93LSivic

I've heard stories but never believed them until now.
Im here building a +.020" D series motor and Im in the middle of filing the rings. So far no issues with the top ring, but the bottom rings are .020, .020, .020, and .021 out of the box!! What the hell?? Im shooting for a .015 gap and these are way over exceeding my proposed gap.
Is anyone else have this problem and continue on with the build? If so, is the engine consuming oil or any kind of poor leakdown numbers?
Im really pissed off at this right now. Supposedly these pistons are the ****, but stupid problems like this leads me to wonder why. I have another customers engine to build right behind this one and then my personal motor behind that. Unfortunately both of the these will also be using CP pistons Im considering using another brand because of this.

h22 civic

whered ya get your cp pistons from? i just had a bad cp piston story also with tom from camp1320.i bought the pistons from him cause cp recomended him i send the money and he dont pick it up so now im waiting for him to come back from some race a week from now to go pick up the money i should of known when i seen a po box how profesional is that??camp1320 that was very unproffesional

ITSTOCK

I would never buy from camp1320, for the simple fact that the 10 times ive tried getting ahold of them to get parts, i never get a single response.

Back on topic, what kind of rings came with the pistons?

Kelly.

im confused,
are you sayin that that is to big outta the box?
are you sure they were new rings?

this weekend we filed new cp rings and they were ~ .009 outta the box.

call whoever you bought them from and tell them, they need to send you new rings.

93LSivic

Please dont bring up your personal purchasing experiences into this thread. Tom over at 1320 is cool as **** and have helped many people on this board. This has nothing to do with our dealer who we bought them from.

These were the rings supplied with the pistons. Bagged individually for each piston without a printed label on them. V50 is stamped on each upper and lower ring.
Weird, I just opened the other CP boxes that are 83 and 84 mm B series and the rings that were bagged in those boxes had labels on them specifying bore size, but no part number.

93LSivic

Yes, gapped too big out of the box, or should I say sealed bad.
I believe it was Andy from BodykitsNW that was telling me about his experience with CP's he had used being over-gapped new.

acy76

My CPs (81.5mm 9:1 LS) came with 1 ring gapped larger than the gap I was shooting for. Had to buy a new ring (or, should I say, the machine shop ordered a new one and I had to pay for it - should have been free).

omahaturbocivic

The lower compression rings on my d16 .020 over pinstons were gapped that large too but we did not worry about it, we were gapping mine about that loose anyways. Darius from cp said to run .018 up top and .020 on the bottom for up to 25 lbs of boost and my middle rings were all right around .021 so we just ran them as is. I got over 900 miles on the motor so far with no oil consumption or problems.

BROOD

I had a similar issue with some Wiesco pistons rings. They were already outside the spec range even before filing them. Got some new ones and they were better.

I'll agree though that is something that really pisses you off in the middle of an engine build.


Modified by BROOD at 9:31 AM 4/16/2004

Scott - 93HB Si

What did you gap your top ring for?
You said you're shooting for 0.015 on the bottom ring? ISn't the spec 0.016-0.022?

Nextelbuddy

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by h22 civic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">whered ya get your cp pistons from? i just had a bad cp piston story also with tom from camp1320.i bought the pistons from him cause cp recomended him i send the money and he dont pick it up so now im waiting for him to come back from some race a week from now to go pick up the money i should of known when i seen a po box how profesional is that??camp1320 that was very unproffesional </TD></TR></TABLE>

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ITSTOCK &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I would never buy from camp1320, for the simple fact that the 10 times ive tried getting ahold of them to get parts, i never get a single response. </TD></TR></TABLE>

plenty of people on this board have had good experiences with camp1320 including myself. please dont bash them becuase you had a inconvienient experience. Tom at cap1320 is a very busy man and and sometimes he cant always be there because of his situation. that is the consequences of getting great prices on his items over other places.

camp1320

NOW back on topic

Enthalpy

when i do CP 9.0:1, 86.5mm in SR20's they usually come gapped exactly right! i dont have to file at all. very strange.

