earl

"X" marks the spot where you install Pioneer EPC 108 (15/32") freeze plugs. All 5 must be installed about 1/4" down the hole so that there is room for the main bearing dowel pins to fit in the hole also. You can see the plugs have already been installed in this pix.


"O" marks the spot where you must tap deep inside with an 1/8" pipe tap. After tapping and cleaning, install an allen 1/8" plug. Use a little loctite on it for good luck. Don't get cute here and try a freeze plug on this hole as it will cut off the oil supply to the main bearings


"Y" marks the spot in the "H" oil pump where you install a Dorman 565-029 (1 37/64" ) freeze plug


I use the OEM cover on the other side of the pump with the balance shaft removed from it. This is used because of the timing belt cover mount at "A" that is necessary.


Doing this modification will increase oil volume and pressure available to the rest of the motor as well as save you around 10 pounds of engine weight. You will also pick up some free power by not having to spin the shafts.
I would love to hear from anyone who has removed their shafts to see if they noticed any more vibration. I always suggest to have your crank balanced at the same time as doing this mod.

JDMCRX

iTrader: (2)

Nice write up EARL

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

Earl always has the best tech info.

Alstare

I just put the shafts back in but didn't hook up the belts when I built my new motor, works the same, but this is alot nicer and cleaner way I wish I would of done it.

Good write up...

H23vtecEG

yeah i've been riding like that for a while now. the car idles and runs great. very little vibration at idle but tunning took care of it. it vibrates just a little bit more but you wont even notice it really. im very happy with mibe. i did the same thing and pluged the wholes. i also pluged the little holes on the right balance shaft gear housing. where the O was i got an aluminum plug i made at work that went all the way down i pounded the living crap out of it lol but it worked out pluging the balance shaft hole but leaving the cranck main and oil squirter hole open.

earl

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by H23vtecEG &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> i also pluged the little holes on the right balance shaft gear housing</TD></TR></TABLE> I just could not see any reason to plug that hole when using the stock cover...but I was tempted to plug it anyway. I think it feeds from the closest cam bearing and that bearing was plugged.

h22 civic

i didnt close any of the little holes where the shaft bearings are but i did put a freeze out plug in the balance shaft front and i cut the other balance shaft just a little and put it back un the pully like normal

topsekret

Good writeup...I eliminated my shafts when I built my motor using Hondaddict's billet plugs for the oil pump and by pressing out the bearings and reinserting them 90* out. Here's a pic of his plugs:



For anyone interested in arguing about their removal check out this thread https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=503372 in the prelude forum where it was hashed out awhile back.

I'll put my 2cents in...mine have been gone for 12K and with a balanced rotating assembly I'd bet most that ride in my car wouldn't know they were missing. The engine also feels "lighter" ...almost like the difference of adding a lightened flywheel.

--Ian

clendaniel

^^^^^^^^^^^^

That was me...stinkin' friends using my laptop and not loggin out.

--Ian

zad5

earl you definitely know more than me but wouldnt it. mess with the harmonics of hte motor....im confused cuz i always thought it did so it doesnt. and why did honda put it in if it was going to be dead weight.

bambooluv

Earl have you and MIke finally seen the light and going prelude in the new car? praise the lord -pdang

clendaniel

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by zad5 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">earl you definitely know more than me but wouldnt it. mess with the harmonics of hte motor....im confused cuz i always thought it did so it doesnt. and why did honda put it in if it was going to be dead weight.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I didn't post that link for my health...

The shafts are to counteract second order harmonics and provide passenger comfort...their removal doesn't harm the engine. If you've balanced everything correctly when the motor's built you'll never notice the difference...trust me.

--Ian

Arturbo

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bambooluv &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Earl have you and MIke finally seen the light and going prelude in the new car? praise the lord -pdang</TD></TR></TABLE>
No, K-series.

earl

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by zad5 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> and why did honda put it in if it was going to be dead weight.</TD></TR></TABLE>That is really a good question for which I don't have an answer. That is why I'm asking for everyone's experiences with balance shaft removal.

earl

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b18vtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I eliminated my shafts when I built my motor by pressing out the bearings and reinserting them 90* out. </TD></TR></TABLE> Yeah that way will work also but working with those cam bearings can be a real hassle. Freeze plugs install quickly

PrecisionH23a

I just did the balance shaft removal as well on my "new" set-up. I did not have the plugs do replace the dowel pins, but instead I removed the balance shaft bearings, removed the 'tangs' and rotated them 90-180 degrees to block all passing oil. It's a real pain in the *** to do it that way in case you were wondering. Just curious earl, the plugs you used... are they aluminum or steel?








I had the COMPLETE bottom rotating assembly balance and I will also be running the fluidamper harmonic balancer when it is released soon (the balance shafts are not really related to this however.... they are not that detrimental). I'll have her up and running by monday after I am finished with installing another customer's fully built h23 tomorrow.

As far as power gains, Joel (satan_srv) cut his balancer shaft belt on the dyno and picked up maybe 3-4whp I believe on a fully built NA h22a. Every little bit helps.

As far as the rear balancer gear is involved, yes you have to run them to promote the proper 'seal' for the oil pump housing.... but I think i'll have something to fix that soon.

Remember, Less clutter = more girls

JDogg

we have been running with out the balancer belt for a little over 12k miles, including a 2000 mile road trip crusing 80-90mph for hours on end. no problems here. ther is a bit of vibration around 3200rpms but nothing bothersome. if the motor was in a prelude you probably wouldnt notice.. we are turning this thing to 8500 rpms

FredoSP

wow, great write up Earl - I just learned a few things!!

earl

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PrecisionH23a &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I did not have the plugs do replace the dowel pins</TD></TR></TABLE>
You do not need to replace the dowel pins as long as you knock the 5 freeze plugs down deeper than the exposed length of main cap dowel pin. Those plugs are only available in aluminum.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PrecisionH23a &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">As far as the rear balancer gear is involved, yes you have to run them to promote the proper 'seal' for the oil pump housing.... but I think i'll have something to fix that soon. </TD></TR></TABLE>Let me know what you come up with. I noticed you used the aluminum plug in that hole also. I would assume that plug is not necessary when using the cover?

0mtber

iTrader: (2)

Good stuff.

JDMs1eeper

I had this done to my prelude H23A back in 2001 when i rebuilt it. Does save about 10lbs. We pulled one balancer shaft out and plugged it and left the other one in but didnt have it hooked up. Thier was no extra viberation that i noticed but the car responded very well to the freshly rebuilt H23 with them not in use. The car was a 92 Prelude Si and ran 14.5 @ 95 all motor with only i/h/ test pipe /e. I'm sure that engine had a lot more potential. I sold the car tho... miss that thing

DLB1994

tried it ill never do it again

i was getting 80psi at idle when cold and 50psi at idle when hot and in boost was was getting over 140psi when hot

and my car would blue smoke in boost , i changed every thing to find out what it was and come to fine out the turbo just could not take that much oil psi

and i pulled every thing back apart and just put the **** back in and the car stoped smoking

JDM_JON

speaking of balancing shafts...i had one go out on an customers accord...the one closest to the front end....has anyone changed it without taking the engine out?

earl

Your situation sounds more like a stuck pressure relief valve in the oil pump than being caused by balance shaft removal. Doing this should not cause that big a jump in pressure or volume. How exactly did you make your mods?

PrecisionH23a

Nope, you cannot slide the front shaft out with the motor in the car, it will hit the frame of the car. If you customer wants to save money, just cut the belt and tell him it's fixed, lol.