why do people pick turbo over SC?
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why do people pick turbo over SC?
a question came upon us while we were chatting. most of the people i know rather have turbo than supercharger. and when was reading on the FI forum, i realize that most people said to go with turbo than SC. why?
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Re: (nevin)
turbo = endless potential and orgasmic sounds, period
supercharger = not enough potential and not enough power, period.
now to expand. turbo is the absolute most efficient way of making free power. Possibilities are pretty much unlimited when picking an application to suit your needs perfectly. You can control your power with the press of a button, and even hook up gear based boost control. Yes, top end is also a plus, which is where you want your power band when racing anyways. Not to mention the kick in the *** a turbo gives you once it is spooled.
Superchargers build power off power. The only way to "upgrade" a supercharger is to add a little pulley on it, and whats the fun of that? Who wants to mess with all those belts and tensioners? The off-the-line power certain individuals drool over is going to leave you spinning tires while the other person is taking off while building boost.
There is a lot more about the debate which is endless, but I am hungry right now. Get a turbo and you wont regret it. I havent heard of ANYONE who regretted getting a turbo.
supercharger = not enough potential and not enough power, period.
now to expand. turbo is the absolute most efficient way of making free power. Possibilities are pretty much unlimited when picking an application to suit your needs perfectly. You can control your power with the press of a button, and even hook up gear based boost control. Yes, top end is also a plus, which is where you want your power band when racing anyways. Not to mention the kick in the *** a turbo gives you once it is spooled.
Superchargers build power off power. The only way to "upgrade" a supercharger is to add a little pulley on it, and whats the fun of that? Who wants to mess with all those belts and tensioners? The off-the-line power certain individuals drool over is going to leave you spinning tires while the other person is taking off while building boost.
There is a lot more about the debate which is endless, but I am hungry right now. Get a turbo and you wont regret it. I havent heard of ANYONE who regretted getting a turbo.
#5
Re: (intekragsr)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by intekragsr »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">turbo = endless potential and orgasmic sounds, period
supercharger = not enough potential and not enough power, period.
now to expand. turbo is the absolute most efficient way of making free power. Possibilities are pretty much unlimited when picking an application to suit your needs perfectly. You can control your power with the press of a button, and even hook up gear based boost control. Yes, top end is also a plus, which is where you want your power band when racing anyways. Not to mention the kick in the *** a turbo gives you once it is spooled.
Superchargers build power off power. The only way to "upgrade" a supercharger is to add a little pulley on it, and whats the fun of that? Who wants to mess with all those belts and tensioners? The off-the-line power certain individuals drool over is going to leave you spinning tires while the other person is taking off while building boost.
There is a lot more about the debate which is endless, but I am hungry right now. Get a turbo and you wont regret it. I havent heard of ANYONE who regretted getting a turbo. </TD></TR></TABLE>
while this is true the fastest cars at the drag strip are Supercharged, then Nitrous, then turbo then all motor. this is Top fuel.. pro classes then street classes. a single turbo can Only make so much power, while a roots blower can make MUCH more and the webmaster of Clubsi ( SiRacer) had hell with his turbo an ditched it for a Vortech and is more than happy now with his 350whp and wants no more he says. with not one problem. domt make it sound like blowers cant compare PERIOD. its just not as good on a honda. and work on the arrogance.
supercharger = not enough potential and not enough power, period.
now to expand. turbo is the absolute most efficient way of making free power. Possibilities are pretty much unlimited when picking an application to suit your needs perfectly. You can control your power with the press of a button, and even hook up gear based boost control. Yes, top end is also a plus, which is where you want your power band when racing anyways. Not to mention the kick in the *** a turbo gives you once it is spooled.
Superchargers build power off power. The only way to "upgrade" a supercharger is to add a little pulley on it, and whats the fun of that? Who wants to mess with all those belts and tensioners? The off-the-line power certain individuals drool over is going to leave you spinning tires while the other person is taking off while building boost.
There is a lot more about the debate which is endless, but I am hungry right now. Get a turbo and you wont regret it. I havent heard of ANYONE who regretted getting a turbo. </TD></TR></TABLE>
while this is true the fastest cars at the drag strip are Supercharged, then Nitrous, then turbo then all motor. this is Top fuel.. pro classes then street classes. a single turbo can Only make so much power, while a roots blower can make MUCH more and the webmaster of Clubsi ( SiRacer) had hell with his turbo an ditched it for a Vortech and is more than happy now with his 350whp and wants no more he says. with not one problem. domt make it sound like blowers cant compare PERIOD. its just not as good on a honda. and work on the arrogance.
