Nextelbuddy

well i went to batlground performance just to do some dyno pulls today for 30 bux and both runs yielded 360HP even @ 24 psi.

when we sparyed the intercooler with some nitrous something went wrong and the car only snatched 325 hp at the same 24 psi and it broke up real bad. heres the dyno graph. i dont know what to do i am so pissed. i have no idea what is going on here and dont know what to do.

this graph is weird it shows on the first run that i made 360 hp and 301 tq @ 24 psi
and on teh 2nd run i only made 326 hp and 311 TQ and that was with the NOS sprayed onto the intercooler. (also this run the engine broke up rel bad almost like my spark plugs were geting blown out by the boost.

also the guy that was using the dyno told me that my clutch was slipping bad but i didnt smell any clutch at all and other people watching said that saw the wheels were spinning on the dyno and i think i saw it too.

why would my TQ be higher now than befiore on a dynapack?

i dont know tell me what you guys think

Mase

Im guessing u didnt have any AFR charts along w/ these dyno pulls?


its hard to say why ur tq readings are different, i personally havent used dynos besides dyno dynamics and dynojets....

your torque drops off pretty quickly, and for 24 psi on a large turbo like that...something doesnt add up....

B18C1CYA

a buddy of mine ran one of thoses entercooler nx spraybar things, well when he would use he would run lean, iam guessing for him it made the air so dense that it changed the a/f ratio, just my .02

alpha

What do the plugs look like? A/F with the sheet or no?

Nextelbuddy

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C1CYA &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">a buddy of mine ran one of thoses entercooler nx spraybar things, well when he would use he would run lean, iam guessing for him it made the air so dense that it changed the a/f ratio, just my .02</TD></TR></TABLE>

yea thats what the guy at batlground said. he said that using the NOS on teh intercooler made the air too dense and probably made the car go lean up top and i lost power.

i think i am giong back to my original tuner ed at balanced performance to see what he can do.

if i could get a copy of my BIN file woudl any body be willing to look at it and tell me if they see anything funny or weird?

scttydb411

shawn, the dynapak and dynojet will give you different readings. since ed tuned it at balanced the very first time before you did the "beast" buildup; i would go back to that dyno and then have ed tune it.

-or-

see if you can just tune it at batlground. i don't think you did those runs with the wideband, and if you did they just stick the sniffer/sensor in the tailpipe anyway.

go back to balanced and then let us know.

Nextelbuddy

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by scttydb411 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">shawn, the dynapak and dynojet will give you different readings. since ed tuned it at balanced the very first time before you did the "beast" buildup; i would go back to that dyno and then have ed tune it.

-or-

see if you can just tune it at batlground. i don't think you did those runs with the wideband, and if you did they just stick the sniffer/sensor in the tailpipe anyway.

go back to balanced and then let us know.</TD></TR></TABLE>

yea but i didnt think that the dyno jet would read 55 less HP than a dyno pack.....

yea they had that sniffer wideband stuff. they asked me if i wanted to use it but i said no. i guess i should have said yea.

also i am already runnign one step colder plugs butthe gy at batlground said that i need to go one step colder than that because my spark is getign blown out by boost or something liek that.

i am running the 7 series ngks. what is one step colder than that and where can i find it?

Mase

7's are fine up to 400 whp. if you are getting misfire and its not because its going lean or detonating (due to too much ign advance) you can try to lessen the gap size on the plug.

B18C1CYA

what about after 400 then what would you recomend?

Nextelbuddy

hey i just pulled off my intercooler piping and found a lot of exhaust soot like the kind that u get onteh bumper of your car when runnign rich.

and then i noticed that im not runnign a dump tube right now and the wastegate is shooting exhaust right in front of the turbo compressor inlet.
i think the turbo is sucking in a lot of the exhaust from teh wastegate when it opens.... i am going to get this fixed ASAP anyways but would this affect preformance or lower dyno numbers since the turbo is not getting clean air to send to my motor?

oh yea one more thing hers a pic of my sprak plug.. every one of them looks just liek this no difference between them.

