r1paniccia

hey guys , iam piecing together some of the last parts for my turbo build, iam stuck between CP or WISECO pistons , block is a B16 GE sleeved 84mm, whp goal is 600hp, specs so ar are

b16 ge sleeved (84mm)
turbonetics gt-k700 billet
go-autoworks top mount
supertech valvetrain
crower turbo cam or gsc turbo cams
manley I beam rods
eagle crank
this is going to be a daily driver
i want to hit 600hp and have a little room to grow, i need help deciding my comp ratio 9.0 or 9.7 and either CP or WISECO for the pistons what do you guys prefer for that amount of HP? i thought i read somewhere the wisecos were made of a better material, however it seems like most high HP hondas run CP pistons, ive seen a few places alot of people seem to crack the WISECOS, as fasr as what fuel i can go either 93oct or E85 my tuner does both, but i beleave he prefers e85, any help is appreciated

boosted_D

iTrader: (1)

This is all really personal preference.

Both wiseco and CP pistons are good quality, they also both are low silicone content which makes them stronger for high HP, but also make them noisey.

Something like a JE piston with a bit higher silicone content will be quieter, but not quite as tough for that kind of power IMO.

As far as C/R goes, you could do either really.

What turbo are you using, it will have to be pretty damn big for those power #'s, and the higher C/R will help spool the turbo faster, so that would be my personal choice.

And FYI your not making 600 hp on 93 pump, on E85 with massive injectors and fuel pump set up or race fuel yes, pump gas NO.

kyden

i prefer cp over wiseco. if you're going with wisecos, definitely get the upgraded pins.

r1paniccia

turbonetics gt-k700 billet ,id 1000's and aeromotive stealth 340lph pump, mite also need an inline still doing research

0mtber

iTrader: (2)

Look into building a GSR or LS bottom end instead.
Look into your cam selection a little more.
E85 will be ideal for your 600 hp goal but it will require 2 bosch 044 pumps with id1000cc injectors.

All of the answers you are looking for are on the forum :-)

boosted_D

iTrader: (1)

Do you already have that turbo?

I dont know if turbonetics publishes cfm rates, but do you know what it flows?

At $1600 if you dont already have it I would look at other turbo options IMO. If you have it alreay it will be fine.

If not, contact The Sodan on this board and talk to him about turbo choices, I think his Reaper turbo would be a prime choice for this set up if you could get one.

And on your fuel system.... You will def. need E85 or race fuel to make those power #'s, and you will also need more fuel pump that a 340 IMO.

You could add an inline to the 340, or go with a full blown double hanger system.

And ID1000's will get you to 600 whp on race gas, but not on E85, you will need 1600's most likely.

E85 with the injectors you have and the pump you have should be good for 500-550 whp, but when you get up into 600+ you really have to step up your stuff, you dont want failure with that kind of set up.

Edit: I just read this is going to be a daily driver?

Are you planning a street tune thats in the 400's whp for the street and a race tune to 600+?

600+ whp in a street car is absolutly crazy...

ohsnapzafingcu

iTrader: (2)

i'll second all the info posted by others, my buddy ran CP's in his for years on his daily driven vehicle putting down about 400~. then he built the head and bought a larger turbo and cruised town with about 6-700 hp for another year, we pulled the motor out and everything looked great still. during the switch from pump to e85 there were a lot of tuning hiccups that somehow didn't demolish the motor, when he snapped his timing belt and we pulled the pistons they all looked great still.

Charlie Moua

iTrader: (3)

agreed...
Just wanted to note that I have seen some local guys make over 600whp with just walbro 400 & dw300.

Also higer cr (say 9.1 vs 11.1) doesn't "spool" a turbo faster... I've yet to come across anything indicating so.... maybe i'm wrong.

OneBadTurboCRV

Actually, "boosted d" couldn't be more wrong on most of the information posted.

CP and JE pistons are 2618 forgings, while Wisecos are a 4032 forging.

IT is SILICON and NOT silicone...

CP is louder than JE, and JEs are twice as loud as Wisecos all clearanced for the same horsepower.

