NonovUrbizniz

Hello all....

Longtime member first time booster...

I took a year off working on the car but now feel like finally biting the bullet and turboing the civic...

Background:

1993 Civic EX
D16Z6 with 260k
ARP Headstuds
Cometic HG
Comp Cams 59300
CC Titanium retainers
CC Valve Springs
Y8 Intake manifold
Fidanza LW FW
Exedy Clutch
Rear Disk with 40/40 prop valve and 15/16th Master
Koni/GC's
Full ES Bushings
I/H/C/E

Already Have:

New Garrett TB0335(T3 series turbo)
Porsche 944 intercooler
Misc. Intercooler Piping
Prelude/type R front brakes All Set to go on once I shave down the brackets (has anyone ever figured out if honda makes a caliper mount bracket with the correct offset so you can just bolt it up?)

Planned Purchases

Hondata s300
Forge BOV (getting it dirt cheap through a friend)

NOW for my questions... I've spent basically nothing so far... the turbo was 250 and I'll prob pay retail for the hondata... all the tubing and the intercooler were free...

So I'm left in need of:

Turbo Manifold
Injectors
Wastegate (probobly just going to stick with the internal wastgate for now)
Downpipe
Fuel Pump
Misc. Plumbing

For the injectors I haven't decided whether to get used but balanced DSM 440's or to get new RC's or the like... prob. used as I like the idea of junkyarding as much as possible (I used to work in one and thats where I got most of the free parts (given to me by the owner)).

Now for the manifold I know I can do the HF manifold with an adaptor OR I can spend some loot on a SS tubular one... I'm just curious as to which ones are reputable brands where I can retain P/S and A/C. and about what I can expect to pay... I see tons of them on EBAY for next to nothing but I'd just like to know they're even worth the money (which I doubt)...

So any suggestions on manifolds would be greatly appreciatted...

Also what are people doing for downpipes? I mean I guess w/o buying a manifold and downpipe at the same time when the manufacturer knows what turbo you're using then You'll essentially have to have a custom one done.. .is this correct... I mean I'm getting a garret T3 so it shouldn't be that hard to find a manifold/downpipe combo for my car with that turbo right?

Also if there is anything I'm not thinking about that'd be good to know...

My goals are really wide open... I'd like to get it running on 5-8lbs of boost and go from there...

Also about what power range do rods start becoming an issue?

I know there used to be a guy on here selling a combo of some foreign toyota pistons machined to fit B16 rods...

But I'm really looking to avoid building the bottom end for now at least...

Any input welcome.

zcrx2006

you can prolly get away with 10lbs on a stock z6 but thats with awesome tuning.... and with 260k i would jus freshen it up a little bit it might not last too too long...... as for manifolds/dp look at spoolin performance or the FI mclassifieds on here

NonovUrbizniz

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by zcrx2006 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">you can prolly get away with 10lbs on a stock z6 but thats with awesome tuning.... and with 260k i would jus freshen it up a little bit it might not last too too long...... as for manifolds/dp look at spoolin performance or the FI mclassifieds on here </TD></TR></TABLE>

Thanks.

I've been in contact with Spoolin for a log mani/dp combo I think I"m going to go with that...

Has anyone here gone from an HF manifold with adaptor to the Spoolin log style mani?

Is it a HUGE difference? I'm not completely opposed to spending a fair amount of money... but HF/Adaptor will prob cost me in the neighborhood of 100 bucks at most the say another 100 or so for a DP solution... is the Spoolin worth the almost 400 dollar difference?

Keep in mind I've got 260k on the motor (it runs strong as hell though and I just recently had the head off and everything looked fine.)

To put it another way... if you had to choose between a nice manifold like the spoolin on the stock bottom end or the HF on a decent rod/piston combo like LS/Vitara or B16/Toyota.

I don't mind rebuilding the bottom end but I'm not going to get an expensive manifold AND rebuild the bottom end since I'm gunna spend decent money on the management.

