Looking to Supercharge a 1999 Honda Civic EX sedan for street use. I sure could use some recommenda
07-26-2005, 10:41 PM
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Looking to Supercharge a 1999 Honda Civic EX sedan for street use. I sure could use some recommenda
Hello.
I’m looking to increase the performance of a daily, street-driven 1999 Civic EX sedan with an automatic transmission and the 1.6L D16Y8 VTEC motor. This is my lady’s vehicle and she wants to keep an automatic transmission. Because the vehicle is driven in the city with many stoplights and hills (San Francisco), supercharging the vehicle seems to make more sense than a turbo for her. I’m hoping to get some good advice on what modifications we should look at doing.
We want to keep the vehicle mostly stock looking and sounding – hence the “stealth” terminology. So far, the only modifications made to the vehicle are a K&N air filter (not the cold air intake kit) and 15” rims with good tires. A Jackson Racing Tech suggested sticking with the K&N air filter and modifying the stock air box to remove any other air flow restrictions.
The current plan (subject to change):
1. Get a Jackson Racing Supercharger kit, plus their racing fuel pump, the Hondata Intake Insulated gasket, 160 degree thermostat, cooler spark plugs – all from Jackson Racing. Plan to run the stock JRSC boost.
2. Install a Thermal R&D Stealth Cat-back exhaust system (already purchased).
After doing much reading here and on other forums online, I’ve managed to second-guess my choices and was hoping some of you would help me out with recommendations for this project. The JRSC is currently out of stock (last time I checked), so I haven’t actually ordered it yet – but plan to. When I talked to a Jackson Racing Tech Rep, he suggested that I also look into upgrading my torque converter if I do have the JRSC installed on this vehicle. I asked him what mods I should do and he said to ask around on some of the forums, so I came here. I have no idea what modifications he was referring to so any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
My second-guessing has left me with the following questions and confusion:
1. Should I consider a motor swap (bigger, faster, better) instead of going the supercharger route with this motor? At 25,000 miles, this motor is still good but I’m wondering if it might be cheaper in the long run to upgrade to a higher horsepower motor from the start?
2. What modifications should be done to my current drive train if I go with the JRSC? What specifically needs modified, changed or beefed up? Got to stick with an automatic transmission unfortunately.
3. Headers: Stick with the stock one or upgrade? If upgrade, I’ve been looking at 4-2-1 configurations, but don’t know which ones would be best for increased performance – but without greatly increasing the exhaust noise. What type headers would also run the coolest in the engine compartment so the supercharger doesn’t get extra heated air? Ceramic coated? Stainless steel?
All of this got me thinking about what modifications could be done, but now I’m a bit lost on what should be done in order to stick with my original intention: of building a higher performance daily driven street vehicle that doesn’t look or sound too modified – but would have good performance in a hilly stop and go city street environment (San Francisco)?
I realize this isn’t a “sexy” project like many I have read about (with some envy) on these forums, but I know that many here have the expertise and experience to help point me in the right direction. I’m hoping for help in avoiding making costly mistakes from the start. I will have all of the modifications professionally done -, as I am physically unable to do them myself – despite being an old school mechanic (in the 70’s). I would appreciate any recommendations made and would be happy to document the project from start to finish and post pictures and results here. Thanks for reading this far and considering my project.
JR
I’m looking to increase the performance of a daily, street-driven 1999 Civic EX sedan with an automatic transmission and the 1.6L D16Y8 VTEC motor. This is my lady’s vehicle and she wants to keep an automatic transmission. Because the vehicle is driven in the city with many stoplights and hills (San Francisco), supercharging the vehicle seems to make more sense than a turbo for her. I’m hoping to get some good advice on what modifications we should look at doing.
We want to keep the vehicle mostly stock looking and sounding – hence the “stealth” terminology. So far, the only modifications made to the vehicle are a K&N air filter (not the cold air intake kit) and 15” rims with good tires. A Jackson Racing Tech suggested sticking with the K&N air filter and modifying the stock air box to remove any other air flow restrictions.
