RedEj8

Just got done installing a drag3 kit on my friends gsr. We were happy to see a tial 38 was included with the kit instead of the deltagate. The inline fuel pump setup and fmu is a little iffy but hes planning on getting some REAL fuel management pretty soon. The only thing we really had a problem with is there is no way in hell the intake pipe/filter is going to fit in there with the stock fan. We had to trim the shroud to clear the compressor and then trim the damn blades of the fan!.They must think you're going to install a slim fan anyways (which he is now.) Oh and the hot side piping hangs pretty close to the ground.Other than that, it looks like a pretty nice kit for the money. Oh and these instructions really helped https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=635014!


Modified by reddohcvtec at 7:59 PM 5/27/2006

RedEj8

His car just started acting a little weird. When it gets into boost it starts to chatter and cut out and doesnt want to accelerate anymore so he has to let out of it. A tuner told him it was probably detonation so now he's scared to drive it. He has iridium plugs gapped to .030. My guess was the little vacuum line that the FMU is hooked to probably isnt big enough to support the FUM,BOV, and FPR all hooked to it. The wastegate is T'd to the Brake booster line. Any ideas?
Right now hes got a plan to ditch the inline fuel pump and get an in tank 255, 440 injectors and a chipped p72 and get it dyno tuned. I just dont see why it wont run right as is out of the box and 7 or 8 psi, whatever it is.

Spec R

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by reddohcvtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">His car just started acting a little weird. When it gets into boost it starts to chatter and cut out and doesnt want to accelerate anymore so he has to let out of it. A tuner told him it was probably detonation so now he's scared to drive it. He has iridium plugs gapped to .030. My guess was the little vacuum line that the FMU is hooked to probably isnt big enough to support the FUM,BOV, and FPR all hooked to it. The wastegate is T'd to the Brake booster line. Any ideas?
Right now hes got a plan to ditch the inline fuel pump and get an in tank 255, 440 injectors and a chipped p72 and get it dyno tuned. I just dont see why it wont run right as is out of the box and 7 or 8 psi, whatever it is.</TD></TR></TABLE>

whoa, the chattering is definitely not good. can u describe it in more detail?

i have all my vacuum lines tee'd off of one reference, with no problems. unless you're running some faulty vacuum lines or tee's, you shouldnt be having problems either.

RedEj8

Well yea the chattering feels weird. I havnt drove it but ive been in the passenger seat and it really feels like wheel hop but not that bad and its not the wheels spinning. He hasnt taken it anywhere near redline and right when the boost hits it starts doing this, like the ingition is cutting out. We didnt touch the timing either,should we take some timing out of it? The only CEL is one for no evap cannister.

Spec R

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by reddohcvtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well yea the chattering feels weird. I havnt drove it but ive been in the passenger seat and it really feels like wheel hop but not that bad and its not the wheels spinning. He hasnt taken it anywhere near redline and right when the boost hits it starts doing this, like the ingition is cutting out. We didnt touch the timing either,should we take some timing out of it? The only CEL is one for no evap cannister.</TD></TR></TABLE>

That sounds like detonation to me man...whats the base timing at idle set at ?

.God.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by reddohcvtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">His car just started acting a little weird. When it gets into boost it starts to chatter and cut out and doesnt want to accelerate anymore so he has to let out of it. A tuner told him it was probably detonation so now he's scared to drive it. He has iridium plugs gapped to .030. My guess was the little vacuum line that the FMU is hooked to probably isnt big enough to support the FUM,BOV, and FPR all hooked to it. The wastegate is T'd to the Brake booster line. Any ideas?
Right now hes got a plan to ditch the inline fuel pump and get an in tank 255, 440 injectors and a chipped p72 and get it dyno tuned. I just dont see why it wont run right as is out of the box and 7 or 8 psi, whatever it is.</TD></TR></TABLE>

your problems most likely are being caused by iridium plugs combined with the FMU making the car run WAY too rich. Detonation won't normally cause the car to bog or "chatter" detonation just makes the "small rocks in a tin can" sound then kills your engine.

