what does '' FRM bores need to be sleeved for best results'' mean ???
11-29-2006, 10:38 AM
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what does '' FRM bores need to be sleeved for best results'' mean ???
Well I read this on the WISECO pistons website and I dont know what they mean ?? Its only for a few model of pistons like the one for the K20 ???
http://www.wiseco.com/PDFs/Cat...a.pdf
Maybe someone know what it mean ?
Thanks a lot !
http://www.wiseco.com/PDFs/Cat...a.pdf
Maybe someone know what it mean ?
Thanks a lot !
11-29-2006, 11:13 AM
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Re: (ZacCarter)
some honda motors have a fiber composite type material in their sleeves that takes a special piston. Regular pistons in these cylinders would ruin the cylinders VERY quickly.
11-29-2006, 12:52 PM
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Re: (quicksilver1689)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by quicksilver1689 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">frm= fiber reinforced material.</TD></TR></TABLE>
FRM = Fiber Reinforced Metal, technically.
FRM = Fiber Reinforced Metal, technically.
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11-30-2006, 07:12 AM
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yes, you cannot use a forged piston with the H22/23 and any other motor with the FRM sleeves. there are a bunch of threads on H-T on the matter. search the prelude forum...
11-30-2006, 08:54 AM
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No issues with the mahles here, Blundar actually tuned one of my customers cars with the h22 mahles, it has about 20k on the motor still runs great.
11-30-2006, 12:45 PM
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Re: what does '' FRM bores need to be sleeved for best results'' mean ??? (Muckman)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Muckman »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Why?</TD></TR></TABLE>
because on the Wiseco website there is a mention that the k20 need to be sleeved for best result... just see in the application page. Its a PDF format.
because on the Wiseco website there is a mention that the k20 need to be sleeved for best result... just see in the application page. Its a PDF format.
11-30-2006, 01:23 PM
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Re: what does '' FRM bores need to be sleeved for best results'' mean ??? (RyanEJ8)
The Mahles are specifically made for FRM sleeves. They are actually coated with iron which protects the FRM from the aluminum in the pistons. I believe the stock pistons on an FRM block also have the iron coating. You will get some life out of a normal forged piston on an FRM but they seem to start burning oil within 10,000-15,000 miles.
11-30-2006, 06:02 PM
#18
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Re: what does '' FRM bores need to be sleeved for best results'' mean ??? (Muckman)
2 similar metals rubbing against each other gall them selves... aluminum pistons + aluminum bores = bad
11-30-2006, 07:25 PM
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Re: what does '' FRM bores need to be sleeved for best results'' mean ??? (JDogg)
How do you explain the aluminum Mahle pistons that are supposed to work with FRM bores? I always thought it was the rings that tore up the cylinder walls but I am not sure.
11-30-2006, 07:30 PM
#20
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Re: what does '' FRM bores need to be sleeved for best results'' mean ??? (earl)
from all the torn up h22's i have seen its the pistons.. otherwise just use some stock rings on some forged pistons and let it roll... the wrong rings CAN tear up the cylinder walls though, i have seen people use shitty aftermarket rings on a "stock" rebuild and tear the cylinders up.
the mahle pistons have a graphite coating and do not expand nearly as much as normal forged pistons, they also have a specific shape to them that helps.
the first h22 we tested w/mahle pistons showed zero material transfer from the cylinder wall to the piston.
the mahle pistons have a graphite coating and do not expand nearly as much as normal forged pistons, they also have a specific shape to them that helps.
the first h22 we tested w/mahle pistons showed zero material transfer from the cylinder wall to the piston.
11-30-2006, 08:02 PM
#21
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Re: what does '' FRM bores need to be sleeved for best results'' mean ??? (JDogg)
It is true that Mahle, SRP and SuperTech Pistons are made from a different aluminum compound than all the other forged pistons
11-30-2006, 08:18 PM
#22
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Re: what does '' FRM bores need to be sleeved for best results'' mean ??? (earl)
i dont know about supertech or srp ( i never use either of those), but yeah.. mahle pistons have more silicone in them so they dont have as much expansion. more of an OE thing than an aftermarket thing. OE's are conserned with the pistons being quiet. the alloy, i forget the exact number, is technically weaker than alloy's with less silicone, but i havent seen where it matters.
11-30-2006, 10:06 PM
#23
Re: what does '' FRM bores need to be sleeved for best results'' mean ??? (yellowturbo)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by yellowturbo »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
because on the Wiseco website there is a mention that the k20 need to be sleeved for best result... just see in the application page. Its a PDF format.</TD></TR></TABLE>
You can run them on a k-series no problem, I don't know why wiseco put that **** in their k-series piston catalogue.
because on the Wiseco website there is a mention that the k20 need to be sleeved for best result... just see in the application page. Its a PDF format.</TD></TR></TABLE>
You can run them on a k-series no problem, I don't know why wiseco put that **** in their k-series piston catalogue.
12-01-2006, 06:42 AM
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The mahles do have have a higher silicone content but they have some special patented high silicone alloy that is strong as anything else out there, they use it in the alot in the big boy racing stuff. I'm a Porsche man at heart so i've been using mahles for quite a while w/o any problems.
12-01-2006, 07:30 AM
#25
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Re: (sewell94)
yep, i have a couple of f1 or IRL (not sure which) toyota pistons as well as a couple of nascar pistons that mahle gave me
kick *** paper weights
kick *** paper weights