Or would you guys suggest just socketing my stock ECU and running chrom or uberdata then building the bottom end and getting the manifold?

My natural cheapness leans me towards just going full on "ghetto" on everything (socketing the ECU, using a HF manifold and not building the bottom end) but I'm also getting tired of constantly working on what I've already worked on because I bought cheapish parts.

And I CERTAINLY don't want to blow my motor mainly becuase of all the money I just spent on the cam/retainer/springs.

Any input welcome...

zcrx2006

just take your time build the bottom end , get a get ems like crome or w/e and do it right the first time. dont go cheap bro

NonovUrbizniz

Anyone gunna chime in for the junkyard route?

lol... I'm prob. heading in that direction... I can afford to do it right but it's a 93 honda civic... I can't justify spending 3-4k on a car that isn't even worth that much on it's own.

Here's My new thoughts....

200 - Socket ECU run Chrome or the like
40-80 - HF manifold with adapter plate
50-100 - Downpipe
50-100 - DSM injectors
150 - Fuel Pump
100 - Misc plumbing

Thats like 730 on the high end and I'm done...

Old thoughts

600-700 - Hondata
500-600 - Spoolin Log/DP
200-300 - New Injectors
150 - Fuel Pump
100 - Misc plumbing
500-1000 - Bottom end

that's 2k on the CHEAP end.... the ONLY justification I could come up with for doing it the "right" way is that at least I'll have parts to sell if the motor blows... but frankly same goes for the JYT setup... just less value obviously.

I don't know I gotta do some thinking....

Anyone with opinions suggestions on cheaper than I'm expecting bottom ends feel free to comment.

HiProfile

I'm assuming you don't have AC, as you're already looking at the HF+adapter.

One thing you may be interested in would be a 'sinktrap' topmount manifold. If you know anyone that can weld, all you need is 4 sch10 elbows, a foot or two of pipe, and metal bars (bracing). You can adapt it to your NA header (hopefully its not a cheap one, and is a 4-2-1), and run it as a topmount.

I have a T3 on my EX in this way, except its running a stock DX mani (to test it out), has all stock A/C parts, no PS, full 3" DP, and stock radiator fan. With a stock cat/ehxuast I made 160whp at just 6psi, and its at 8.1:1 CR.

In other words, on low boost I made the power of a bolt-on GSR for a fraction of the price. With a built head & cam you're set to max that turbo at 275whp easily, but you should really built the block for 200+. I'm sure you'll be able to hit 200whp at &gt;7psi on that turbo, and it will feel like a V6.

NonovUrbizniz

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by HiProfile &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm assuming you don't have AC, as you're already looking at the HF+adapter.

One thing you may be interested in would be a 'sinktrap' topmount manifold. If you know anyone that can weld, all you need is 4 sch10 elbows, a foot or two of pipe, and metal bars (bracing). You can adapt it to your NA header (hopefully its not a cheap one, and is a 4-2-1), and run it as a topmount.

I have a T3 on my EX in this way, except its running a stock DX mani (to test it out), has all stock A/C parts, no PS, full 3" DP, and stock radiator fan. With a stock cat/ehxuast I made 160whp at just 6psi, and its at 8.1:1 CR.

In other words, on low boost I made the power of a bolt-on GSR for a fraction of the price. With a built head & cam you're set to max that turbo at 275whp easily, but you should really built the block for 200+. I'm sure you'll be able to hit 200whp at &gt;7psi on that turbo, and it will feel like a V6.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thanks for the reply.

I actually do have A/C and sort of want to retain it... so the HF manifold is not usable with A/C?

Where is the interferance between the HF and the A/C? the condensor or the compressor?

I currently have a chikara 4-2-1 header it's pretty cheap lol.

I don't really mind deleting the A/C but I'd def. prefer to keep it.

What's the DX manifold? same as HF or ?.

NonovUrbizniz

Well thanks to the honda-tech community I'm pretty sure I'm going to go cheap enough for me AND get good quality parts....

