AFAccord

I figure I'd post up some photos from my transmission tear down this weekend, as well as the side by side comparisons between the F23 fifth gears and the H23 fifth gears.








Here are the fifth gear sets side by side, F23 set up front, H23 set in the rear.





It might not look like much difference, but the F-series gears @ .685 vs the H-series gears @ .812 makes for a ~800rpm difference at 80mph, or ~650rpm at 60mph.



After about 700 miles of highway driving, I've managed ~32mpg vs the ~27mpg max that I used to see with the H23 5th. I'm very happy with this improvement.

Cannon Man

Very nice. Im getting tired of my h trans gearing too, aside from removing the tranny from the car whats the time frame on switching the gears?

AFAccord

I already had the F tranny disassembled with the gear stacks pulled out. From pulling the stacks apart, pulling the H23 trans apart, swapping the 5th gear set, reassembling the stacks, and bolting the tranny back together, probably took me a little over and hour's time if you don't count the time I spent taking photos and comparing the gears.

TheMuffinMan

iTrader: (1)

I need to do this when I swap out trannys again

Cannon Man

Thats not bad at all. When I pull my motor I think I might try and squeeze this in too. Would this be something thats fairly easy for a first timer or does it take a certain amount of skill to get it right?

AFAccord

If you've never disassembled a Honda tranny before, I wouldn't attempt it unless you have a Helm's factory service manual.

The tricky part for first timers is knowing what needs to be taken out to get it all apart easily, and not loosing track of all the synchros, hubs, springs and rings. There's not much skill involved to remove bolts and pieces, but being able to fit it all back together correctly and knowing what things should look like takes some practice.

The only specialty tool you need is a snap ring expander.


Modified by AFAccord at 7:36 AM 10/21/2008

Duane_in_Japan

Thats why we were hoping for a complete PICTORIAL from you.

AFAccord

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Duane_in_Japan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thats why we were hoping for a complete PICTORIAL from you.</TD></TR></TABLE>

What!?! lol

I'll have to double check, but I don't think I have photos of the whole process. I can list the steps of the procedure, but it's not going to be very easy without some photos to illustrate certain steps.

92teginsc

come on jason. they are counting on you.

Cannon Man

Hmmm I might give it a try, I should dissasemble (sp?) any way due to reasons I dont care to talk about....sure would be nice if someone did a full writeup (ahem)...would be REAL nice = )

AFAccord

Ah geez... my wife will be in class tomorrow. If I have enough free time I'll try to whip something up here.

Cannon Man

Youre a good man. We'd all appreciate it

AFAccord

Well, got caught up working on two other on-going projects last night, and didn't have time to write anything up (obviously).

Stainless bolts + self-locking nuts = FTL

Cannon Man

Its all gravy. Since I dont have an f23 5spd sitting around and cant seem to find one, I may go with an f22 fifth gear. I dunno, my motor wont be coming out anytime soon so I'll cross that bridge when I get to it

noweyec

I have my 5 spd out already for repair. I am interested in the 5th gear swap out. Do you have the part no. of the new gear and possibly a rough price and where to locate one.

thanks also you wouldn't have a pdf of the trans. service manual?

AFAccord

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by noweyec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I have my 5 spd out already for repair. I am interested in the 5th gear swap out. Do you have the part no. of the new gear and possibly a rough price and where to locate one.

thanks also you wouldn't have a pdf of the trans. service manual?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Most people have their F trans still available to tear down, but I suppose you could buy it new if you wanted.

Part# 4
http://www.hondaautomotivepart...SHAFT

Part# 6
http://www.hondaautomotivepart...SHAFT

Looks like it'll run you ~$120 before shipping. You might find someone willing to sell their's to you for cheaper.

I don't have any soft copies of service manuals, and I couldn't share if I did. I'm not trying to get sued over copyright infringement.

kongzilla

I'm interested in seeing step by step photos of this also. Planning on tearing down my F22 tranny with all new bearings along with carbon coated synchros.

Duane_in_Japan

Carbon coated, would that involve nano technology, maybe some carbon tubing going on there.

DC2.2_GSR

i apologize for bumping this ancient thread, but it's the only one with seemingly reliable info about this 5th gear swap. if there's a better or more current thread, please point me in the right direction!

i just have a few questions about the process and compatibility. first, since i assume H23 and H22 transmissions and parts are interchangeable, i'm also assuming the F23 5th gear swap that worked for AFAccord would also work for my M2A4 H22A transmission, correct?

the post with the links above references needing "part 4" and "part 6", which are listed on Majestic Honda's website as

23451-PX5-U41 - GEAR, MAINSHAFT FOURTH
23581-PX5-A41 - GEAR, MAINSHAFT FIFTH

first of all, are these the only parts that I need from the F23 transmission in order to have everything function or are there supporting parts like bolts, clips, rings, etc. that I also need from the F23 trans? Does my M2A4 H22A trans have everything I need except for the actual 5th gear itself? Also, since it's mentioned above would I need the fourth gear as well in order to make everything work or was it just referenced in case someone wanted the 4th gear as well?

another non-honda specific trans question.. does changing the 5th gear change the entire trans overall as far as final drive or anything or does it literally just change 5th gear and leave the rest alone? for some reason i was under the assumption that changing one thing threw off every gear as well. i just don't want gears 1-4 to be affected by the 5th gear change. (currently reading up on final drives and general gear ratio info).

I have zero experience with transmission work, but I'm fully capable of reading the Helm manual and following everything to the T. As long as I get a confirmation about the exact parts I need I can easily figure it out from there.

the H22A's M2A4 trans is at 4200 rpm at 80 mph and that just won't cut it. lol any help you guys could give would be great!

Blazin Si

I need to do this swap as well. 25 MPG with the m2s4 transmission is killing me.

apexi_bb6

I've been doing some research on h/f series transmissions for my 98 lude, i've got the stock M2Y4 trans (H22A4) from the 5th gen, and a stock M2S4 trans (H23A2) leftover from my 92Si part out. Either trans will need a rebuild as well, but a higher 5th gear was desired because i'm also planning a boosted H23Vtec swap next year. I can't find the info i wrote down a few months ago but i'll keep looking for them. From what i can remember all F22a, F23a, and F20b transmission internals are compatible with H22a, H22a2/4, and H23a/a2 transmissions.

IIRC, the 5th gen USDM trans with EuroR (T2W4?) differential and F23 5th Gear was the exact setup i was looking for.

I'm planning on using the Si trans with the N/A H23 Vtec motor and assemble the 5th gen trans with desired parts while i'm working on the turbo or supercharged setup, then installing it with the power adder.

Does anyone know the F23 (2000-2002 accord 4cyl) trans code? That's the one i can't remember/find.

I'll also look for the link to the trans codes/ gear ratio's for the F/H series transmissions

Rude Awakening

If you're going to waste a T2W4, sell that **** to ME!

apexi_bb6

That would have been the ideal combo, but i'm not going to tear appart a $1200 transmission just for the final drive. I'd more likely use the grand for a mechanical LSD on a 5th gen Final drive if i couldnt get ahold of just the final drive/output shaft of the EuroR.

DC2.2_GSR

bumping this from the second page.

if anyone has any info they could share i'd really appreciate it. not trying to be helpless here, still looking on my own. i'd just rather not tear into my M2A4 just to find that it would never work anyway.

rash

I'd like to know this as well. I have a t2w4 I'm rebuilding, and the 5th gear got a little worn. So I figured, why not gain a few MPGs with the f23 gear?