Why won't God heal amputees? - Page 24 - Honda-Tech - Honda Forum Discussion

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Why won't God heal amputees?

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Old 07-23-2008, 07:04 AM
  #576  
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Default Re: (Knightsport)

Originally Posted by Knightsport

I've read the entire article and I don't feel "tested," as you obviously did.
I finally just read it and couldn't agree more. The writer is an obviously cocky person to assume so many truths about God that are not stated in any religious text (to be honest he sounds a lot like ActiveAero, surprise surprise). The assumption the he is willing and able to grow legs back onto humans is completely unbased in any fact.

Aero, or any other defender of this article, find me in the bible where it explicitly says the God healed an amputee. We'll take it from there.
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Old 07-23-2008, 09:44 AM
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Default Re: (mgags7)

Originally Posted by mgags7

Aero, or any other defender of this article, find me in the bible where it explicitly says the God healed an amputee. We'll take it from there.
I think all hes got, is the incident where Peter cut a mans ear in the garden of Gesthemane. Luke is the only gospel writer to include the information that Jesus touched the mans ear and healed it. There is no implication that Jesus made another ear grow in place of that one.
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Old 07-23-2008, 09:47 AM
  #578  
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Default Re: (George Knighton)

Originally Posted by George Knighton

We might want to enlighten readers to the point that we make them aware that you and I disagree over the definition of a Christian because your own faith calls itself Christian, but it falls outside the tradition definition of Christianity.
Our standard disclaimer.
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Old 07-23-2008, 12:13 PM
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Default Re: (mgags7)

Originally Posted by mgags7
The assumption the he is willing and able to grow legs back onto humans is completely unbased in any fact.
First, there is nothing about your religion other than some of the historical citations in its book that is based on fact. Remember you need evidence for facts.

Second, do you not find it preposterous to claim it unreasonable to assume that some all-powerful, omnipotent creator-of-the-[freak]ing-universe-and-all-life-within-it could 'grow legs back onto humans'? IT CREATED THE UNIVERSE FOR [freak]'S SAKE. At least according to you people.
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Old 07-23-2008, 12:45 PM
  #580  
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Default Re: (YeuEmMaiMai)

Originally Posted by YeuEmMaiMai

before you make yourself look like an ***, go back and read what I said.......

Nowhere did I mention your name..........I was referring to those who would want to step on our rights under free speech to hold our beliefs and to preach them to others....if you don't want to hear it, that's fine, you are free to leave any time you like......
Actually you are free to leave anytime. This country was not founded on religion, and we have freedom FROM it...separation of church and state...take a hint.
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Old 07-23-2008, 12:50 PM
  #581  
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Default Re: (artifex)

Originally Posted by artifex

First, there is nothing about your religion other than some of the historical citations in its book that is based on fact. Remember you need evidence for facts.

Second, do you not find it preposterous to claim it unreasonable to assume that some all-powerful, omnipotent creator-of-the-[freak]ing-universe-and-all-life-within-it could 'grow legs back onto humans'? IT CREATED THE UNIVERSE FOR [freak]'S SAKE. At least according to you people.
If you're going to question God and all in respect to what His book says, you must take it as "fact" whether you like to call it that or not.

As for your second note, it isn't within your or my own power to know anything of the creator, therefore to make any assumption about what he can or can't do is ludicrous.
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Old 07-23-2008, 12:54 PM
  #582  
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Default Re: (Blackpin93)

Originally Posted by Blackpin93

Actually you are free to leave anytime. This country was not founded on religion, and we have freedom FROM it...separation of church and state...take a hint.
Having a mormon knock on your door to preach his word is not any sort of infringement on your constitutional freedoms. Any move to restrict him from doing so, however, is an infringement on his.
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Old 07-23-2008, 03:09 PM
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Default Re: (mgags7)

Originally Posted by mgags7

Having a mormon knock on your door to preach his word is not any sort of infringement on your constitutional freedoms. Any move to restrict him from doing so, however, is an infringement on his.
Really? Back this up now please, I don't believe it at all.
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Old 07-23-2008, 04:20 PM
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Default Re: (mgags7)

Originally Posted by mgags7
I finally just read it and couldn't agree more. The writer is an obviously cocky person to assume so many truths about God that are not stated in any religious text (to be honest he sounds a lot like ActiveAero, surprise surprise).
Please point out the "truths" that the author is assuming that is not layed out in texts.

Originally Posted by mgags7
The assumption the he is willing and able to grow legs back onto humans is completely unbased in any fact.
I'm not sure how you can make such a claim. The Bible and endless numbers of religious texts state that God is all powerful. If you'd like to point out to us where God states that he is powerless to do certain things you are more than welcome.


Once again it seems like you guys are completely missing the point of the article and just focusing on whatever details you like. It's not about Amputees. Amputees are just an example given to help prove the point.


