Mr.Hankey

So i get my car out of the shop after being fully built (sleeved, pistsons, rods, crank, valves/spring/retatiners ect). The builder tells me to drive around under 4krpms for around 1k-2k miles to break it in and to bring it back after 250 miles for an oil change. So i baby it for 250 miles and go back for the oil change, but at around 75-100 miles i start hearing this sound (almost like a slaping metal to metal sound) i tell the builder that it happens around 2800rpms and he tells me its normal and i shouldnt worry about it (he said it was pistons slap). Well i still did worry about it, so i get the oil change, no metal was in the oil or anything. So i drive the car 59 more miles, and it dies! The check engine light came on, and the oil lamp came on so i drive back home. I call my builder the next day and told him what happened, he tells me not to drive the car, so i paid 80 bucks to get it towed back to his shop. He checks it out, and told me it was a vtec silenoid problem and he cleans are replaces it and gives me back to car. I then told him about the slapping sound again and he tells me its normal again and sends me on my way. I drove the car about 15miles and it dies again, but this time im on the freeway about 1.5-2miles from his shop but it dies 8 times before i get it to his shop--on the freeway! He then took the engine out and the car apart and found a spun bearing in the 4th pistons:


Here is a picture of the spun bearing:


Heres a picture of a normal one:


The crank has minor scaring on it, and is being micropolished.
The builder and i argued over who should pay for this, and he told me that if people think he should pay for the new bearings on honda-tech he would pay for them. (hes buying a new crank if it cant be salvaged already, but wont pay for the bearings if people say he shouldnt).

So im starting this thread to see what people think. Should he pay for it? My view on this whole thing is this: He built this engine, and the spun bearing came from an internal issue that i had no control over and could not have avoided by anything ive done. I did everything he told me to do to the letter, and he knows it by the volume of calls i gave him asking about every aspect of the engine. And i only got my car to 300miles before something happened to it, i didnt even get through a full tank of gas before the engine broke down!


So people, please respond with a for yes, he should pay for the damage, or if you think he should not.

Edit: ive done some research on the the spun bearing with little miles on the engine (300 or so is the magic number it seems) and its almost always error on assembling the engine, or dirt being on parts when the engine is being built, or clearance issues (which i find being error on assembling the engine because everything should be measured before being put in the block)

Thinks he shoud pay:
delspool
G2K
Finest
EFbomb
gLok
jaggrieger30
SC61HB
Oleg
hybridEj8
narfdanarf
awdgsx96
DRAGLS
areyouasian
crstfr14
tegasaurus
Flexin5
stealthmode62
alex_s817
spoolin turbo s
1Bar GSR
MI KENT
hybrdthry911
methos713
mrbh22
eg:R
USDM 4G VTEC
biada1
ImportHatch
petty$rep
yaaj1320
Mr Wonderfull
qfast817
HiProfile
black7hatch
IMPORTJEDI
not2slo128
BlueSi2k
Boner_Ben
calgone47
HNLV
92gisser

Neutral:
dunkd
zeimbo
Adi Radoncic
USA#1
Mr. HYDE


Thinks he shouldnt pay:



Modified by Mr.Hankey at 7:10 PM 12/20/2006

FaceTuned

iTrader: (4)

who ever is building this engine or did should never work on cars again!

Mr.Hankey

Is that a thumbs up from you tuned? Im going to put all the tally's on the first post so its easier for him to count

awdgsx96

.

You did all the right things, called him when you noticed something was fishy, and followed his instructions. I say his fault and he owes you the bearings.

narfdanarf

Did you have a warranty though him? what kind of bearings are they? New oil pump?

I once put a motor together with pits in the old bearings, a rusted crankshaft that I found and cleaned off the best I could with a dremel tool, and it still lasted 30,000 miles with no filter change, only just adding oil when it was low. (It's a long story, but that's the gist of it)

so anyways IMO, there was either something seriously seriously fucked up for something like that to happen that soon, or you just had a shitty bearing, or it was your oil pump cause I don't remember if you said you had a new one or not.

conclusion: It could be your fault for not replacing oil pump, could be his fault for not recommending a new one, could be his fault for putting the engine together with a blindfold on, but did you have a warranty? If you didn't I give the man 2 thumbs up for even helping you get the crank refurbished, and you get 2 thumbs down for not going somewhere else.

hybridEj6

He should rebuilt it for CUSTOMER SERVICE! Keeping a customer is always easier than getting one back..maybe not for builder though

Oleg

He should pay.......

dunkd

Have him refund 50% of your money and then go to a different builder.