#7
Re: (TurboSedan)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TurboSedan »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You kow that the Vortech is not a roots style right? It is a centrifugal supercharger.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yes I know that Centrifugals are like belt driven turbos that makes power mid range and a bit up top and roots starts making positive prsssure just after idle
Yes I know that Centrifugals are like belt driven turbos that makes power mid range and a bit up top and roots starts making positive prsssure just after idle
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#10
Re: (igo4bmx)
Turbo hands down for a honda. I would go all motor before I went with a supercharger. The guy making 350whp with his supercharger is one of the few making good power with a blower but deffinatly not the 200-230whp norm. There are many many turbo hondas making the same power and more and more making 450-500+.
#11
Re: (TurboSedan)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TurboSedan »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Ok, you just stated in your earlier post that the roots blower can make much more power and then went on about the ClubSi webmaster using a Vortech. </TD></TR></TABLE>
My point about the CSI guy was that there ARE people who complain about turbos contrary to what that guy said. it had nothing to do with the roots blower part of it, what I was saying there is that Roots blowerscan make MUCH more power than any one turbo on any car.
My point about the CSI guy was that there ARE people who complain about turbos contrary to what that guy said. it had nothing to do with the roots blower part of it, what I was saying there is that Roots blowerscan make MUCH more power than any one turbo on any car.
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Re: (TTWS6)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TTWS6 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
while this is true the fastest cars at the drag strip are Supercharged, then Nitrous, then turbo then all motor. this is Top fuel.. pro classes then street classes. a single turbo can Only make so much power, while a roots blower can make MUCH more </TD></TR></TABLE>
The top fuel cars only run superchages because turbo's were outlawed because they were making too much power. If they could use turbo's, believe me they would...
while this is true the fastest cars at the drag strip are Supercharged, then Nitrous, then turbo then all motor. this is Top fuel.. pro classes then street classes. a single turbo can Only make so much power, while a roots blower can make MUCH more </TD></TR></TABLE>
The top fuel cars only run superchages because turbo's were outlawed because they were making too much power. If they could use turbo's, believe me they would...
#13
Re: (TTWS6)
I agree with you folks that a turbo is better for top end on a Honda ( despite thefact that The Vortech civic broke 200mph hehe) but I had to comment on how that guy who was obviously biased towards turbos was making what seemed like a genral statement about superchargers. and he was incorrect.
#14
Re: (mopar junkie)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mopar junkie »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
The top fuel cars only run superchages because turbo's were outlawed because they were making too much power. If they could use turbo's, believe me they would...</TD></TR></TABLE>
no they wouldnt, first of all you do u even know why those roots makes as much power as they do? secondly. those cars run on Nitromethane which burns RAW. it doesnt turn into exhaust gas. it burns into fire that would crack and exhaust housing after a few runs. PLEASE tell me what turbo they used that was making TOO much power? highest hp turbo car to date made just under 3000hp and it was Two turbos.
The top fuel cars only run superchages because turbo's were outlawed because they were making too much power. If they could use turbo's, believe me they would...</TD></TR></TABLE>
no they wouldnt, first of all you do u even know why those roots makes as much power as they do? secondly. those cars run on Nitromethane which burns RAW. it doesnt turn into exhaust gas. it burns into fire that would crack and exhaust housing after a few runs. PLEASE tell me what turbo they used that was making TOO much power? highest hp turbo car to date made just under 3000hp and it was Two turbos.
#15
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Re: (TTWS6)
A turbo is much more efficient than any kind of supercharger. When its sized right for the motor, it will make the most power gain for the least amount of power draw. The main difference between a supercharger vs. a turbo is that a supercharger is directly linked to crank speed, and maintains a ratio of crank speed vs. supercharger speed. A turbo spins based on exhaust flow, and doesn't have to spins proportionally to crank speed.
What the fastest Honda drag car??? A turbo charged, NSX powered car.
What the fastest Honda drag car??? A turbo charged, NSX powered car.
#16
Re: (Marauder)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Marauder »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">A turbo is much more efficient than any kind of supercharger. When its sized right for the motor, it will make the most power gain for the least amount of power draw. The main difference between a supercharger vs. a turbo is that a supercharger is directly linked to crank speed, and maintains a ratio of crank speed vs. supercharger speed. A turbo spins based on exhaust flow, and doesn't have to spins proportionally to crank speed.