Get it on the P72 ASAP, until then just stay out of boost. It will run worlds better when you make the switch.


EDIT: get some factory copper plugs in there asap

093turbo16

iTrader: (2)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .God. &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

your problems most likely are being caused by iridium plugs combined with the FMU making the car run WAY too rich. Detonation won't normally cause the car to bog or "chatter" detonation just makes the "small rocks in a tin can" sound then kills your engine.

Get it on the P72 ASAP, until then just stay out of boost. It will run worlds better when you make the switch.


EDIT: get some factory copper plugs in there asap</TD></TR></TABLE>

If you have a severe lean condition in boost.. it surely will bog and feel like complete ****. Ditch that FMU setup and follow everyones and your thought of switching to a chipped ecu and get it tuned.

Blaze45

Try gapping the plugs to about .028. What your descibing sounds like your getting spark blowout, I was getting it at only 7psi with a very rich basemap tune. There isnt really any sure way for anyone on here to tell if you are deatonating or getting spark blowout. The sure fire way is to get the thing on a wideband and figure out whats going on. Pull a few degrees of timing and fill up with 93. Should be good to go if the drag kit FMU came with the proper disc. Give it a shot and let us know.

hondaeg8

here's what you need to try:

get some Bkr7e's spark plugs
take out 1 degree of timing via the distributor
put the highest octane you have in your area in the gas tank

the kit should run good, but a little rich right out the box with stock boost. thats what the kit is made for. just seems like you forgot some things as i mentioned you should do. the drag kit out the box will run pretty well at stock boost levels with the fmu and you shouldn't have any problems. i would get a walbro fuel pump as well for just to be a little safe.

i just installed the same kit on my gsr motor, so let me know if you have any questions.

RedEj8

Thanks for the replies guys. We're going to try a few things like getting some new plugs cause his are pretty old and i never looked at his spark plugs so i dont know what they looked like or anything and try pulling some timing out. He's also running nology hotwires but its not my car. Im gonna try to find someone around here with a wideband so i can see whats going on.

b16adx

When i installed my drag kit on my gsr I could never get it to run right out of the box no matter what i did for some reason. I had to break down and get 550cc injectors and tuned before i wanted to but i ended up with 300hp stock block at 10psi.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by reddohcvtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> The only thing we really had a problem with is there is no way in hell the intake pipe/filter is going to fit in there with the stock fan. We had to trim the shroud to clear the compressor and then trim the damn blades of the fan!.They must think you're going to install a slim fan anyways (which he is now.)
Modified by reddohcvtec at 7:59 PM 5/27/2006</TD></TR></TABLE>

I had to go to autozone and get one of those universal 12in fans and mount it to the FRONT of my radiator. Even with the slimline fans i still couldnt fit the filter and pipe on there but with the fan in front I have plenty of room

Treblarefils

heres my b16 with drag turbo kit and yes it is a very tight fit with everything especially by the fan area

Spec R

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Treblarefils &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">heres my b16 with drag turbo kit and yes it is a very tight fit with everything especially by the fan area


</TD></TR></TABLE>


NICE. why did u ditch the AC though.

Treblarefils

eventually i will be getting a non ac compatible manifold anyway so it doesnt matter...I never used the ac when i had it...car is not a daily driver...

Urugly

wow...that kits looks nice though....let us know if you were able to fix it... I have a Drag kit not installed and want to see what fixes people come up with so I know when I install mine.

turbodan4

Has anyone mentioned the map sensor as a culprit to the problem. Is your friend running at least some sort of map bypass on his car because my friend thought he could get away without using one when i installed his kit and he car did the same kind of bogging. Yeah i know stock honda map sensors can read up to 11 psi but not without some kind of reflash because the stock computer wont read the boost it will make the car run crappy as hell.