The current plan (subject to change):
1. Get a Jackson Racing Supercharger kit, plus their racing fuel pump, the Hondata Intake Insulated gasket, 160 degree thermostat, cooler spark plugs – all from Jackson Racing. Plan to run the stock JRSC boost.
2. Install a Thermal R&D Stealth Cat-back exhaust system (already purchased).
After doing much reading here and on other forums online, I’ve managed to second-guess my choices and was hoping some of you would help me out with recommendations for this project. The JRSC is currently out of stock (last time I checked), so I haven’t actually ordered it yet – but plan to. When I talked to a Jackson Racing Tech Rep, he suggested that I also look into upgrading my torque converter if I do have the JRSC installed on this vehicle. I asked him what mods I should do and he said to ask around on some of the forums, so I came here. I have no idea what modifications he was referring to so any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
My second-guessing has left me with the following questions and confusion:
1. Should I consider a motor swap (bigger, faster, better) instead of going the supercharger route with this motor? At 25,000 miles, this motor is still good but I’m wondering if it might be cheaper in the long run to upgrade to a higher horsepower motor from the start?
2. What modifications should be done to my current drive train if I go with the JRSC? What specifically needs modified, changed or beefed up? Got to stick with an automatic transmission unfortunately.
3. Headers: Stick with the stock one or upgrade? If upgrade, I’ve been looking at 4-2-1 configurations, but don’t know which ones would be best for increased performance – but without greatly increasing the exhaust noise. What type headers would also run the coolest in the engine compartment so the supercharger doesn’t get extra heated air? Ceramic coated? Stainless steel?
All of this got me thinking about what modifications could be done, but now I’m a bit lost on what should be done in order to stick with my original intention: of building a higher performance daily driven street vehicle that doesn’t look or sound too modified – but would have good performance in a hilly stop and go city street environment (San Francisco)?
I realize this isn’t a “sexy” project like many I have read about (with some envy) on these forums, but I know that many here have the expertise and experience to help point me in the right direction. I’m hoping for help in avoiding making costly mistakes from the start. I will have all of the modifications professionally done -, as I am physically unable to do them myself – despite being an old school mechanic (in the 70’s). I would appreciate any recommendations made and would be happy to document the project from start to finish and post pictures and results here. Thanks for reading this far and considering my project.
JR
07-26-2005, 11:00 PM
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Re: Looking to Supercharge a 1999 Honda Civic EX sedan for street use. I sure could use some recomm
Make sure it is tuned correctly. Also, you probably will want to throw a trans cooler on it at least. That extra power and those damn SF hills will prob be death on that auto. GL. 
07-26-2005, 11:16 PM
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Re: Looking to Supercharge a 1999 Honda Civic EX sedan for street use. I sure could use some recomm
If I were you I probably wouldn't swap the engine. The d16y8 is a pretty strong d series motor.
I have no idea what to do with the tranny because I don't ever work on automatics. But a tranny cooler would probably be a pretty good idea in my opinion.
I'd probably see how well the car does with the jrsc before even thinking about getting headers. If you do decide to get headers remember that since you live in cali they must be carb legal. I'm sure you wouldn't want to go through the hassle of either finding a smog station that will illegally smog the car or swapping the headers out every two years.
I say have the jrsc installed and see how the car does with it on. You may want to think about beefing up the transmission however because my mom's tranny on the same car seems to be going out and it's only got 40k miles. People with more experience on this subject would probably help you out more than I ever could though.
I have no idea what to do with the tranny because I don't ever work on automatics. But a tranny cooler would probably be a pretty good idea in my opinion.
I'd probably see how well the car does with the jrsc before even thinking about getting headers. If you do decide to get headers remember that since you live in cali they must be carb legal. I'm sure you wouldn't want to go through the hassle of either finding a smog station that will illegally smog the car or swapping the headers out every two years.