What the fastest Honda drag car??? A turbo charged, NSX powered car. </TD></TR></TABLE>
on street cars only. do you know that in the outlaw classes turbo cars are aloowed to weigh less because they make less hp? or did u not know that because you know nothing outside the world of Honda? Im not trying to be condesending but its just a pet peev of mine when ppl try to generalise stuff like this. no flames please.
Modified by TTWS6 at 4:54 PM 7/14/2003
What the fastest Honda drag car??? A turbo charged, NSX powered car. </TD></TR></TABLE>
on street cars only. do you know that in the outlaw classes turbo cars are aloowed to weigh less because they make less hp? or did u not know that because you know nothing outside the world of Honda? Im not trying to be condesending but its just a pet peev of mine when ppl try to generalise stuff like this. no flames please.
Modified by TTWS6 at 4:54 PM 7/14/2003
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Re: (TTWS6)
Here the low down on honda's Ive ran these three setups and ill give you my opinion
1) gsr high compression 75 wet shot, nice torque, instanst power, but it sucked filling damn bottle and car only being fast when u push that stupid button.
2) b20 vtec Supercharged(JRSC) gsr tranny, nice punch no top end, but the car doesn' have the potential to meet alot of people goals.
3) b20 vtec turbo gsr tranny, t3/t04e quick spool, nice torque, good top end, overall best imo, sounds badass, unlimited potential for a street car.
Superchargers are a good choice for someone who wants to run a high 13 and thats it.. Someone who just wants the feel of a quick car while cruisin around town.
Turbo is for someone who wants more out of thier car. competetion for ls1's on highway, top end, competitive at the track.
Just though id share my .02 cents. Also these setups were ran in this order. I ran the supercharged setup for 3 months becaus ei realized i wanted more performance and my only option was TURBO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
1) gsr high compression 75 wet shot, nice torque, instanst power, but it sucked filling damn bottle and car only being fast when u push that stupid button.
2) b20 vtec Supercharged(JRSC) gsr tranny, nice punch no top end, but the car doesn' have the potential to meet alot of people goals.
3) b20 vtec turbo gsr tranny, t3/t04e quick spool, nice torque, good top end, overall best imo, sounds badass, unlimited potential for a street car.
Superchargers are a good choice for someone who wants to run a high 13 and thats it.. Someone who just wants the feel of a quick car while cruisin around town.
Turbo is for someone who wants more out of thier car. competetion for ls1's on highway, top end, competitive at the track.
Just though id share my .02 cents. Also these setups were ran in this order. I ran the supercharged setup for 3 months becaus ei realized i wanted more performance and my only option was TURBO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
#20
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Re: (TTWS6)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TTWS6 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">on street cars only. do you know that in the outlaw classes turbo cars are aloowed to weigh less because they make less hp? or did u not know that because you know nothing outside the world of Honda? Im not trying to be condesending but its just a pet peev of mine when ppl try to generalise stuff like this. no flames please.</TD></TR></TABLE>Weak argument. An appeal to an authority (in this case a sanctioning body) is irrelevant to the argument that superchargers are "better" than turbochargers. Since when was the NHRA in the business of designing superchargers and turbos? Short answer to that is: They're not. Wanna try again?
#21
Re: (CheezeFrog)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CheezeFrog »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Weak argument. An appeal to an authority (in this case a sanctioning body) is irrelevant to the argument that superchargers are "better" than turbochargers. Since when was the NHRA in the business of designing superchargers and turbos? Short answer to that is: They're not. Wanna try again?</TD></TR></TABLE>
How is it irrelevant? proof is in the pudding. Pros are sponsered with Unlimited funds. the rules state no more than XXX ci and with unlimited funds you will make the most hp possible. unfortunatly the Turbo cars cant make that power even with all the money in the world, and there is no restriction on how big of a turbo you can go but it can only be one, because the rules are that you have to have only one power adder. so with the biggest turbo an dthe best resourses money can get you. they still make less power . so they are allowed to weigh less to keep things interesting. do u not see my point or do u wanna keep pretending? question for you.. where did I say a Supercharger is "better"?