The whole point is to show EXACTLY what you all have been doing...which is rationalizing away why God doesn't perform certain tasks when there is NOTHING in the Bible stating that he wont. You have no problem attributing all sorts of other insane tasks to the power and "miracles" of God but then whenever it's convient you go and make up some excuse to limit his power. It's complete hypocrisy.

For example here is something found just a few posts up:

"Creating a limb would be an act of creation. There are several indicators to the fact that the time for such things has not yet come."

Where does the idea that God doesn't do creation miracles come from? What difference is it for God to give someone back their sight vs giving someone back an arm or a leg? Making up some technicality for God based on the body part already being there would be absurd. In both cases the person is completely lacking in a normal human function yet it clearly states God has healed blind people.

Or this one:

"Luke is the only gospel writer to include the information that Jesus touched the mans ear and healed it. There is no implication that Jesus made another ear grow in place of that one."


What is the difference between Jesus miraculously reattaching the ear vs him causing a new one to grow? This once again shows people are looking to attack any little semantics of the article they can.

The author could have equally stated "Why doesn't God REATTACH lost limbs?" and the argument is still the same.

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Old 07-23-2008, 08:49 PM
  #585  
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Default Re: (ActiveAero)

Originally Posted by ActiveAero

For example here is something found just a few posts up:

"Creating a limb would be an act of creation. There are several indicators to the fact that the time for such things has not yet come."

Where does the idea that God doesn't do creation miracles come from? What difference is it for God to give someone back their sight vs giving someone back an arm or a leg?
Well, its somewhat of a deeper thought involved here, but the bible indicates that we are still living in the seventh 'rest' day. Now I know some people take them to be 24 hour days of creation, but there are indicators that show otherwise. So, I dont think that God has been creating anything on the Earth for almost 6000 years now.
Plus, Im sure that the difference between healing and creating is quite easily discerned. Re-attaching a body part is a well-established medical practice. While to grow another organ or body part is a new development. In fact, from what I know, they still have to use existing tissue. Ive seen those pictures of the geneticaly engineered rats who grow human ears on their backs. They alter the DNA of the rat, so that its body grows the tissue necessary, but its still coming from somewhere, an organic biological source.

Anyway, if you want to argue that God is 'all-powerful' so why doesnt he, then that becomes a moot point. Why doesnt he do a lot of things that he COULD? Like make our breakfasts for us? (you could even use the miraculous feedings that Jesus performed as precedents)
What His name indicates about Him (for those who know its meaning), is that He is the great purposer, the One who always fulfills His will. But if something is not His will, then his decision not to do it is no indication of a lack of power.
If he doesnt grant someone the prayer of winning the lottery, it doesnt mean that God is incapable of granting that prayer, it simply means that he is not interested in granting that prayer, it does not fall within the bounds of his will for today.
I think Ive already quoted you what the Bible states about his will for our day, as well as the verse from 1John that shows that 'anything we pray for according to his will, he hears us'.
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Old 07-23-2008, 09:23 PM
  #586  
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Default Re: Why won't God heal amputees? (ActiveAero)

Originally Posted by ActiveAero

And yes I know what I just did.
Whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy lol

For the most part our knowledge is furthered by problems we encounter and how we work to solve them.

If "god" came down and magically did everything for us and healed our every ailment then we wouldn't be anything, we wouldn't have any knowledge of the natural world, and wouldn't aspire to further ourselves.

All the usual parts of a typical religion thread are here, even saw the god of the gaps argument on the first page! lol

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Old 07-23-2008, 09:34 PM
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Default Re: (Mentat Ghola)

Originally Posted by Mentat Ghola
Well, its somewhat of a deeper thought involved here, but the bible indicates that we are still living in the seventh 'rest' day. Now I know some people take them to be 24 hour days of creation, but there are indicators that show otherwise. So, I dont think that God has been creating anything on the Earth for almost 6000 years now.
So Jesus wasn't born of a virgin?


Originally Posted by Mentat Ghola
Plus, Im sure that the difference between healing and creating is quite easily discerned. Re-attaching a body part is a well-established medical practice.
It was a well established medical practice 2,000 years ago? Blind people having their sight restored from a man's blessing is a known medical practice too?

I have a pretty good feeling those stories were put into the Bible to convey the act of it being miraculously done and not simply some task which any normal man could accomplish.


Originally Posted by Mentat Ghola
Anyway, if you want to argue that God is 'all-powerful' so why doesnt he, then that becomes a moot point. Why doesnt he do a lot of things that he COULD? Like make our breakfasts for us? (you could even use the miraculous feedings that Jesus performed as precedents)
What His name indicates about Him (for those who know its meaning), is that He is the great purposer, the One who always fulfills His will. But if something is not His will, then his decision not to do it is no indication of a lack of power.
If he doesnt grant someone the prayer of winning the lottery, it doesnt mean that God is incapable of granting that prayer, it simply means that he is not interested in granting that prayer, it does not fall within the bounds of his will for today.
I think Ive already quoted you what the Bible states about his will for our day, as well as the verse from 1John that shows that 'anything we pray for according to his will, he hears us'.