I say have the jrsc installed and see how the car does with it on. You may want to think about beefing up the transmission however because my mom's tranny on the same car seems to be going out and it's only got 40k miles. People with more experience on this subject would probably help you out more than I ever could though.
07-26-2005, 11:37 PM
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Re: Looking to Supercharge a 1999 Honda Civic EX sedan for street use. I sure could use some recomm
Thanks for the input. I also think it's a good idea to put a transmission cooler on the vehicle. Can't hurt and could only help.
I am keeping the vehicle 100% legal, so for the exhaust I'm only considering C.A.R.B. exempt components.
My original plan was to have just the Supercharger (and SC related accessories I mentioned in my first post) installed and the Cat-back exhaust system and see how the vehicle performed with just those mods. Then I got to considering other mods and couldn't stop.
If anyone could recommend a good shop in the San Francisco Bay area to install the JRSC, I'd also appreciate that.
I am keeping the vehicle 100% legal, so for the exhaust I'm only considering C.A.R.B. exempt components.
My original plan was to have just the Supercharger (and SC related accessories I mentioned in my first post) installed and the Cat-back exhaust system and see how the vehicle performed with just those mods. Then I got to considering other mods and couldn't stop.
If anyone could recommend a good shop in the San Francisco Bay area to install the JRSC, I'd also appreciate that.
Sorry. Double post.
07-26-2005, 11:51 PM
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Re: Looking to Supercharge a 1999 Honda Civic EX sedan for street use. I sure could use some recomm
I personally have a D16Y8 automatic with a Jackson Racing kit. I had the setup for 98000 miles. Don't expect any huge power gains though, but you will find the car much more fun to drive. With the automatic, the engine RPM will always hover around 2000-3500RPM, and a SC is the most suitable upgrade for daily driving. Much better than any turbo setup IMO.
The transmission is the main weakpoint. Full Synthetic ATF flush and a large transmission cooler is a must. My stock AT lasted 70000 boosted miles, and I am currently on the 2nd transmission. Note that I do drive like a madman, and this car takes all the abuse when my "other" fast car is down
If you want quietness, I don't think the Thermal exhaust is a good choice. You went with the exhaust that does the complete opposite
I am running 2.25" cat-back exhaust with OEM ITR muffler. Size your exhaust with your power level... With the JRSC, you are looking at about 170-180HP at the motor and you don't need anything larger than 2.25".
I have a DC 4-2-1 header, and it actually increased a lot of low-end and midrange. That would be my choice as far as header goes.
As far as swap goes, you will go through a lot of trouble to do a swap that comes with full ECU, wiring harness and automatic trans (with the right axles, etc...). I was also in the same situation as you in terms of keeping the car auto, and there isn't a cost effective solution other than working with the stock motor. If you swap a B18C1, or a B18C5, you won't have automatic and it doesn't work out. You can get an LS auto, but it will be slower than a JRSC D16Y8. H22A with automatic would be awesome, but it would be $$$ plus lots of custom work. I don't think there are any automatic H22 powered EK civics out there, and I didn't want to be the first either.
The fuel management that comes with the JR kits is junk. Because of automatic trans, you cannot go with any standalone management out there. That means no Hondata, no AEM, no Uberdata/Chrome. I am currently running an E-manage with external MAP and it does the job for a 9psi setup.
Hope this helps, and if you do it right, you end up with a perfectly reliable daily driven car. Well, other than replacing the belts about once a year, and tensioners every two years
Don't skimp out on the belt changes because for the D16Y8 supercharger, it shares the same belt as the alternator. If it snaps, you have about 5-7 mins to get home before the battery dies
The transmission is the main weakpoint. Full Synthetic ATF flush and a large transmission cooler is a must. My stock AT lasted 70000 boosted miles, and I am currently on the 2nd transmission. Note that I do drive like a madman, and this car takes all the abuse when my "other" fast car is down
If you want quietness, I don't think the Thermal exhaust is a good choice. You went with the exhaust that does the complete opposite
I am running 2.25" cat-back exhaust with OEM ITR muffler. Size your exhaust with your power level... With the JRSC, you are looking at about 170-180HP at the motor and you don't need anything larger than 2.25". I have a DC 4-2-1 header, and it actually increased a lot of low-end and midrange. That would be my choice as far as header goes.