How is it irrelevant? proof is in the pudding. Pros are sponsered with Unlimited funds. the rules state no more than XXX ci and with unlimited funds you will make the most hp possible. unfortunatly the Turbo cars cant make that power even with all the money in the world, and there is no restriction on how big of a turbo you can go but it can only be one, because the rules are that you have to have only one power adder. so with the biggest turbo an dthe best resourses money can get you. they still make less power . so they are allowed to weigh less to keep things interesting. do u not see my point or do u wanna keep pretending? question for you.. where did I say a Supercharger is "better"?
#22
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Re: (TTWS6)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TTWS6 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">on street cars only. do you know that in the outlaw classes turbo cars are aloowed to weigh less because they make less hp? or did u not know that because you know nothing outside the world of Honda? Im not trying to be condesending but its just a pet peev of mine when ppl try to generalise stuff like this. no flames please.</TD></TR></TABLE>
What race organizations allow does not apply. Racers have to deal with all kinds of rules. Displacement of engines, tire sizes, weights, blah...blah...blah. And why do you attack me and saying I no nothing outside the Honda world. You don't know me. I know plenty outside of Honda....I work in a automotive field where I work with domestics and imports, drag racing to road racing.
You can't argue the facts, a turbo is more effiecient than a supercharger, PERIOD.
When is comes to street cars, people pick turbos, since they get more power per dollar spent.
Some people pick a supercharger since its less complicated and requires less work to install.
What race organizations allow does not apply. Racers have to deal with all kinds of rules. Displacement of engines, tire sizes, weights, blah...blah...blah. And why do you attack me and saying I no nothing outside the Honda world. You don't know me. I know plenty outside of Honda....I work in a automotive field where I work with domestics and imports, drag racing to road racing.
You can't argue the facts, a turbo is more effiecient than a supercharger, PERIOD.
When is comes to street cars, people pick turbos, since they get more power per dollar spent.
Some people pick a supercharger since its less complicated and requires less work to install.
#23
Re: (Marauder)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Marauder »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
You can't argue the facts, a turbo is more effiecient than a supercharger, PERIOD.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
read what I just wrote.. above then draw your own conclsuion. as for me saying you know nothoing outside of Honda, I didnt say that I ASKED if you know nothing outside of Hondas, I am not the one to pick on people or to try to start a flame war. so calm down man have a
You can't argue the facts, a turbo is more effiecient than a supercharger, PERIOD.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
read what I just wrote.. above then draw your own conclsuion. as for me saying you know nothoing outside of Honda, I didnt say that I ASKED if you know nothing outside of Hondas, I am not the one to pick on people or to try to start a flame war. so calm down man have a
#24
Re: (Marauder)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Marauder »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
You can't argue the facts, a turbo is more effiecient than a supercharger, PERIOD.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
read what I just wrote.. above then draw your own conclsuion. as for me saying you know nothoing outside of Honda, I didnt say that I ASKED if you know nothing outside of Hondas, I am not the one to pick on people or to try to start a flame war. so calm down man have a
Modified by TTWS6 at 5:46 PM 7/14/2003
You can't argue the facts, a turbo is more effiecient than a supercharger, PERIOD.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
read what I just wrote.. above then draw your own conclsuion. as for me saying you know nothoing outside of Honda, I didnt say that I ASKED if you know nothing outside of Hondas, I am not the one to pick on people or to try to start a flame war. so calm down man have a
Modified by TTWS6 at 5:46 PM 7/14/2003
#25
Re: (TTWS6)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TTWS6 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
no they wouldnt, first of all you do u even know why those roots makes as much power as they do? secondly. those cars run on Nitromethane which burns RAW. it doesnt turn into exhaust gas. it burns into fire that would crack and exhaust housing after a few runs. PLEASE tell me what turbo they used that was making TOO much power? highest hp turbo car to date made just under 3000hp and it was Two turbos. </TD></TR></TABLE>
actually.. theres diesel turbo motors in ships.. that makes WAY more then 3000 hp .. and on a single turbo...
no they wouldnt, first of all you do u even know why those roots makes as much power as they do? secondly. those cars run on Nitromethane which burns RAW. it doesnt turn into exhaust gas. it burns into fire that would crack and exhaust housing after a few runs. PLEASE tell me what turbo they used that was making TOO much power? highest hp turbo car to date made just under 3000hp and it was Two turbos. </TD></TR></TABLE>
actually.. theres diesel turbo motors in ships.. that makes WAY more then 3000 hp .. and on a single turbo...