Autoworks

I am trying to find out what the deal is.
I originally installed my 255hp pump about 11 months ago, which all was fine for a while. Less than 5 months ago I started having fuel pressure issues. (the thread... https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1868717 ) At the time I thought it could have been anything but the pump because it was fairly new. After a few days of troubleshooting I decided to drop the tank and find this...

The hose in the tank had just melted and fallen apart.

In the mean time I had been driving the car a few times a week (I've probably filled it up 2 or 3 times since)

As of today, I get ready to head to the track and I notice the pump making a little weezy noise while priming it... thought nothing of it. I began to head out and notices alot of bogging and sputtering. I originally thought it had to be the TPS out of calibration because I just swapped TB's. So I head back, convert everything back over to the stock B16TB and try to head out again, with the same result. It would drive fine for maybe 30 yards and then begin to sputter/skip again. So back again I pop the hood and flip the throttle a few times to observe. At 1st flip, it would just be dead silence...no fuel. I pulled the plugs, they all looked OK. (I have yet to pay much attention to the fuel pressure because of the throttle body swapping) I get the TPS set, and the cable adjusted almost correctly when I notice the pressure on the gauge steadily and slowly dropping. I cut it off and crank it up again and just watch the gauge...40-35-30-25-20-15psi, flip the throttle and bog, not enough fuel again.
I'm going to drop the tank again tomorrow and I'm pretty sure it'll be a similar situation with the fuel line, or something close to it.

My questions are...
1. Has anyone else had this problem with the short intank line on the pump not holding up??
2. If so what was your solution?
3. I don't want to drop the tank and just replace the line again so it can happen again in 5-6 months.
4. Is there a type of line that will hold up better?
5. Is there just an all around better/more reliable in tank pump?

bigbadboy

try an external one. i have one thats been on the car for 5 years or more. i'm finally replacing mine before i go get tuned again just because i don't want it to fail cause its pretty old.

0mtber

iTrader: (2)

I have never seen anything like that occur.

That is a dangerous situation....

Did you verify that there is nothing in the tank that is clogging or stopping the pump from properly flowing ?

Are you installing the correct pump & install kit for your vehicle ?

Have you checked over your wiring to your pump ?

Autoworks

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mtber &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I have never seen anything like that occur.

That is a dangerous situation....

Did you verify that there is nothing in the tank that is clogging or stopping the pump from properly flowing ?
Last time I did, the filter itself ws fine, a little yellowish, but no particles or trash in it. I replaced the filter element anyway.

Are you installing the correct pump & install kit for your vehicle ?
Yes, it is an 88-91 Civic/CRX pump kit from Lightning. I've only had this problem on my car, never on anyone elses install

Have you checked over your wiring to your pump ?
I double checked it last time before dropping the tank again
</TD></TR></TABLE>
In between this happening the car will drive perfectly fine, dynoed a few times, tracked it a few times. Pressure would always hold rock solid. Then you get the weezy prime and dropping pressure. I haven't dropped the tank yet to verify it 100%, but I'm almost certain it will be the same issue again. The line last time had just melted to almost nothing, like hot electrical tape

Autoworks

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bigbadboy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">try an external one. i have one thats been on the car for 5 years or more. i'm finally replacing mine before i go get tuned again just because i don't want it to fail cause its pretty old. </TD></TR></TABLE>
If it is the exact same problem again (which I really think it will be) then I need to know why it's doing it. I don't want to abanden the in tank pump without knowing what's causing it to fail the way it is.
What could cause that line to just melt?? The pump will work fine, primes fine, but that damn line last time was literrally falling apart in the worst way. If that is happenig again I need to know why. I used the same grade fuel line that I have on my regulator and return line, and they are fine. Fuel lines are made to handle fuel, but for some reason the line on the pump doesn't seem to like fuel very much??

iBrandon

Are you sure that fuel line is fuel rated?? Meaning is that hose meant for gasoline, if not it will melt overtime..

Autoworks

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by iBrandon &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Are you sure that fuel line is fuel rated?? Meaning is that hose meant for gasoline, if not it will melt overtime..</TD></TR></TABLE>
positive,
I made sure of it. The first line that melted was the one hat came with the pump. The 2nd line was one I bought that was i deed fuel line. I made it a point not to put another warlboro supplied line in (which I did have) because I didn't want the same thing to happen again...well...

iBrandon

hmmm...how is your fuel pump wired? are u using the stock wires? or are you using a separate relay and getting power straight from the battery?

The way i wired mine is i hooked mine up straight to the battery, using a thicker gauge then the stock wires with relay and fuse connected to it and i also added a switch to turn the fuel pump off and on...

This way i made dam sure i wasnt lacking voltage and had a solid ground...

heres some good info on fuel pump maintence..

http://www.carterfueldelivery....0.pdf

Sprockets

iTrader: (6)

It seriously looks like someone put some nasty, corrosive **** in your gas tank.

Autoworks

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by iBrandon &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">hmmm...how is your fuel pump wired? are u using the stock wires? or are you using a separate relay and getting power straight from the battery?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
It is wired stock, straight to the harness.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Sprockets &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It seriously looks like someone put some nasty, corrosive **** in your gas tank. </TD></TR></TABLE>
It looks that way...but the car would run 100% flawless...other than not getting fuel now. The car has only been filled up a few times, and those few times would be either 93 @ Chevroln or 93.5 @ Entech.