As far as swap goes, you will go through a lot of trouble to do a swap that comes with full ECU, wiring harness and automatic trans (with the right axles, etc...). I was also in the same situation as you in terms of keeping the car auto, and there isn't a cost effective solution other than working with the stock motor. If you swap a B18C1, or a B18C5, you won't have automatic and it doesn't work out. You can get an LS auto, but it will be slower than a JRSC D16Y8. H22A with automatic would be awesome, but it would be $$$ plus lots of custom work. I don't think there are any automatic H22 powered EK civics out there, and I didn't want to be the first either.
The fuel management that comes with the JR kits is junk. Because of automatic trans, you cannot go with any standalone management out there. That means no Hondata, no AEM, no Uberdata/Chrome. I am currently running an E-manage with external MAP and it does the job for a 9psi setup.
Hope this helps, and if you do it right, you end up with a perfectly reliable daily driven car. Well, other than replacing the belts about once a year, and tensioners every two years
Don't skimp out on the belt changes because for the D16Y8 supercharger, it shares the same belt as the alternator. If it snaps, you have about 5-7 mins to get home before the battery dies
07-27-2005, 12:43 AM
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Re: Looking to Supercharge a 1999 Honda Civic EX sedan for street use. I sure could use some recomm
Excellent input Tony the Tiger. Much appreciated.
I realize that the automatic transmission requirement limits the performance and modifications I can do with this vehicle, but unfortunately that’s what I must go with. I had planned to run synthetic AFT (considering RedLine brand) after a full transmission fluid flush. I hadn’t really considered a transmission fluid cooler until it was mentioned, but I plan to take that advice.
I’m hoping that your info on the Thermal R&D Stealth Cat-back exhaust system (I already purchased) is incorrect (fingers crossed). I purchased the Thermal Stealth Cat-back system specifically on a recommendation to run quiet with the JRSC. Supposedly this is a relatively new Cat-back exhaust system by Thermal and I quote their description of the Stealth Cat-back system (part # B101-C116T) I purchased:
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thermal R&D has recently introduced the ST line of exhaust systems built specifically for street performance. These systems are designed to create a mellower exhaust sound. These systems feature the same great look and quality as our Cl systems. ST systems are tuned towards low to mid-range power and are recommended on mildly modified vehicles. </TD></TR></TABLE>
http://www.thermalrd.com/honda.htm
I know that Superchargers do what they do best with the coolest air intake temperature possible. Towards that end, I’m going to use the Hondata Intake Insulating gasket (supposed to lower the intake temperature up to 30F). I’ll be using the Jackson Racing 160F thermostat. I’m also looking at what I can do to keep motor running as cool as possible. I will be running a mix of 20% anti-freeze to 80% distilled water (plus RedLine Water Wetter additive) in my radiator to help keep the water temperature down. I’m considering adding an electric radiator fan to further aid the cooling but I haven’t decided if I’m going to do that yet.
The DC 4-2-1 header is what I have been considering the most (the 2-piece), but don’t know if the ceramic coated header would run cooler under the hood than the stainless steel header. To me, I think the ceramic header would run the coolest, but it might not make any appreciable difference in the under the hood temps. Regardless, I’m probably going to hold off on a header until I see how the JRSC and Thermal cat-back work for me.
No worries on doing the recommended maintenance. I really do have the oil AND filter changed every 3,000 miles or 3 months. I’ve done that since the car was new. I’m considering switching over to synthetic motor oil too when I have the JRSC installed. Proper maintenance is the cheapest insurance I know of. I never cut corners there.
Thanks again for the excellent input. I learned a few things and you confirmed a few more I was thinking.
