Turbo is up and running have some basic questions. A/F, fuel pressure type stuff
10-22-2004, 12:59 PM
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Turbo is up and running have some basic questions. A/F, fuel pressure type stuff
First off I'm running a stock B16A2 in an EM1. Timing is at 16* on stock NGK plugs and some NGK wires. My setup consists of Walbro 255 pump, AEM FPR, stock injectors for now (have some RC 550's sitting here), Tial wastegate with a .5 BAR spring in it, 2.5" downpipe, 2.5" flex pipe, carsound high flow cat, 2.5" pipe going straight out the back without a muffler. The turbo is a master power or master turbo 57 trim T3/T04 with Garrett internals.
I installed my M-500 wideband today. When sitting idle the A/F will jump anywhere from 14.8 to 15.1. To my knowledge that's not too shabby. My fuel pressures are running 46-47 with the vacuum off and about 36-37 with the vacuum on. I looked at the Helms and it said that those are on the high side of acceptable. Now to the questions.
When I'm driving along and for example I'm going down a hill I always used the engine to slow me down a bit. Well, now with this M-500 I keep getting "LEAN" flashed at me. I didn't have the wideband when I was still NA so I don't know if that's a normal thing or not. Is it? When the car's moving and in gear and you let off the throttle is an A/F supposed to go lean?
Next question. Getting into boost when just starting off nice and easy the A/F will dip down to the 12's. I'm assuming that's good. Maybe a little rich, but no harm done I guess. When the engine revs get up to about 4.5-5K's the A/F will rock up to about 16.5 with boost being around 6 psi (hard to keep track of all these damn gauges and stuff when driving). Just a guesstimate, what SHOULD a good A/F look like with that kind of boost? Actually, what's a SAFE A/F to be at when boosting? I read countless times that 14.7 was the magic number to hit.
Anyway, sorry about the n00bish questions but I'd appreciate any help or pointer you guys could give me on this.
I searched for answers to these and DAYUM there's a lot of stuff out there, just not really anything that applies to my setup. Lots of FMU type fuel setups.
I installed my M-500 wideband today. When sitting idle the A/F will jump anywhere from 14.8 to 15.1. To my knowledge that's not too shabby. My fuel pressures are running 46-47 with the vacuum off and about 36-37 with the vacuum on. I looked at the Helms and it said that those are on the high side of acceptable. Now to the questions.
When I'm driving along and for example I'm going down a hill I always used the engine to slow me down a bit. Well, now with this M-500 I keep getting "LEAN" flashed at me. I didn't have the wideband when I was still NA so I don't know if that's a normal thing or not. Is it? When the car's moving and in gear and you let off the throttle is an A/F supposed to go lean?
Next question. Getting into boost when just starting off nice and easy the A/F will dip down to the 12's. I'm assuming that's good. Maybe a little rich, but no harm done I guess. When the engine revs get up to about 4.5-5K's the A/F will rock up to about 16.5 with boost being around 6 psi (hard to keep track of all these damn gauges and stuff when driving). Just a guesstimate, what SHOULD a good A/F look like with that kind of boost? Actually, what's a SAFE A/F to be at when boosting? I read countless times that 14.7 was the magic number to hit.
Anyway, sorry about the n00bish questions but I'd appreciate any help or pointer you guys could give me on this.
I searched for answers to these and DAYUM there's a lot of stuff out there, just not really anything that applies to my setup. Lots of FMU type fuel setups.
10-22-2004, 04:56 PM
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Re: Turbo is up and running have some basic questions. A/F, fuel pressure type stuff (IslandSi)
Quick little bump for all of you boost heads that might have just gotten off work. 
10-22-2004, 05:51 PM
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Re: Turbo is up and running have some basic questions. A/F, fuel pressure type stuff (IslandSi)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by IslandSi »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">First off I'm running a stock B16A2 in an EM1. Timing is at 16* on stock NGK plugs and some NGK wires. My setup consists of Walbro 255 pump, AEM FPR, stock injectors for now (have some RC 550's sitting here), Tial wastegate with a .5 BAR spring in it, 2.5" downpipe, 2.5" flex pipe, carsound high flow cat, 2.5" pipe going straight out the back without a muffler. The turbo is a master power or master turbo 57 trim T3/T04 with Garrett internals.
I installed my M-500 wideband today. When sitting idle the A/F will jump anywhere from 14.8 to 15.1. To my knowledge that's not too shabby. My fuel pressures are running 46-47 with the vacuum off and about 36-37 with the vacuum on. I looked at the Helms and it said that those are on the high side of acceptable. Now to the questions.
When I'm driving along and for example I'm going down a hill I always used the engine to slow me down a bit. Well, now with this M-500 I keep getting "LEAN" flashed at me. I didn't have the wideband when I was still NA so I don't know if that's a normal thing or not. Is it? When the car's moving and in gear and you let off the throttle is an A/F supposed to go lean?