Should have the following payed for by monday:

- Cleaned DSM Injectors with resistor box/clips
- Boost Guage
- Turbo Plumbing
- Spoolin Log Manifold
- Spoolin DP

All for ~520 shipped.

NonovUrbizniz

Well thanks to my boss' I'm not so concerned with the costs anymore... I'm going to do it right the first time for once.

Look for my build thread prob. coming in late jan - feb.

NonovUrbizniz

NonovUrbizniz

blocks going out in a couple weeks to get rebuilt from the bottom up. BUT I have the flwg q's:

1. I'm not sleeving for now... should I have the guy post the cylinders? he'd do it no problem... just curious if it's ever been hashed out how valuable it is or not... I see threads on here with stock sleeves holding REDICULOUS power... way more than I'm thinking of... is it luck of the draw or what?

2. What Valve guides are people using? Stock or aftermarket?

3. Anyone have experience with hi-temp coating the combustion chamber and exhaust ports? I'm seriously thinking about doing this... along with a mild port/polish. The corky bell book speaks pretty highly about the hi-temp coating the exhaust ports... I'll probobly have the exhaust turbine done and DEFINATLY the manifold/dp

4. What bearings ACL or Stock or it's all a matter of preference... also how do you go about ordering the bearings prior to checking everything? Don't you have to plastiguage the new rods on the crank to get what size you need? or just go by the Block stamp???

5. Does anyone make better main caps or better main studs? ARP? Block girdle? Any of the above even neccisary? I mean I guess it's kinda silly to go as far as a girdle with my goals (400 max probobly more like 300-350)

LASTLY

The Scat rods I got were from a user on here... I was under the impression the vitara's used floating wristpins... but these are definately going to have to be pressed into the Scat rods... is that correct???

Thanks All.. I'll be updating with pics and progress over the next few months.

NonovUrbizniz

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NonovUrbizniz &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">blocks going out in a couple weeks to get rebuilt from the bottom up. BUT I have the flwg q's:

1. I'm not sleeving for now... should I have the guy post the cylinders? he'd do it no problem... just curious if it's ever been hashed out how valuable it is or not... I see threads on here with stock sleeves holding REDICULOUS power... way more than I'm thinking of... is it luck of the draw or what?

2. What Valve guides are people using? Stock or aftermarket?

3. Anyone have experience with hi-temp coating the combustion chamber and exhaust ports? I'm seriously thinking about doing this... along with a mild port/polish. The corky bell book speaks pretty highly about the hi-temp coating the exhaust ports... I'll probobly have the exhaust turbine done and DEFINATLY the manifold/dp

4. What bearings ACL or Stock or it's all a matter of preference... also how do you go about ordering the bearings prior to checking everything? Don't you have to plastiguage the new rods on the crank to get what size you need? or just go by the Block stamp???

5. Does anyone make better main caps or better main studs? ARP? Block girdle? Any of the above even neccisary? I mean I guess it's kinda silly to go as far as a girdle with my goals (400 max probobly more like 300-350)

LASTLY

The Scat rods I got were from a user on here... I was under the impression the vitara's used floating wristpins... but these are definately going to have to be pressed into the Scat rods... is that correct???

Thanks All.. I'll be updating with pics and progress over the next few months.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Anyone know any answers to the above? ideas?

boostfreak0885

i have scta rods/vitara setup... they work just fine if that helps

NonovUrbizniz

Yeah def. does... I haven't had time to see what people with experience with them think of them...

I've since my last post found out that ARP doesn't make main studs and people just use their stock main caps.

I'm gunna go with stock bearings... I'll read through the manual on how to select the right bearing... I know about the stamp on the block and all but I wanna be sure I get the right bearings cuz the engine building I'm using probobly won't know which ones to get.

I'm gunna have him check out the valve guides if they need to be replaced I'll look further into it.

Same for the posting the cylinders I guess....

ANY input welcome.