I realize that the automatic transmission requirement limits the performance and modifications I can do with this vehicle, but unfortunately that’s what I must go with. I had planned to run synthetic AFT (considering RedLine brand) after a full transmission fluid flush. I hadn’t really considered a transmission fluid cooler until it was mentioned, but I plan to take that advice.
I’m hoping that your info on the Thermal R&D Stealth Cat-back exhaust system (I already purchased) is incorrect (fingers crossed). I purchased the Thermal Stealth Cat-back system specifically on a recommendation to run quiet with the JRSC. Supposedly this is a relatively new Cat-back exhaust system by Thermal and I quote their description of the Stealth Cat-back system (part # B101-C116T) I purchased:
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thermal R&D has recently introduced the ST line of exhaust systems built specifically for street performance. These systems are designed to create a mellower exhaust sound. These systems feature the same great look and quality as our Cl systems. ST systems are tuned towards low to mid-range power and are recommended on mildly modified vehicles. </TD></TR></TABLE>
http://www.thermalrd.com/honda.htm
I know that Superchargers do what they do best with the coolest air intake temperature possible. Towards that end, I’m going to use the Hondata Intake Insulating gasket (supposed to lower the intake temperature up to 30F). I’ll be using the Jackson Racing 160F thermostat. I’m also looking at what I can do to keep motor running as cool as possible. I will be running a mix of 20% anti-freeze to 80% distilled water (plus RedLine Water Wetter additive) in my radiator to help keep the water temperature down. I’m considering adding an electric radiator fan to further aid the cooling but I haven’t decided if I’m going to do that yet.
The DC 4-2-1 header is what I have been considering the most (the 2-piece), but don’t know if the ceramic coated header would run cooler under the hood than the stainless steel header. To me, I think the ceramic header would run the coolest, but it might not make any appreciable difference in the under the hood temps. Regardless, I’m probably going to hold off on a header until I see how the JRSC and Thermal cat-back work for me.
No worries on doing the recommended maintenance. I really do have the oil AND filter changed every 3,000 miles or 3 months. I’ve done that since the car was new. I’m considering switching over to synthetic motor oil too when I have the JRSC installed. Proper maintenance is the cheapest insurance I know of. I never cut corners there.
Thanks again for the excellent input. I learned a few things and you confirmed a few more I was thinking.
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07-27-2005, 03:16 PM
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Re: Looking to Supercharge a 1999 Honda Civic EX sedan for street use. I sure could use some recomm
I can't say for sure if the new Thermal will live up to its claim, but I used to have the older version of the Stealth Cat-back (with silencer cone) and boy, it was mind boggling loud. I guess you will have to find out how loud it is, and perhaps let me know once you find out
I'd skip the JR thermostat.. I purchased one and it failed within months. Quality was cheap, and I noticed no change in water temp. My car actually ran better with the OEM thermostat, and IMO, it is the best one you can get. A new OEM thermostat will be my choice.
I actually ran regular 5w-30 oil since the engine was new... Since it's not a turbo, the oil temps aren't really elevated and regular oil had no problems. For a daily driver, I always lean towards very frequent regular oil changes rather than a longer extended synthetic oil change. I change the oil every 2500 miles... Worked for me, and made my wallet happy
I'd skip the JR thermostat.. I purchased one and it failed within months. Quality was cheap, and I noticed no change in water temp. My car actually ran better with the OEM thermostat, and IMO, it is the best one you can get. A new OEM thermostat will be my choice.
I actually ran regular 5w-30 oil since the engine was new... Since it's not a turbo, the oil temps aren't really elevated and regular oil had no problems. For a daily driver, I always lean towards very frequent regular oil changes rather than a longer extended synthetic oil change. I change the oil every 2500 miles... Worked for me, and made my wallet happy
08-03-2005, 01:28 AM
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Re: Looking to Supercharge a 1999 Honda Civic EX sedan for street use. I sure could use some recomm
I'll let you know how the Thermal Stealth Cat-back system sounds. Since I'm still waiting for the Jackson racing Supercharger to get back in stock, I've decided not to wait any longer to get the Cat-back installed.