Next question. Getting into boost when just starting off nice and easy the A/F will dip down to the 12's. I'm assuming that's good. Maybe a little rich, but no harm done I guess. When the engine revs get up to about 4.5-5K's the A/F will rock up to about 16.5 with boost being around 6 psi (hard to keep track of all these damn gauges and stuff when driving). Just a guesstimate, what SHOULD a good A/F look like with that kind of boost? Actually, what's a SAFE A/F to be at when boosting? I read countless times that 14.7 was the magic number to hit.
Anyway, sorry about the n00bish questions but I'd appreciate any help or pointer you guys could give me on this.
I searched for answers to these and DAYUM there's a lot of stuff out there, just not really anything that applies to my setup. Lots of FMU type fuel setups.</TD></TR></TABLE>
A/F is supposed to go extremely lean when you let off the gas while in gear. What fuel management are you using, Hondata? Uberdata?...
With uberdata, alot of guy tune for 15:1 for the first 3 columns, 14:1 for the next 3 columns, 13:1 for the next 2 columns, 12.5:1 for the two transition columns, and 12:1 in boost. Stock honda map in closed loop is aiming at 14.7 afr.
I installed my M-500 wideband today. When sitting idle the A/F will jump anywhere from 14.8 to 15.1. To my knowledge that's not too shabby. My fuel pressures are running 46-47 with the vacuum off and about 36-37 with the vacuum on. I looked at the Helms and it said that those are on the high side of acceptable. Now to the questions.
When I'm driving along and for example I'm going down a hill I always used the engine to slow me down a bit. Well, now with this M-500 I keep getting "LEAN" flashed at me. I didn't have the wideband when I was still NA so I don't know if that's a normal thing or not. Is it? When the car's moving and in gear and you let off the throttle is an A/F supposed to go lean?
Next question. Getting into boost when just starting off nice and easy the A/F will dip down to the 12's. I'm assuming that's good. Maybe a little rich, but no harm done I guess. When the engine revs get up to about 4.5-5K's the A/F will rock up to about 16.5 with boost being around 6 psi (hard to keep track of all these damn gauges and stuff when driving). Just a guesstimate, what SHOULD a good A/F look like with that kind of boost? Actually, what's a SAFE A/F to be at when boosting? I read countless times that 14.7 was the magic number to hit.
Anyway, sorry about the n00bish questions but I'd appreciate any help or pointer you guys could give me on this.
I searched for answers to these and DAYUM there's a lot of stuff out there, just not really anything that applies to my setup. Lots of FMU type fuel setups.</TD></TR></TABLE>
A/F is supposed to go extremely lean when you let off the gas while in gear. What fuel management are you using, Hondata? Uberdata?...
With uberdata, alot of guy tune for 15:1 for the first 3 columns, 14:1 for the next 3 columns, 13:1 for the next 2 columns, 12.5:1 for the two transition columns, and 12:1 in boost. Stock honda map in closed loop is aiming at 14.7 afr.
10-22-2004, 07:27 PM
#5
Re: Turbo is up and running have some basic questions. A/F, fuel pressure type stuff (IslandSi)
A/F should be around 12/12.5 in boost.
Idle should be 14.7, and get lower as you go across your fuel map.
Seriously, don't drive your car anymore until you get it tuned right, you are detonating like mad for sure.
-Brett
Idle should be 14.7, and get lower as you go across your fuel map.
Seriously, don't drive your car anymore until you get it tuned right, you are detonating like mad for sure.
-Brett
10-23-2004, 04:56 AM
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Well, after reading this and talking to "Arturbo" I decided to drop the 550's in and see what she does. If it doesn't get any better it's time to pump up the bicicle tires. 
Right now I'm not running any fuel management.
on me, I know. I should have enough cash to get me an AEM EMS in a couple weeks. Until then the Si is just going to have to be a big *** blue paperweight.
Thanks for all the good info guys. Well, except tegunderpressure. That's what I'm trying NOT do have to do. Hence the questions.
Right now I'm not running any fuel management.
on me, I know. I should have enough cash to get me an AEM EMS in a couple weeks. Until then the Si is just going to have to be a big *** blue paperweight.Thanks for all the good info guys. Well, except tegunderpressure. That's what I'm trying NOT do have to do. Hence the questions.
10-23-2004, 08:36 AM
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Well, I TRIED to put the 550's in. Had everything hooked up, injectors were in, fuel rail was bolted up again, I go to plug in the electrical.......WTF, it doesn't fit!!!! The plugs on the injectors are too damn small. Guess I have to get myself some adapter clips or something now. So back in the stock injectors went.
Anyway, I took the fuel pressure up another 4psi. Idles just fine. Idle A/F is in the 14's. Getting going in 1st the A/F stayed in the 14's. Got on it a little bit with boost going up to about 4psi at 3K or so with the fuel pressure at around 65psi and the A/F dipped down to around 12. I don't know if it's just me but that seems pretty safe.
