andyisftw

I am torn between two swaps: the B18B1 and the D16Z6. The D would go boosted, the B would be N/A. It seems like everyone where I'm from has the C1 or the B16A.. I want to do something different. Anyone care to give their two cents..?

fishieman

You'd go broke getting power out of that N/A B18, without changing out the head.

miguel329

whats your budget? cuz b18 non vtec will cost alot to n/a!!

andyisftw

to be honest, there really isn't much of a budget. and i'm not looking for huge numbers.. just a solid motor to track every now and again, but mainly a daily.

Schister66

Of the two options, i would go D all the way. Since you're not on a terribly rigid budget, look into an Eagle/Vitara D for that added bit of security.

rat city rex

d16 with a evo7/8/9 turbo and call it a day. Headstuds good clutch and a good tune. /end thread

Stinkycheezmonky

Track or strip?

For track use, the LS motor will be infinitely more reliable and less problematic.

Just for reference Dustin's (BauleyCivic) old turbo mini-me (Greddy kit? Whatever the heck turbo that is) was about equal in a straight line with my 403'd B20 (which is ABOUT equivalent to a 403'd LS). I was putting down 165whp, he was never dynoed. Cams really do a lot for the non-VTEC motors.

locash

Being different costs money.

I'd turbo the B18B.

andyisftw

strip. and thanks for the read.. i will definitely keep that in mind. and as far as cams go, any recommendations? granted.. this motor build will be a little ways down the road.

Autoworks

Choosing between a N/A B18A/B and a turbo D...I'd definitely turbo the D.

D Series Greddy kit uses a TD04 15G. Running neck and neck with a car that made 165whp is about right. The 15G will make near that on wastegate and all the power is before 6k or so where it lays over.

ShanghaiOC

I'd go with Locash's idea. He's been around for years. I remember him on the Honda Hybrids board. My good friend bought Slidesquad Dave's TD04H ZC EF. It was fun, but mildy worked GSRs would rip it up.

turbo sol

the greddy kit is only about a 170-190 hp kit. so as stated before it should be with the b20 swap.

I wouldn't go with the greddy kit. (been there - done that) but I would say turbo d.

1. parts are usually a tad cheaper
2. no mount kit needed
3. tranny (if you break it) is def cheaper
4. shown 350 reliable HP

Hybrid96EK

Lots of people here seem to think no power can be made with a Greddy kit. I went 14.0 @ 102mph on my Greddy kit on 10psi. Don't assume they suck just because they use smaller turbos. You can make good numbers with good tuning...

I also went 14.0 @ 105mph at 10psi with an Edelbrock kit... That was on a stock y8 manifold with the Eagle/Vitara setup. Nothing special. On 15psi that thing moved quite well.

Back on topic I have had countless setups. NA B16, B18C1, boosted B16, boosted Z6, boosted Y8 and even an NA B18B1. While I never did do cams in the B1, that was by far my least favorite setup. With boost I am sure they are good setups... but in NA I wasn't amused. The turbo D setups have been by FAR the most enjoyable and entertaining setups I have had. They all made excellent power and never gave me ANY trouble. Perhaps it has to do with being built correctly and a good tune. Needless to say I just sold my B16 and am in the process of my third boosted D setup!

andyisftw

alright, thank you guys..

Stinkycheezmonky

If you decide to go with an LS motor, turbo or not Crower 62403 cams are a nice choice for street use. The 404s are a little harder to tune and require you to wring the car out to find the power. There is a Brian Crower equivalent, but I don't remember what the designation is. BC0022 or something maybe.

perseverance

go with a turbo D. my buddy had a bone stock z6 in which we used a turbo from a mitsubishi eclipse and it put down 210 to the wheels and ran for a while. 210 to the wheels in his hatchy and he was right there with stock evo's on the track. it net him a 13 sec pass. try getting that out of a na/b18b. btw the turbo kit we did cost us under 1500 for everything with tune.

Schister66

Whoa, whoa, wait...stop!

I didnt know that was an option. I hereby change my opinion from turbo Vitara D to either turbo LS or LS/VTEC...

Stinkycheezmonky

I don't think it really is an option. OP said he has a very tight budget.

Schister66

Oh, good point. I will then stick to my original suggestion : Turbo D series (with Vitaras if the budget allows)

Hybrid96EK

Honestly, if the budget doesn't allow for Vitaras (Dirt cheap), then I dont think the budget allows for any kind of turbo setup that will be even half way reliable. You have to invest a little in these things when you boost them or they are just going to bring you headaches and failure.

Schister66

^^True as most of that may be, it is possible and safe to boost on a stock D. It would be better for him to put a little extra into the turbo setup and tune and not invest in the Vitaras. Building an engine, no matter how cheap the Vitaras may be, is not free. After everything, it will still be $800-1000...

Hybrid96EK

Stock D isn't going to take you much past 200whp... an 200whp isn't that entertaining. At least not to me. I'd be looking for at least 300whp+. 200 is fun for a bit, but you'll get "used to" it quick and want more. Vitaras a HELLA cheap. So why not just get some, a set of ACLS and some ARP headstuds and have yourself a somewhat solid setup?

Stinkycheezmonky

Because with the associated machine work and additional parts, the extra $1000 or whatever (on top of all the other parts) puts the project way over budget. Just a guess (based on my own need for the same type of stuff and how it would put me over budget).

Some of us are also happy with 200whp.

Hybrid96EK

To bore, hone and deck the block is $140 at the local shop. The ACL's were about $50 for rods, mains and thrusts. The ARPS, $120 shipped. The Vitaras last time I bought them were something like $150 with rings, shipped... of course I would also STRONGLY reccomend ditching the stock rods, so theres another $300. Anyways, this is still a far cry from a grand. To each his own I suppose. I just don't know how anyone can look at a stock D rod and honestly say they trust 200whp will do them well.

Stinkycheezmonky

That's $800, and your $140 is a pretty good price for all that machine work (and assumes the OP is capable of performing that labor himself). You'd have to add a headgasket to that too, and whatever other gaskets needed.

My argument is only that it isn't exactly a budget build when you account for all the "hidden" expenses. I don't know enough about D's to say whether that will last or not, I only have Dustin's experience (which was pretty positive, and did not result in a blown motor). The budget part of this equation is in this case important, as the OP has a very small one.

To some extent I do agree with (I'm guessing) your mentality of "do it right the first time." That's just not always affordable. Which then leads me to think: for the OP, maybe a stockish LS motor would be better, as it would be more reliable/less problematic.