastic "track" on the underside of the body.

Car is at the body shop now getting some rust cut out and fixed. I can try to get you guys a pic next week.

sikpupy

I dont think I will be under mine any time soon to take a look, but, if it is metal, and in an open area, you can splice into it one of two ways. you can cut the rusted part out, get another straight line, bend to the same angles and connect them with compression fittings, or, flare the cut ends AFTER you put on a male flare nut, cut line per the first example, flare the ends on that with male flare nuts and then connect with a female/female flare fitting. I like to carefully add some red locktight to the threads when tightening down. You might not be able to do it if you keep the master cylinder full while you do this as you will be leaking fluid until all the fittings are tight. Then, you will have to bleed the brakes and hope the brake bleeding gods are on your side.

I had to do that in an emergency when I tugged on my Grand Cherokee lines checking things and it started leaking on me from just wiggling them. Guess I should have checked them a long time ago when I first got the truck, lol.

You have a pick and pull yard around? Maybe grab a donor?

Aradin

I would definitely NOT recommend the compression fittings in the above post. It's a band-aid fix and can lead to brake system failure. Do it the right way and either replace the entire line or cut out the rusted parts and properly patch it with flare fittings and new line.

OP it depends on what line(s) it may be. There are hard lines and rubber hoses that go to each brake caliper. Some are more difficult to repair than others.

Slow&Steady

I have a double flare kit and bench vise. I'll probably replace the entire line with new Honda OEM though.

I should get the car back by Monday and I'll get under her for a look. Youtube is down right now or I'd watch some vids. The biggest challenge I think will be my lack of a lift. I can jack the car up and block her but that still puts me on my back.

I assume I'd have to drain all the brake fluid, refill, and bleed.

Youtube back up!

Yikes! This is what I might have waiting on me....

Aradin

If you have the knowledge/skill time honestly you would be better off just buying a couple coils of 3/16ths brake line and running them yourself. The OEM Honda stuff is expensive.

I was on my way to get breakfast at 6am in the rain a few days ago and the right rear hard line in my daily blew out just above the rear subframe. The other three brakes locked up and I slid nearly sideways into an intersection doing about 30. Good times. Honda quoted me $165 for the whole line and that was just one. The car isn't worth all that so I'll probably just end up cutting it on either side subframe and running a new section.

Slow&Steady

Wow! That happened to you? Glad you are OK! I asked my dad his thoughts and his advice was "just wait till one line breaks and then fix it." After reading about your misadventure, I think I'll go on and fix it now.

I bent, cut, and bubble flared my own fuel line for my 1972 Chevy truck, but that was bubble flares. My flare kit will do double flares also and I still have a large amount of 3/16" "Poly Armor" tubing which is supposed to be good for brake lines too. Maybe I'll take your advice.

Aradin

Thanks. Yeah it's definitely not something to wait on if you know they need to be done. I got lucky and there was no traffic around me since it was early. There was nothing I could have done if there was a car in front of me, a pedestrian, anything. Thing is my lines actually looked like they were in great condition. Car is super clean underneath but there's a spot that runs above the rear subframe for the right rear caliper that can't easily be accessed or seen so it either rusted out up there or the clamp rubbed through the line. Moral of the story is; better safe than sorry when it comes to brakes.

hondamark35

I replaced the line in question on my sister's car a few years ago. it had rusted through and started leaking. I had access to a lift at the time so I used it. but I could imagine doing it without one. with the OE, pre-bent line I had to drop the rear sub-frame a few inches but the bolts are long enough that they didn't have to come out. may not be required if making your own line.

just give yourself plenty of time, make sure you have good quality line wrenches, and if you end up making the line rather than buying don't forget to put the fittings on before flaring...

one more thing, the fuel lines run along side the brake line and tend to be pretty rusty as well if the brake line is. It would save time/effort to do all at once.

sikpupy

Never recommended it, was just giving him his options. I dont know what skill set he has or money. "He" has to make that choice.

OP, if you have a double flare kit, absolutly this is the time to learn how to use it (if you dont already know). Like said, either try to replace the while thing, or, flare one end to hook up in the back stock location and use a union flare to join somewhere where it becomes good again and is easy to get to so you can check it every so often and fix it if it starts doing something it is not supposed to.

As far as draining the MC, I crimped one end while I worked from back to meet up with the front. Then I recut the line and it got a little messy for about 20 minutes while I made the flare on the OEM line that was left. I worked fast and then bled the back brakes. Wasnt too bad.

Slow&Steady

sikpupy,

By "compression fittings" do you mean these?

Kevs02Accord

Had to do this on my wife's 00 corolla and it was bitch. Here is what I learned that would make the job much easier the next time around.

1. Get the car up as high as you can.
2. Replace the whole line, I replaced part of my line, only to have it spring a leak some where else in the line.
3. Trying to cut and flare brake line, under the car is a nightmare.
4. Use a good set of flare tools, I broke 2 from NAPA.
5. I prefer the CuNi lines, more expensive, however, it will never rust through and can be easily bent by hand.
6. Keep the brake pedal compressed, this will prevent brake fluid from leaking out, other than what is already in the line, and save you the massive headache of trying to get "all" the air out of your brake master cylinder.

That being said, this is definitely doable at home, take your time, use the proper flare fittings, flare wrenches.

PS. I was thinking about replacing the fuel lines as well but I had no idea how to do that. If I had a lift I would have done it though.

sikpupy

Yes, thats a compression fitting. Thats is to be use ONLY if you have no other option. It works, but, since brakes are a life and death issue, it is "better" to use flare ends. You should "hopefully" be able to flare one end of the line (and use the stock nut if it isnt rusted) starting from the back all the way to the good peice thats cut and still useable. Get a Female/Female double end flare nut, flare the good end and end of the new line and connect with the female/female nut.