Autoworks

I also went out this morning to crank it to make sure I wasn't just going crazy. Primed it a few times, (sounded like crap...kind of like a coffee pot right when it's finishing up those last few drops...just not as loud). The car still cranks, the FP gauges were super jittery between 30-35psi...I'm sure once it would have warmed up they would have just dropped down to 15ish. (I have 2 gauges still on the car from when I was trouble shooting this issue last time, one on the filter before the rail, and one on the off rail regulator)

b16a4

i would drop the gas tank and clean it out.....

better safe than sorry

Autoworks

Dropped the tank today...

As soon as I remove the plastic splash guard from outside the tank I got a surprising shot of gas to the face...the outside return line was also coming apart...in 2 spots.


the bigger tear


and the smaller tear at the opposite end


I was hoping that was all it was, but I went ahead and pulled the pump anyway...
split like a baked potato



I replaced both lines with neoprene shielded fuel lines.
(I actually had to drop the tank twice due to fraying the power wire upon reinstallation the 1st time...the pump wouldn't prime )

I'm hoping that the outside damaged return line is what caused the inside line to split in some way.

I primed it a few times and it sounded perfectly healthy, back to a solid 40 psi and driveable again.
Hopefully I won't make another thread like this come November...that's right before IFO... (knocks on wood)

Evile140

I seen a post almost exactly like this over on a 2.3 turbo ford board. His short rubber hose section started to melt also. But it was written off to the fact it was one of the price is to good to be true "Walbro's" off ebay..so it was probably a fake and had the cheapest components supplied with it possible.

Flashmn

Get some real fuel hose, seems like your crap isnt 1) Fuel withstanding, 2) pressure withstandign.

b16a4

im happy you sorted out your problems,

how do i drop my tank? any pix!?

my tank is filthy!

mortificationrock

Dudes dont say anything about ebay ! i bought a walbro fuel pump from ebay for like $100! Please dont tell me they are fake I dont want my **** looking like that Sucks you had to go through that Keep your head up man

RedEj8

Damn you got *** raped...You can get a walbro out of the sponsor marketplace for $90

Jared

that looks just like fuel hose that isnt rated for pressure. remember, there is a difference between fuel rated hose, and fuel injection rated hose. regardless, hope you get your issues sorted out.

Laserjock

Sux man, I remember that thread a few months back. Everything is leading to hoses not compatible to fuel. Those hoses should not have split. The pickup should not have turned to mush.

Try a different Walbro vendor. (nolimitmotorsports) Could be you are getting fake pumps.

Go all out and use the socketless/push fit style hose or silicone. Or OEM...

best of luck

Autoworks

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Laserjock &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Sux man, I remember that thread a few months back. Everything is leading to hoses not compatible to fuel. Those hoses should not have split. The pickup should not have turned to mush.

Try a different Walbro vendor. (nolimitmotorsports) Could be you are getting fake pumps.

Go all out and use the socketless/push fit style hose or silicone. Or OEM...

best of luck
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Thanks,
The neoprene hose I used today is OEM Nissan high pressure fuel hose, fresh out the pack.
I've driven it a few times today, all is smooth again.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Jared &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">that looks just like fuel hose that isnt rated for pressure. remember, there is a difference between fuel rated hose, and fuel injection rated hose. regardless, hope you get your issues sorted out.</TD></TR></TABLE>
The old hose was identical to the hose that came with the Walbro pump, only thicker. It split, but didn't melt. They may need to look into upgrading the hose that comes with the kit.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mortificationrock &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Dudes dont say anything about ebay ! i bought a walbro fuel pump from ebay for like $100! </TD></TR></TABLE>

Unless you got the CRX or DA kit with it then you paid to much, I hope it is authentic

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b16a4 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">im happy you sorted out your problems,

how do i drop my tank? any pix!?

my tank is filthy!</TD></TR></TABLE>
On a 88-91
1. Support the rear of the car on jack stands (the higher the better)
2. Remove the LR wheel
3. Remove the plastic dust shield on the left side of the tank
4. Support the middle of the tank with a jack
5.Remove both 12mm nuts holding the tank straps.
6.Slowly lover the tank.
7. Unbolt the hardline bracket from the drivers side of the tank.

That's about it, from there you just have to remove the 10mm nuts holding the pump and maneuver the unit out. You may have to squint your left eye, and poke your tongue out a little while saying the magic words to get the unit into the right position to come out.

mortificationrock

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RedEj8 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Damn you got *** raped...You can get a walbro out of the sponsor marketplace for $90</TD></TR></TABLE> Wow glad you noticed the 10 dollar diffirence and no i got it for 90 i just rounded it up to 100 Geez only broke people complain about 10 dollars and call it rape Let go dude As for Autoworks thanx for the thumbs maybe i did but hey i got in 2 day shipping free so its alright and hopefuly i did purchase a authentic one does look good and it aint from that scammer the other guy mentioned



Modified by mortificationrock at 8:12 PM 6/23/2007

b16a4

thanks man, what do i clean my tank out with? theres sluge on the floor

Autoworks

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b16a4 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">thanks man, what do i clean my tank out with? theres sluge on the floor</TD></TR></TABLE>
good info on cleaning in here...
http://www.carterfueldelivery....0.pdf