B18C1CYA

i would think that the exhaust getting sucked back in would cause some sort of problem, not shure what thow

BoostedSi

why does your sig say 414hp?? did you get it redynoed?

1316130057

Lets take a look....compressor (needs coldest air possible) which usually sucks in about 70ºF of air is now either partially or fully sucking in ~1500ºF of air. That would definitely be a major problem. Depending on the size of the turbo and how much toxic waste you were recycling, you have at least another 100hp hiding in there.

I just don't understand why so many people are so hardcore about having their externals dump atmospheric. There's much better ways to utilize/dump all that hot gas.

SEFIxCivic

i doubt that's the problem since most of the time people dyno with their hood opened and a large fan.

at this point i would seriously look into doing some engine diagnostics like a leak down or compression test.

B18C1CYA

i dont think that would matter have you ever seen how much suction a turbo will have when its pushing 24psi

Nextelbuddy

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18C1CYA &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i dont think that would matter have you ever seen how much suction a turbo will have when its pushing 24psi</TD></TR></TABLE>

so are you agreeing with me about the turbo sucking in exhausrt from teh wastegate? or are you agreeign with the guy above sayin "no that wont affect it?"

heres a pic of how close my wastegate is in relation to the turbo inlet and you tell me what yo think?

1316130057

That is a definite problem. Your turbo gets aie by sucking it in. unless you have a closed pipe that feeds it rather than the atmospheric feed, you're always going to be sucking in some of that hot air, not to mention the hot air under your hood. As close as that is and pointing directly at it, that is without a doubt a big problem.

B18C1CYA

o no iam agreeing with you , if the sooty **** was in the ic pipe then it pulled it in plane and simple, i was just proving the point that if the hood was open or what ever it would still have pulled it in because of the suction force that a turbo would make at your psi level

GT61 this 1.8t

ok lets see...
when your Dyna pack dyno was displayed it clearly says Fly wheel HP.
now it has a WHP option...
go back to the dyna pack and request the whp chart...
numbers seem to add up to me once you make the typical 12-15% drive train loss associated to whp readings vs. fly wheel readings.
the dyna pack takes into consideration all the BS and **** requiered to calclat your fly wheel hp.

B18C1CYA

but that dose not explain why it was breaking up and not running right

Nextelbuddy

yes i can not figure out why when we sprayed the intercooler with a **** load of NOS ( unleashed half a bottle on it) that it broke up at higher RPMS and then only snagged 326...

any ideas?

GT61 this 1.8t

im not worried about the botched 325whp issue... there is def an issue with that pull...
im comparing the 360 to the 414...
the 360 was a clean pass according to the original post

GT61 this 1.8t

now after doing the math for ya i got 364.32whp based ont he dyna pack numbers...
so there is no doubt your car only makes 360-370whp.
now the 325 pull ... im trying to think what would cause that type off issue...
how was your a/f?
any detonation? what timing settings?
what type of gas?
im not sure if this was stated in the post... ill edit it once i read every post if they were mentioned.
did you have the gap wrong?
check all your plug gaps.
i usually run a champion resistorless heat range 8 race plug when on the dyno tuning for race fuel... gab set to .030 or 0.029... but im a vw guy just trying to help.
thats what i run at the track.

SEFIxCivic

that wastegate setup isn't optimal, but theres plenty of people who run similar setups with the drag/rev hard manifold without a dump tube, and they don't have that problem.

he's missing about 150 whp... that's a whole lot of exhaust you must be sucking up from the wategate exit... come to think of it... that really has little effect... my friends have dynoed with open exhaust and 8-9 inches of downpipe dumping into the engine bay... and they didn't have this problem.

Mase

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1316130057 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Depending on the size of the turbo and how much toxic waste you were recycling, you have at least another 100hp hiding in there.
</TD></TR></TABLE>


I hope you're seriously kidding.

anyways, about the nitrous spraying its hard to tell without a AFR chart or a datalog of your intake air temps. but for some reason, i doubt that it would have made that much of a difference to make it cut out.