I don't take the car off base at all. It's mainly for driving around base right now 'till I get back to the states. So she rarely sees anything above 30 MPH. Really easy to stay out of boost that way. I picked me up some new inner tubes for the bike anyway. Time to lose some weight and save an engine.
BTW, anybody know where I can get some of those injector clips from?
Anyway, I took the fuel pressure up another 4psi. Idles just fine. Idle A/F is in the 14's. Getting going in 1st the A/F stayed in the 14's. Got on it a little bit with boost going up to about 4psi at 3K or so with the fuel pressure at around 65psi and the A/F dipped down to around 12. I don't know if it's just me but that seems pretty safe.
I don't take the car off base at all. It's mainly for driving around base right now 'till I get back to the states. So she rarely sees anything above 30 MPH. Really easy to stay out of boost that way. I picked me up some new inner tubes for the bike anyway. Time to lose some weight and save an engine.
BTW, anybody know where I can get some of those injector clips from?
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10-23-2004, 08:46 AM
#8
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Re: (IslandSi)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by IslandSi »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well, I TRIED to put the 550's in. Had everything hooked up, injectors were in, fuel rail was bolted up again, I go to plug in the electrical.......WTF, it doesn't fit!!!! The plugs on the injectors are too damn small. Guess I have to get myself some adapter clips or something now. So back in the stock injectors went.</TD></TR></TABLE>
You need OBD-1 Civic/Integra injector clips or go to your local auto parts place and see if you can locate some GM injector clips, I found them for like $4/ea. at Discount Auto Parts. If you go with the OBD-I H/A ones, you need to file down a little tab that sticks out inside them between the two leads, you'll see what I mean when you go to put them on.
You need OBD-1 Civic/Integra injector clips or go to your local auto parts place and see if you can locate some GM injector clips, I found them for like $4/ea. at Discount Auto Parts. If you go with the OBD-I H/A ones, you need to file down a little tab that sticks out inside them between the two leads, you'll see what I mean when you go to put them on.
10-23-2004, 10:08 AM
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Re: (VTC_CiViC)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by VTC_CiViC »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You need OBD-1 Civic/Integra injector clips or go to your local auto parts place and see if you can locate some GM injector clips, I found them for like $4/ea. at Discount Auto Parts. If you go with the OBD-I H/A ones, you need to file down a little tab that sticks out inside them between the two leads, you'll see what I mean when you go to put them on.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Thank you. My nearest Advance Auto or Napa is about 2200 miles to the west of here so no go there. But I guess I can scavenge some up at the local junkyard. They should have some older hondas laying around there. Come to think of it, over by the auto hobby shop there was a junker Dodge minivan sitting over there. If I would have known this earlier I would have just gone and checked that. Oh well. You live and learn.
Thanks for the info.
</TD></TR></TABLE>Thank you. My nearest Advance Auto or Napa is about 2200 miles to the west of here so no go there. But I guess I can scavenge some up at the local junkyard. They should have some older hondas laying around there. Come to think of it, over by the auto hobby shop there was a junker Dodge minivan sitting over there. If I would have known this earlier I would have just gone and checked that. Oh well. You live and learn.
Thanks for the info.
10-23-2004, 10:29 AM
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Re: (IslandSi)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by IslandSi »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thanks for all the good info guys. Well, except tegunderpressure. That's what I'm trying NOT do have to do. Hence the questions.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Haha, Im telling you the facts man. Masterpower turbo's suck. A local shop bolted one up, rolled it on their dyno, and the seals didnt even last a minute. Dont listen to me though, but when that thing goes, youre up ***** creek. Have fun.
Haha, Im telling you the facts man. Masterpower turbo's suck. A local shop bolted one up, rolled it on their dyno, and the seals didnt even last a minute. Dont listen to me though, but when that thing goes, youre up ***** creek. Have fun.
10-23-2004, 11:46 AM
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Re: (tegunderpressure)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tegunderpressure »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Haha, Im telling you the facts man. Masterpower turbo's suck. A local shop bolted one up, rolled it on their dyno, and the seals didnt even last a minute. Dont listen to me though, but when that thing goes, youre up ***** creek. Have fun.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I've looked into them too. Do a search on here for them. Basically there are 2 versions of them. One from Brazil and then there's one from Taiwan or some other place. The ones from Brazil are built like a brick. The others are the ones that are known to be ****. What that shop had was probably one of the shitty ones. The one I have runs all Garrett internals. Just the housings are stamped with Master Power. Look into it.
I've looked into them too. Do a search on here for them. Basically there are 2 versions of them. One from Brazil and then there's one from Taiwan or some other place. The ones from Brazil are built like a brick. The others are the ones that are known to be ****. What that shop had was probably one of the shitty ones. The one I have runs all Garrett internals. Just the housings are stamped with Master Power. Look into it.
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