I use earls trusty ring gap formula.

0.006" per inch of bore - top ring

0.0045" per inch or bore - mid ring

they come out to exactly 0.020 and 0.015. i can see how a little bit of variance in the ring could casue a huge problem though. thats why you always check!!

Scott

Joseph Davis

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93LSivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Weird, I just opened the other CP boxes that are 83 and 84 mm B series and the rings that were bagged in those boxes had labels on them specifying bore size, but no part number.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

I have a sneaking suspicion that most of the JDM automakers share rings... I've torn apart a couple of EA and early EJ scoobies and their compression rigns are all of the same width and thickness and Honda units, the only variance is the bore size. If the aftermarket models itself after the OEM, like it has in so many cases, I wouldn't be surprised if those are OEM rings of some nature that get stuck in the (insert brand here) box.

93LSivic

I planned on running .018" for the top ring and .015" for the second ring. I guess it's gonna be .020" for the bottom. I dont think it'll cause any issues, but Im just used to going with a larger gap on the top ring, or often times I will even run the same gap for both rings. I guess we'll see how it turns out.

Honda Hick

I would just contact CP and see if they can exchange them. Are they a US company? They might be a little easier to work with then.


Modified by Honda Hick at 4:45 PM 4/16/2004

h22 civic

ok ill start my own thred tha ts a good idea

BodyKits NW

What you didn't believe me? Every set I have had, has done the same thing. I swapped some hasting rings in there, problem solved. It's always the bottom too. The top rings are just fine, there is plenty of room for filing. I just don't like the fact I can't gap them smaller if I wanted to on that bottom ring. Like I said, I swapped some 84mm Hasting rings in there and I had plenty of room to file both top and bottom ring. I called Durias and all there rings are like that. They said they get it all from the same supplier JE & everyone else does, but every JE ring I replace them with always have a smaller gap to start off with.

earl

There are many experienced engine builders who will tell you it is better to have the second ring gapped about .002"-.003" larger than the upper ring gap. I have been experimenting a little with this configuration. You will not hurt yourself with the larger second ring gap.

TurboTegB18c

I run .017 top, and .019 2nd. But to my suprise, when i put my cp rings in, the 2nd ring was .019 dead on, all of them. I didn't have to file, which i was happy. However, i usually do like to run smaller gaps on NON-high boost cars. Which i would've been disappointed with if that were the case. I think CP needs to check it out if alot of people are having this problem. Just my opinion. Paul

mattback

funny, the B series that I built with CP pistons , the rings were soo damn tight I had to file them for what seemed like an eternity to get the clearances that I was confident in running.

With the larger gaps you will end up with a motor that may consume a little oil, and run a little weaker until warm, but once everything is at operating temperature, will still rip with the best of them, right?

h22 civic

what other rings do ya recomend?

Suprdave

Are you guys double checking the Bore finish that the machine shop did?

If say, the machine shop hones the block with a .005 thou piston-wall, your ring gaps are going to be larger outta the box than if it has a .003" Clearance. That's why with alot of manufacturers they offer a 'file to fit' ring that come's way tight and you need to file it out. I would double check the machine-work if the ring gap was either way small or way tight.

CRVRX

Quote: Are you guys double checking the Bore finish that the machine shop did?

I always measure the bore size before gapping the rings, I have used many wisco/Endyn rings and they only time they measured wrong , the bore was too big. Measure the the Piston -to-wall clearance first before buying rings.

EFb18b

Damn, you both beat me too it
Are you sure the pistons are matching the bore size? All of my piston rings were tight and had to be filed to match. I was also able to keep the rings on the tight end of the scale but did file the second ring .003 over the upper.

93LSivic

Umm, yeah. Thats the first thing I checked. Sorry, I guess I should have mentioned that. We are running a .0035" piston to wall clearance on this motor.
[sarcasm]I have built a motor or two before[/sarcasm] Im just baffled why CP uses such a large 2nd ring.