simplex

Hi!

I'm planning to build an "el cheapo" D16Y8 turbo on E85, so I will use
machined LS rods and planning to use oem pistons with ceramic coating,
with around 14-16 psi.

(both the machinework and the coating will be done for a very low price,
so I will save huge amount of cash here)

I'm a bit concerned by the relatively weak ringlands of the oem pistons.

Will the lower piston temps caused by E85 + ceramic coating help with this problem, or it's purely a mechanical issue?

Muckman

iTrader: (2)

The lower heat absorption from the ceramic coating and lower EGT from ethanol WILL help but no one will be able to quantify how much it will help for you.

simplex

Well, I'm hoping that someone had done something similar in the past, so he could post some info about the build, like:

-CR
-boost pressure
-piston used
-max power/torque
-time 'til it exploded

so, I could figure out some safe limits for my build

92cxyd

Seen 260-ish whp before on stock bottom end, look at:
http://www.d-series.org/forums/force...m-end-d16.html

Oh and coated top piston or not the rods are the weakest link in the bottom end.

MR.johnson

i have made 307 on a stock minime but i wouldnt be doing any 4th gear hwy pulls lol.

Turbo-LS

iTrader: (4)

General rule of thumb with a d series on gas is 200-225 a little more with ethanol. Wasting money on coatings is just that a waste of money. You I can do rods and pistons fairly I expensive even vitaras and rods and you'll have a pretty stout setup for a d. FYI psi goal is useless you run whatever pressure you need to obtain the hp goal. Some turbos take 20 psi to make 400 and some take 8-10 psi.

simplex

I will use modified LS or GSR rods instead of stock D16 rods, they are good until at least 300-400 hp (info from stock B20 and GSR turbo builds)

This thread is about the PISTONS, not the rods anyway, so please, keep the standard "rods will bend at 200-220hp" stuff away

simplex

FYI: I asked for boost pressure AND compression ratio AND archived hp/torque.
These infos should be enough to roughly estimate, what are the limits of a ceramic coated oem piston.

I want to keep, or even increase CR a bit, so vitaras are not an option.

skateboard_ej8

iTrader: (4)

Would say 330 depending on supporting mods.

Just a ball park figure.

Pro-SeriesFab

The piston design is the weak link, coatings aren't going to change the ring setup.

You might be able to take a little more cylinder pressure because the piston will be cooler with the coatings and the fuel but at least if you blow it up it was "cheap" to begin with right?

turbohatch96y7

iTrader: (15)

Cracked my ringlands on a lsvtec build I slapped together with ls rods on gsr pistons.

Guessing the compression was pretty high since I was making 240 psi after the first 15min of idle.

Broke the ringlands after a day and only 5 psi on a 35lb a min turbo.

simplex

Exactly my toughts. If my tune is shitty, or something catastrophic happens (broken valve, foreign material inside the combustion chamber, shitty fuel, etc), it will destroy even forged pistons.

So if my ghetto-setup survives around 300-350hp for a year without exploding, I will be happy. In case of catastrophic failure, I could have a spare set of pistons ready, as I have unlimited supply of D16Y8 pistons, and I could coat them for almost no charge.

Forged pistons are around $600-$700 here (shipping, customs, etc), so I could not afford having an other set lying around, and I tooks weeks for them to arrive.

The real question is, presuming I do not have any heat/knock issues, and I do not rev it while it's still cold (so no loose clearances), how much power could a stock ringland survive, and how could I modify it, to survive even more?

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

Having a spare set of pistons laying around doesn't save you when a blown ringland decides to gouge a cylinder wall.

shawty22

Vitara pistons are proven to make 450-500whp all day and you can pay for them with your pocket change...I dont understand why you wouldnt go with them. Spending even 5 dollars on "modifying" an oem piston is 100% a waste of money in my opinion.

simplex

I want a high compression build, so vitaras are not really an option.

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

So why are you trying SO hard to avoid spending money on good parts that are proven to handle the abuse? Eagle rods are cheap. Wiseco pistons are cheap. They'll both handle a LOT more abuse than stock, pencil-thin LS rods or OEM pistons.

simplex

As I said before, the "cheap" eagles and wisecos are not so cheap after they arrive to my country. With shipping costs, customs, and taxes, added, I'm paying almost double price, the eagle+wiseco combo is around $1200-1300 after it arrives to the country.

In comparison, I could get LS rods for around $50, and get them machined for free. Even the shipping costs of the eagles are above $50.

seelback

your good on the rods cause ive seen stock ls/b20 rods hold 450'swhp revving to 8k on the dyno and up the rev limit to 9k at the track. as far as the pistons, i've heard of a 100% stock d15b make 300whp which is super extreme for those rods and i cant beleive it held if its true, soo with the proper ring clearances and coating would definitely increase piston life and alow for more power but my guess would be 300-350whp.