Youlose1305

Ok sorry if this subject has been covered before but I will be purchasing a b18b block and it has scarring on the walls so i would need to bore it out to 81.5 mm and I was wondering if i had a block guard installed how much boost could i safely run with the cylinder walls being that much thinner for a daily driver?? what would be the best way to do the setup?? thanks

Youlose1305

^^^^^^^^^

boostedcivicsir

block guards are old tech, i still think they are viable, but i know of a few tuners that say w/ or w/o them there isnt really a difference except coolant flow. a good tune either way will net the same result. i was 81.5mm on my b16 and the piston melted at high boost. the sleeve was fine. im not saying that all the time the piston will melt, but a good tune, w/ or w/o the block guard will be fine. just trust your tuner.

Youlose1305

so your saying in your opinion that the guard is not worth the time and money??? I was looking at sleeves but not sure how much that would all cost, so just getting some right info.......thanks

swappedcx

Im running no blockguard on 81.5mm stock sleeves. If you want to sleeve, look into prices and take into consideration shipping charges there and back and if they do final bore/hone as well. I listened to my tuner (jeff evans) and went by what he reccomended to me. And for MY NEEDS with my motor he said I should be fine with what I want for the length of time I want. Ill be running 400whp daily, and 600 maybe once every month or two at the track. Ill be running mid to high 20psi on my sc6176s to get to 600whp range

Youlose1305

really that much psi on just stock sleeves??? what block are you using??

swappedcx

Yes, its a ls block and im using a 00 si b16 head. I know someone is going to come in here and disagree with me on this. But IMO my tuners opinion is more important than what others on the internet say, seeing as how me and the tuner will be the only ones ever working on this car.

Here is a brief quote from some of my pm's with jeff (who by the way is a awsome guy, bar none)
"Thanks Jeff, I just picked up a turbo and look forward to my tune date. The only thing that worries me if I should sleeve or not. I know you like Justice Racing, I was planning on going with Benson if i did sleeve. I have almost everyone who hears my setup telling me to go sleeved block but i'm not sure if its really needed. Its a ls-vtec with stock 99 si b16 head with SuperTech valve train and GSR cams. I picked up some Wiseco 9.5:1 81.50mm pistons because i wasn't sure if i'm sleeving or just boring it slightly over on the stock sleeves... I want to run in the 400whp range daily, and I want to see 600whp on the dyno just to know what the car can make. I do not plan to really run the car at the 600whp range much but who knows, i might get the urge to one day at the track... I'm just looking for advice from you and what you would do in a situation like this. "

his reply...(again we were chatting about this before, but this is what he said in response to this) "You dont need to sleeve the motor for the power that you want to make. It will last. Just make sure that you have adequate piston to wall clearance."

Youlose1305

i appreciate all the input!!!

jDMJeRk

Block guards do work... I have one, I had it installed properly which is 100% of the reason why it works! You CAN NOT just drop them in.

I made 425whp on 14psi on stock sleeves 81.5m b16 on C16 and it's still holding up fine...

Youlose1305

Ya i know that it takes some time to fit those things in.......................lots of fighting.............i know they must help to an extent since they make the top of the walls more solid but from what the others said i may just not waste my time on it...............just getting an idea

b18sihatch

block guards arent like Sleeves, you are still using OEM sleeves, so they dont improve steructural integrity of the block, only ductile iron sleeves will do that.

imo they are worthless

Youlose1305

well i thought the guards would act as if they are like a solid deck??? i must be mistaking then

b18sihatch

a solid deck doesnt meant structural integrity.

the sleeves are still makeout of aluminum and not ductile iron.

sleeves are thicker and made of iron, meaning they are better lol

Youlose1305

ya ok i get what your saying now...........so really how much psi could i run with no sleeves and guard with no concern really?

b18sihatch

honestly.

psi isnt the concern.

set a goal (realistic) and go for it

product choice ie: turbo ,manifold ect all play a roll in reliability

and as far as blocks are concerned.......engine management is key and tune is prime key

Youlose1305

ok sounds like a plan..........so what do i need to decide when picking a turbo setup??? differnt setups for different uses??

0morgan@synapse motorsport

u need to first decide how much power you want to make then take it from there.

Youlose1305

well i guess it all depends on how much money will be coming towards me............but if i could make power at least to 300 whp that would prolly be enough..........with a b-series that sounds rather reasonable doesnt it?? daily driver is all i want out of this nothing to extreme............

b18sihatch

300 is probably pheasable, but remember tuning and EMS and fuel management is key to a relieable running motor

sleeves will be fin under xxx ammount of whp

its the pistons and rods you have to worry about. thats why tuning is key, you dont want to lean everything and melt a piston, so proper tuning and ems and fms is a must

envee

yea im looking for about 350whp on my stock b series, after some block work (honing, balancing, things of this nature). i've been debating on a block guard. looks like from this thread it is completely unness. to use one.

Youlose1305

so when buying the pistons, i will want to purchase forged ones correct?? Eagle H-beams would be strong enough as well?? This guy has a shop in my area and for some motors he has sent the ecu's to a company (not sure what they are called) but they made a chip that was exactly for everything in the motor, can you do something like and add (hondata, Crome, ect..)?? or just better to leave the ecu untouched and go with a tuning program??

b18sihatch

correct forged internals.

but please also dont become vauge to a rebuild lol, it could run into some money.

forged pistons 350.00
forged h beam rods 250.00
machine work 350-450+ (dpends on work done)
gasket set 100.00
bearing set 130.00

thats a simple build could run you between 1100-1200 dollars. and that is very vauge too, could be more and thats to built JUST the bottom end to support xxx ammount of power. if i were to build a simple short block i wouldnt think i could get away with it for less than 1500+ because it really depends on the rods you use and pistons some rods are 7-800 for some 5-600 some pistons are 3-550 it all depends on prefrences ect

me personally i have around 6k in my short block alone. its
sleeved
je pistons
Crower Pro H beam rods
acl rod bearings
acl main bearings
a shitload of machine work (thats where it could run you into some money)

as far as the tuning its really self choice, some people go with a stand alone engine management, and alot go with chipped and tuned or dyno tuned ecu, just a matter of how deep your pockets are i guess.

Youlose1305

Ya I definately know that the build could get pretty expensive especially with b-series......now what about the head??? would that need to be highly built or just more of a preference??

b18sihatch

well IMO boost is very addicting, and once you have a short block built for boost.

you are going to be able to play with psi levels and whp levels. a head build would be a good thing to get out of the way now.

if you could i would do.

oem camshafts
dual valve springs
dished ss valves
titanium retainers
small valve job
mild to moderate port and polish work (again depends on pockets)

you would hate to drop a valve in your new built block lol

man it is such a journey when first starting out building something and then getting towards a finished product.... lol dont elt it get you down

Youlose1305

I'm just too anxious with everything!! lol...........so how did you decide on which size turbo to use and all that??