Dorkenheimer

So before I went to bed last nite, I was thinking: Do they make ITB's for turbo applications? If not, do you guys think it would be practical to do so? What would the advantages/disadvantages be? Just some food for thought, lemme know what you guys think.

Schister66

it has already been done.....Tony the Tiger beat you to it

QuarterMileMaster

It's been done with a skyline type intake manifold where there's ITB's connected to a plenum but there's never been anything where the ITB's are individually supplied with "force inducted" air. I tried to think of a way to do this but there's no way to insure that each runner to each ITB will get the same amount of air...

tony413

skyline
pulser gti
supra
and a few other cars already utilize this ideal and it works great for them. if you search you will see some good pics on here

Dorkenheimer

yeah see thats what i was thinking would happen. if the air ran through a plenum before the TB's it would essentially have the same effect as a normal intake manifold, right? And I was also kinda wonderin if this had ever been done on a honda. but skyline, honda psshh....same difference....

QuarterMileMaster

Well, Tony1 made a ITB/Plenum intake manifold setup on his motor. I would think it'd still work better than a traditional style intake manifold because of the built in velocity stacks at least will decrease turbulance and allow better air flow. I'm sure there's better aspects, I just don't know them.

tokesGTR

GT-R's had ITB's. I'm thinking this is to help with the mid range and throttle response, and don't see how this wouldn't help the same issues on an aftermarket turbo car.

Kind of a bad picture, but you can notice the turbos feed through the IC into one big fat plenum and then into 6 throttle bodies.

Alfa Turbo

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by QuarterMileMaster &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> I tried to think of a way to do this but there's no way to insure that each runner to each ITB will get the same amount of air...</TD></TR></TABLE>

Think of the pressurized air like water, it will seek it's own level, therefore each TB will get equal pressure all the time, as do the individual runners in a single TB setup.

drumking15

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Alfa Turbo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Think of the pressurized air like water, it will seek it's own level, therefore each TB will get equal pressure all the time, as do the individual runners in a single TB setup.</TD></TR></TABLE>
not true...if this were the case then many can stop engineering intake manifold because the airis automatically going to distribute evenly....

one key thing i think you missing is that each runner isnt always open (intake valves on that port) at the same time...this creates resonance frequencies in the intake manifold...and what your tryin to utilized to make the air go where you want....

QuarterMileMaster

This is what I was orignally thinking when the idea came to mind but wouldn't work due to what's posted above.

lambertincorp

also done on lexus is300

CRX T-Si

Wow, I would like to see how the collector is designed for something like that.

I guess it will be full alluminum pipes 1.75-2" in diamater depending on your needs.

pumafeet10

im sorry but when did they ever puit itbs on a toyota 2jz motor? def not in the is300 or supra. im pretty sure it wasn't done on the 1jz, 7mgte, or anything else.

Alfa Turbo

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by drumking15 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
not true...if this were the case then many can stop engineering intake manifold because the airis automatically going to distribute evenly....

one key thing i think you missing is that each runner isnt always open (intake valves on that port) at the same time...this creates resonance frequencies in the intake manifold...and what your tryin to utilized to make the air go where you want....</TD></TR></TABLE>

I am sorry OEP, you are simply wrong on this. Think of it another way... how will you STOP pressurized air from flowing? As soon as the intake valve opens and there is pressure behind it the air will flow. This is why ITB's are more responsive to throttle inputs, the air has less distance to travel, hence quicker action.

And, most certainly, pressurized air will seek equilibrium, were it not the case our turbos would not work!

drumking15

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Alfa Turbo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I am sorry OEP, you are simply wrong on this. Think of it another way... how will you STOP pressurized air from flowing? As soon as the intake valve opens and there is pressure behind it the air will flow. This is why ITB's are more responsive to throttle inputs, the air has less distance to travel, hence quicker action.

And, most certainly, pressurized air will seek equilibrium, were it not the case our turbos would not work!</TD></TR></TABLE>
true but i was clearifying a person's post as to why a intake mani will not have equaly distrubution....ill agree w/ the point on itb providing a quicker response time because yes...the air has a lesser distance to travel blah blah blah....

and if you think each cylinder is going to seek equilbirum under pressure...you wrong...eddy currents in the flow will effect each's flow volumne inside a standrad plenum manifold...and the pulses coming from the intake valves timing will dictate what you want as a hermortlz resonance frequency (sp? dont have my fluids book on hand)and therfore the length / sizing of the runners will be dictated by the motors flow cap. etc...

so yes itb's will improve throttle response....yet the plenum/runners must be designed in order to balance the flows across all cylinders...or else youll have one cylinder making more power than an other...and cylinders running hotter than one another....this is why even a well designed manifold will result in different output egts/ dif cylinders...and also why tuners tweak ind cylinder fuel trims to balance it out as much as possible...

doood

iTrader: (1)

tony the tiger's plenum design: https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1394232

STREETWERKZ

amazing engine bay.

tony413

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pumafeet10 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">im sorry but when did they ever puit itbs on a toyota 2jz motor? def not in the is300 or supra. im pretty sure it wasn't done on the 1jz, 7mgte, or anything else.</TD></TR></TABLE>

powerhouse makes them for the 2JZ about $2200-$3500 a pop nice parts

miata

ITB with a plendulum and secondary injectors over the horns of ITB's, this is my dream setup for intake. Just like mechanical injection

pumafeet10

ok i know they make them for the motor aftermarket, i was saying more that they didn't come on the motor stock