Thanks for the recommendation on the thermostat. I wasn't aware JR's was crap. I can always just run my stock thermostat and look into changing it out if temperatures (detonation) become a problem. I'm going to do a full cooling system flush anyway and refill with 20% anti-freeze and 80% distilled water - with the redline Water wetter additive. Supposedly this mix will run cooler than a 50/50 anti-freeze to water mix, and since I live in California, I don't have to worry about freezing temperatures.
We're running 5w-30 motor oil right now and the oil and filter gets changed every 3,500 miles without fail. Even if I do switch to synthetic oil, I'll still be changing the oil and filter at 3,500 miles. It's a habit I go into years ago and it has worked out very well for me with all of my vehicles. There is only 25,000 miles on this vehicle anyway and with the care it has received to date everything it tight and right. I just want to keep it that way.
What do you think about a transmission fluid cooler? Any recommendations on what type/brand/size I should look for? I'm definitely going to be adding a transmission fluid cooler to this vehicle - especially since we live in such a hilly city with nothing but stop and go driving. I can't find any good info on an after-market torque converter for our Civic so I guess I'll just get a transmission fluid cooler installed and just concentrate on keeping the auto-transmission fluid temps as cool as possible.
I'm also seriously considering adding a few more Jackson Racing Supercharger accessories to this Supercharger project. I'm considering their Boost Timing Controller, VTEC Controller, MAP Sensor Controller - in addition to the JR High Performance Fuel Pump. Those add-ons are going to bump the price of this project up real fast, but I want to do this project right the first time. I'm also thinking about the JR Liquid Intercooler System, but at $600 plus tax, I'm going to hold off to see if I really need it.
Well, that looks like what I'm going to end up having done with this project. I just can't believe I've been waiting over a month to be able to order the Supercharger and fuel pump.
Thanks for all of the help and advice so far. I appreciate any and all help and advice I can get.
If anyone else has any advice or recommendations, I'd appreciate hearing them.
JR
Thanks for the recommendation on the thermostat. I wasn't aware JR's was crap.
I can always just run my stock thermostat and look into changing it out if temperatures (detonation) become a problem. I'm going to do a full cooling system flush anyway and refill with 20% anti-freeze and 80% distilled water - with the redline Water wetter additive. Supposedly this mix will run cooler than a 50/50 anti-freeze to water mix, and since I live in California, I don't have to worry about freezing temperatures.We're running 5w-30 motor oil right now and the oil and filter gets changed every 3,500 miles without fail. Even if I do switch to synthetic oil, I'll still be changing the oil and filter at 3,500 miles. It's a habit I go into years ago and it has worked out very well for me with all of my vehicles. There is only 25,000 miles on this vehicle anyway and with the care it has received to date everything it tight and right. I just want to keep it that way.
What do you think about a transmission fluid cooler? Any recommendations on what type/brand/size I should look for? I'm definitely going to be adding a transmission fluid cooler to this vehicle - especially since we live in such a hilly city with nothing but stop and go driving. I can't find any good info on an after-market torque converter for our Civic so I guess I'll just get a transmission fluid cooler installed and just concentrate on keeping the auto-transmission fluid temps as cool as possible.
I'm also seriously considering adding a few more Jackson Racing Supercharger accessories to this Supercharger project. I'm considering their Boost Timing Controller, VTEC Controller, MAP Sensor Controller - in addition to the JR High Performance Fuel Pump. Those add-ons are going to bump the price of this project up real fast, but I want to do this project right the first time. I'm also thinking about the JR Liquid Intercooler System, but at $600 plus tax, I'm going to hold off to see if I really need it.
Well, that looks like what I'm going to end up having done with this project. I just can't believe I've been waiting over a month to be able to order the Supercharger and fuel pump.
Thanks for all of the help and advice so far. I appreciate any and all help and advice I can get.
If anyone else has any advice or recommendations, I'd appreciate hearing them.
JR
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