Mr.Hankey

His warrenty was kinda scetchy. He said no warrenty on to engine unless a gasket breaks or if a part was installed incorrectly. I cant afford to spend thousands of dollars to have it assembled anywhere else (and i dont think he would refund half the money if i wanted to go that route) But i think that he should have a chance to rectify the problem before i totally give up. But im not sure that will happen either because it doesnt know why it happened in the first place (which makes me even more nervous to drive the car after he repairs it)

Edit: On the oil pump. He told me that he installed a new oil pump in the engine along with the build. And a water pump too.

SC61HB

iTrader: (1)

The builder should pay for the bearings!!!

jaggrieger30

The builder should make the customer happy and pay!

Kevin

He should fix what is obviously a problem with his work. If he went through everything on the motor and supposedly put a new oil pump, the engine should run perfectly fine.

nsxmatt

First off it's not "barrings".

What is the turbo setup? Was it tuned? You could go out start building boost untuned, detonate, and kill a bearing.

EFbomb

Finest

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mr.Hankey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> He said no warrenty on to engine unless a gasket breaks or if a part was installed incorrectly. </TD></TR></TABLE>

The bearing was clearanced wrong, so it was installed incorrectly. Show him this thread and have him fix it. He won't pay for a new bearing and assembly, but he'll spring for a new crank?

G2K

Well as some already know, you should never drive a new motor without it being tuned. So with that said, did you have the motor tuned? Driving on a untuned motor can kill bearings, not saying thats what it is, But just an FYI. Also, it looks like clearances were too tight, looks like there was oil starvation to that rod bearing. Just another FYI, if your not running a dampener(ie. the stock unit or something like an ATI or Fluidamper) you need to think about it. Goodluck with the build

delspool

Mr.Hankey

The motor was not tuned. But it didnt have to be (thats what the builder told me at least) I brought my AEM EMS to him prior to the engine being built and he told me to take it back because it didnt need to be tuned until the turbo went in. Ive actually talked to a lot of builders about this (because i thought it was sketchy) but all of them agreed that breaking a n/a motor in with the stock ecu untuned is fine.

DRAGLS

For your information that bearing did not spin but it was on its way there. It was just starved for oil. Good luck with the rebuild


Btw, what engine is that?


The builder should pay for the repairs.

areyouasian

if hes already admitting fault and replacing or fixing the crank why not replace the bearing also. to me that just seems stupid that you even have to ask HT if he should replace the bearing or not!

he needs to replace the bearing!

DRAGLS

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by areyouasian &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">if hes already admitting fault and replacing or fixing the crank why not replace the bearing also. to me that just seems stupid that you even have to ask HT if he should replace the bearing or not!

he needs to replace the bearing!</TD></TR></TABLE>


um that bearing is junk

Mr.Hankey

I also find it kinda wierd that he would want to resolve the issue this way, but im guessing he thought everyone would say that i should have to pay for the bearing. But, he agreed to this so thats all that really matters. I just hope he fixes the problem when he assembles the engine again.

tony1

you have to make a thread about who should pay for $25 worth of bearings?

nsxmatt

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mr.Hankey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I also find it kinda wierd that he would want to resolve the issue this way, but im guessing he thought everyone would say that i should have to pay for the bearing. But, he agreed to this so thats all that really matters. I just hope he fixes the problem when he assembles the engine again.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Your drove around a built turbo car on a untuned stock ECU and continued to drive it after the oil light came on and kept shutting down. I'd say you did not do your research and you also picked the wrong tuner. Suck it up and take it somewhere else and pay out of your pocket.

LVB18Civic

Sounds like it was an error on his part. I say he pays for the new bearings