Wisecos can easily support 600whp...

ID1000 can easily be "made larger" by turning up the fuel pressure. They can be made to about 1400-1600cc injectors this way.

You don't want a failure with ANY setup.

Increased compression does NOT help spool, stop spreading that BS.

You can to make 600hp on pump gas.

blackeg

lol silicone is like pam anderson

ill second that cp's are loud.

id personally go for something around 10:1 compression, it will feel good out of boost

r1paniccia

i did consider this however iam one to try to keep things as simple as possible i know alot of guys run these combos and i would go with one of them, it just seems like a big hassle imo, i am probably wrong i dont know if iam a fan of drilling the head or block and having the oil line routed. i would all most prefer to use the same head/block combo that have been mated together. i would like to have a high hp b16 underdog. but i still mayconsider it. is there really that much of a difrence in power? i thought the whole LS VTEC thing was fasding out

OneBadTurboCRV

Who said anything about a LS/VTEC? He said GSR OR LS bottom end...

There would be a major difference in torque...

kyden

my cp's are quiet, even at .0045 ptw. they slap for about maybe 2 seconds on a cold start.

r1paniccia

well LS is non vtec, my head is Vtec that would be LS Vtec when you combine the two together right? or am i not understanding what he said

kyden

you don't have to drill anything. you just tap a hole that is already there.

the extra torque makes for way better street driving.

Critikul

When they say "bottom end" they dont mean block. They are reffering to crank and rods. You can drop an LS or GSR crank right into your b16 block and get more torque (and displacement) than you would with a b16 crank.

Ls/vtec is when you use an LS block and internals coupled with a vtec head. If you put an LS crank in a b16 block you would not call that an ls/vtec.

LightningTeg

E85 ok, 93 would need meth or the like.

kyden

no, you cannot put an ls or gsr crank in a b16a without custom rods.

OneBadTurboCRV

I never said HOW you could do it, just that you could...

LightningTeg

I figured you were being a smartass

Critikul

When did I ever say anything about rods? All I said is that a bottom end consists of crank and rods. Never did I say you could put a LS or GSR bottom end in a b16a..just crank.

But Im sure that would probably end up being way more of a hassle than it would even be worth.

And I didn't know that, but it makes sense since b16s have such a shorter stroke and deck height. Thanks for the correction! And sorry for the false info OP.

r1paniccia

exactly what would this entail as far as what parts from my b16 and what parts would i combine from a b18? is it really that beneficial? i would consider this as i havenot yet ordered any of my internals which will be CP pistons and manley I beam turbo rods, and either a eagle or crower crank

OneBadTurboCRV

To put a GSR crank into a B16:

B16 crank: 3.047/2= 1.523
B16 rods: 134/25.4= 5.276
Added together = 6.799
Subtract GSR crank 3.433/2= 1.717
Total new rod length = 5.082" rodwhich gives you a R/S ratio of 1.48

If you're going to run a GSR or a LS crank in a B16 block, run GSR or LS rods and a custom piston. Custom pistons from CP are about $100 more than a shelf stock piece, and take anywhere from 3 days to a week extra to make. Custom rods from Eagle are around $400 or double the price of a shelf stock rod, and take anywhere from 4-6 weeks extra to make. Either way a custom piston is much more desirable because you can better control compression ratio. If you called CP I am sure they still have a few designs on file...

BUT if you run the GSR crank in a B16 block, you can use B17A-length rods along with the off-the-shelf pistons made for 95mm stroker motors. In my opinion it's not worth building a stroker B16 unless you just happen to have a sleeved B16 block laying around, or really want to. There are some advantages to a stroker B16 as indicated at the top of the post. I would be very interested in seeing a dyno chart for a boosted one as well.

Ahh, now you are bringing back some memories of the late '90s/early 2000's...

Charlie Moua

iTrader: (3)

he didn't remind me of it, you did... lol

kyden

and what rods are you supposed to use with it? b16? that would cause your pistons to stick out of the hole (by a lot). giving out wrong info is worse than not giving out any info at all.