RedEj8

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by turbodan4 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Has anyone mentioned the map sensor as a culprit to the problem. Is your friend running at least some sort of map bypass on his car because my friend thought he could get away without using one when i installed his kit and he car did the same kind of bogging. Yeah i know stock honda map sensors can read up to 11 psi but not without some kind of reflash because the stock computer wont read the boost it will make the car run crappy as hell. </TD></TR></TABLE>

yea the kit came with a blox missing link or whatever blox calls their thing. And he says he installed it the way the instructions said, with the little pin hole at the top.

RedEj8

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b16adx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">When i installed my drag kit on my gsr I could never get it to run right out of the box no matter what i did for some reason. I had to break down and get 550cc injectors and tuned before i wanted to but i ended up with 300hp stock block at 10psi.
I had to go to autozone and get one of those universal 12in fans and mount it to the FRONT of my radiator. Even with the slimline fans i still couldnt fit the filter and pipe on there but with the fan in front I have plenty of room </TD></TR></TABLE>

Damn thats odd, i think thats what we're gonna end up having to do in order to get his to run right.

.God.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by reddohcvtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thanks for the replies guys. We're going to try a few things like getting some new plugs cause his are pretty old and i never looked at his spark plugs so i dont know what they looked like or anything and try pulling some timing out. He's also running nology hotwires but its not my car. Im gonna try to find someone around here with a wideband so i can see whats going on.</TD></TR></TABLE>


AHHHH get rid of those ASAP!!! I had a misfire too when I first went turbo a few years ago and I was using nology's. Everytime I would hit 5 psi it would bog very badly...after a few hours of trying to fix it I swapped on my 80K mile OEM wires and the misfire was instantly gone. I think those wires do way more bad than good.

Get some OEM wires and plugs on there and I bet your problem will be solved, but still go chipped ecu as soon as possible.

RedEj8

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .God. &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


AHHHH get rid of those ASAP!!! I had a misfire too when I first went turbo a few years ago and I was using nology's. Everytime I would hit 5 psi it would bog very badly...after a few hours of trying to fix it I swapped on my 80K mile OEM wires and the misfire was instantly gone. I think those wires do way more bad than good.

Get some OEM wires and plugs on there and I bet your problem will be solved, but still go chipped ecu as soon as possible.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Alrite put in new plugs and wires today. NGK copper v power's(NKR7E's i believe) gapped to.030, oem wires.
In 1st gear it doesnt break up at all to 8k, then it does in 2nd & 3rd only in boost. Took the plugs out and the ends were white(lean?), so i gapped them to .028 and he drives it and it does the same thing in 2nd so he parks it. Oh and he got a slim fan we installed as a pusher so the intake pipe and filter are on now.

Tonight he's gonna order some stuff, the conversion harness(socketed p72 he will get when he goes to the tuner),GE vac. mani and fittings, and a boost guage.I think hes going to use the inline fuel pump thats installed already for the time being, and he has some ford 440(+-10) that he got from a turbo kit meant for a SER Spec V and he's gotta figure out if they are saturated or peak and hold before he installs them..


Modified by reddohcvtec at 10:24 AM 5/30/2006

RedEj8

So yea, it runs pretty much perfect through 1st gear. But in any other gear under boost it still feels like its breaking up and jerking. I dont see why 1st gear is fine but not in any other gear?? Maybe i should gap the plugs to .025 now?

elpiar

must be something to do with the fuel system not keeping up. Go with 440cc and uberdata

Spec R

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by reddohcvtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">So yea, it runs pretty much perfect through 1st gear. But in any other gear under boost it still feels like its breaking up and jerking. I dont see why 1st gear is fine but not in any other gear?? Maybe i should gap the plugs to .025 now?</TD></TR></TABLE>

the 1st gear phenomenon is actually a good sign that its boost related. in first gear a lot of turbo honda's do NOT develop boost, because there is little load (similar to free revving at a standstill)...

some guys can boost completely, while others partially (like me...i can get maybe 4-5psi before it slams into the rev limiter), then while others cant boost at all.

Dc4turbo408

Really like your engine.. ******* clean..

ramennoodles

did you retard the timing on the distributor? Try retard of about 3 degrees