I've already covered this numerous times.

No one is asking why God doesn't do everything we pray to him for. We are asking why he apparently has no problem granting certain blessings for certain people at certain times while at the same time NEVER answering the prayers from certain groups.

Why does God ALWAYS exclude people who have prayers that would TRULY require a miracle?

A secondary question could also be made off of this and that is: Why do people from all of the other false religions around the world receive the EXACT same type of miracles as do believers in the Christian god? The pray to false gods which is a practice that is STRICTLY forbidden per the ten commandments yet their "false" gods are able to heal them just the same as yours.

The only way you could try to rationalize this is by saying that God just performs tasks according to his plan which includes healing non-believers as well. However, if you do this it creates a pretty big problem. If God just performs tasks according to a plan as obvious by him blessing NON-believers who pray AGAINST his will then what exactly is the point of prayer since God obviously doesn't care if you pray to him or not and is simply doing things according to his "plan"?

Then you have the argument going right back to square one and that's that everything stated above could be used as equal logic by all other religions of the world. I could just as equally say my unicorn God performed all of those "miracles".

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Old 07-23-2008, 11:13 PM
  #588  
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Default Re: (George Knighton)

Originally Posted by George Knighton
Discussing a concept such as the "perfection" of the Uncreated is an abstruse and almost ridiculous idea.

By definition, since God consists of the entirety of existence, God is perfection; however, there is no point in discussing it because God simply is as he is, and struggling to separate the Uncreated Energy from Creation is a worthless endeavour, IMHO.
I tend to agree but I'm not really one to back down form an argument of futility either.


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I think that most people would have assumed from some of your other comments that you were probably a Catholic. Are you not?</TD></TR></TABLE>

[/QUOTE]

I was raised in both the Irish Catholic Church and the Southern Baptist Church and my wife is a Methodist. Which is the church we were married in and attend now.

I am a religious mess.
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Old 07-24-2008, 03:58 AM
  #589  
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Default Re: (ActiveAero)

Originally Posted by ActiveAero

It was a well established medical practice 2,000 years ago? Blind people having their sight restored from a man's blessing is a known medical practice too?

I have a pretty good feeling those stories were put into the Bible to convey the act of it being miraculously done and not simply some task which any normal man could accomplish.
No, I meant today. You said 'whats the difference', and I was talking about that same difference.

Originally Posted by ActiveAero

So Jesus wasn't born of a virgin?
Exactly, he was born of a woman, not created from dust as Adam was.

Originally Posted by ActiveAero

No one is asking why God doesn't do everything we pray to him for. We are asking why he apparently has no problem granting certain blessings for certain people at certain times while at the same time NEVER answering the prayers from certain groups.

Why does God ALWAYS exclude people who have prayers that would TRULY require a miracle?

A secondary question could also be made off of this and that is: Why do people from all of the other false religions around the world receive the EXACT same type of miracles as do believers in the Christian god? The pray to false gods which is a practice that is STRICTLY forbidden per the ten commandments yet their "false" gods are able to heal them just the same as yours.

The only way you could try to rationalize this is by saying that God just performs tasks according to his plan which includes healing non-believers as well. However, if you do this it creates a pretty big problem. If God just performs tasks according to a plan as obvious by him blessing NON-believers who pray AGAINST his will then what exactly is the point of prayer since God obviously doesn't care if you pray to him or not and is simply doing things according to his "plan"?

Then you have the argument going right back to square one and that's that everything stated above could be used as equal logic by all other religions of the world. I could just as equally say my unicorn God performed all of those "miracles".
I acknowledge that there are miraculous works being done, and that they have been done for a long time. Their source isnt necessarily the creator.
Acts 16:16 talks about a woman who had a gift of divinnation, she could foretell the future, the source of her gift is also clearly identified, and is again mentioned at
2Thesalonians 2:9,10. Take a look for yourself. Such powerful works, according to that verse are designed to mislead and confuse.

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Old 07-25-2008, 01:57 PM
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Default Re: (ActiveAero)

Originally Posted by ActiveAero

A secondary question could also be made off of this and that is: Why do people from all of the other false religions around the world receive the EXACT same type of miracles as do believers in the Christian god? The pray to false gods which is a practice that is STRICTLY forbidden per the ten commandments yet their "false" gods are able to heal them just the same as yours.

The only way you could try to rationalize this is by saying that God just performs tasks according to his plan which includes healing non-believers as well. However, if you do this it creates a pretty big problem. If God just performs tasks according to a plan as obvious by him blessing NON-believers who pray AGAINST his will then what exactly is the point of prayer since God obviously doesn't care if you pray to him or not and is simply doing things according to his "plan"?
God still loves them even though they have chosen to turn away from Him.

"But I tell you: Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous."

-Mathew 5:44-45

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