This is what I did. I used the rusty "looking" nut from the back and put it on the front area so I could keep an eye on it.
Update: I looked to make sure I had the corect naming, and, the female/female nut is called an "inverted flare" nut.
See Pic

Slow&Steady

Great info guys, thanks, and thanks big time for that pic.

I will go with copper/nickel lines then....would the same double flare kit work with it?

The connectors at the back and front, at the ends of the metal line, can anyone hit me with a pic of those and what those are? In my one video linked above, the shop guy calls those "push connectors" and says "has to come from the dealership." I have no experience with those.

sikpupy

Your hard brake lines should be nothing but screw on flares. Not sure what other lines you have that your worried about.

Slow&Steady

Screw-on flares? Well good, as I have experience with those.

I get the car back next week and I'll jack her up and have a good look. I did OK bending Poly Armor (steel) lines so I think I can handle copper-nickel lines. Maybe I can save myself a few hundred here, learn something, and get some pride in a DIY project. Thanks guys.

sikpupy

If your getting a roll, I would def flare one end and try to get it up to the front Y block and route it to the back as far as you can go and make it one piece.

As for saving money doing it yourself, no question there. None of my cars ave ever seen a garage. Cant imagine how much i have saved over the years, especially on my Grand Cherokee. Rebuilt every part on that thing before running her. Engine (stroked it to a 4.6 from a 4.0 . Man, a story behind that one, lol), transfer case, switched over to 4:56 gears, axle bearings n seals, brake calipers/master rebuild, yada yada yada...... Only thing I didnt rebuild was the transmission in that one. Was $300 from the junk yard for a low mile tranny, not worth the time. Although, it wasnt a transmission that was supposed to be in there so I had to trick the transmission control module to work with the existing sensors. Took me 5 months to get off my lazy a$$ and do it, but, I finally did it, lol. I cant imagine how much that would cost if I had someone do that Yea, something about rebuilding your BMW transmission, saving $2500+ and giving AAMCO the middle finger is VERY rewarding..

Saved and been saving a heck of a lot of money doing it myself. Welcome to the club!

Slow&Steady

Oh definitely I'll redo the whole line in one piece if at all possible.

KUDOS on your home repair ethic.....I want to do more than just the oil changes and tire rotations I have been doing.

I assume I would be better served with some flare nut wrenches.....as much as I love American made (especially vintage) I might have to cheap out with some Harbor Freight, are those good enough for the upcoming job?

sikpupy

I wasnt sure because you mentioned compression fittings, then copper-nickel line, which threw the curve ball.

I started with a general automive book like you get in high school shop class, along with hot rod magazines. Then, I used to steal my dads car when he was at work when I was 13, well, till he came home early and I was gone. He made me take the carb off, so, I got back at him and took the intake manifold and heads off. Then I stuck a 3 stage sift kit in it and he finally gave it to me when I got my license, lol. Moral of the story is, you work on enough stuff, you will be doing this in your sleep.

I went to sears and went to but 1 flare wrench and it was $20. The set was $40, so, I was like I will take the set. Lowes in my area started carrying crafstman stuff and I saw a flare wrench set for $20. I am sure not the same quality, but, I am also sure they will do the job. I would check your lowes and do craftsman from them at a min. To answer your question though, I have never had a problem with harbor frieght stuff, knowing they are throw away tools. The items always seeem to last me for the tasks I need them for, but, if they break, I dont get mad. You cant get mad at a dog for biting you, its what they do, lol!

Slow&Steady

I will be out tomorrow, I can try Lowes but I think Craftsman has been made in China for some time now.

Let me ask you guys, what size tubing are the fuel and brake lines under my '02 Accord 4-cylinder?

What all lines are there?

Aradin

Brake hard lines should be 3/16ths. Fuel hard lines are 5/16ths IIRC.

For brakes you will have separate hard lines for each wheel. Two run to the rear alongside the fuel lines. If you have an ABS equipped model you will have more lines that go to the modulator but those are all in the engine bay.

For fuel you will just have a fuel supply and return line.

sikpupy

Given the choice between Harbor Freight and china craftsman, its a toss up, but.I am slightly swayed towards craftsman lifetime warrantee. That would explain breaking general sockets taking off lugnuts, but, hey, I still got a free replacement each time. I just go to my impact set on the heavy stuff now to be safe. Wrenches I have not had a problem with, yet.

On my 94, the brake lines were 10mm. I would do some research just to double check.

Slow&Steady

Since I don't have ABS, I should only have 4 hard lines going to the rear then?

*Not an ABS fan, more a fan of staying back, going slower, and paying attention.

I'll ask the shop what size to get as I want to stay as OEM as possible, aside from going to cupric nickel lines.

Hope to get over to Harbor Fake Tools today.

Thanks again!

sikpupy

Its still 2 to the rear and 2 to the fron in a staggard profile.

There are times paying attention does no good. After skidding through many a turns, most on purpose and 2 times when someone f**ked me up, I found that "A", there is noreal diff in braking distance with either, and "B" ABS WILL keep you from ripping your locked tire a new a**hole. I would rather not have it but it is no big deal to live with it not working or not even on the car.

Yea, I want to pick up a HVLP gravity spray gun and some stuff to paint my car with. THIS is gonna be interesting.

Oh, and never mind my comment about 10mm, that was the nut size. I missed the "tubing size" and was still stuck on wrench size.